Upgraded F40/50 Brembos On Gtr33

[JimX]

Ever had a pleasant surprise and dismay all rolled into one? That's what happened when I went to change the discs and pads on my GTR the other day, after having already bought factory sized rotors and pads. After removing the pads I discovered that I have upgraded brakes that I didn't know about and I've had the car for over a year now. Luckily I was able to get a refund, but now I'm kind of stuck. I have found a list of Brembo discs here - http://www.brembo.com/NR/rdonlyres/B059B96...schiinghisa.pdf

I believe I have an F40 or F50 caliper. The discs are 332x32mm (new size) and I have found 2 different Brembo discs which may suit, the main difference being the hat flange size. My discs seem to have too much of a gap between the inner flange and the hats. I know that there needs to be a gap there to allow for the different expansion rates of the aluminium and cast iron, but I have a a lot of free play there. More than is present in this photo - http://www.zeckhausen.com/Brembo/Rotor_Replacement.htm

Incidentally, the above site has an aftermarket disc which has the smaller flange diameter of 190mm. I haven't measured my hats yet, but so far it seems like the previous owner has put the larger flange diameter discs on (194mm) when it should have had the 190mm ones. But I don't know what the gap is meant to be around the edge. If it's meant to be 2mm then I won't be able to get these discs. But if it's less (as in, what it seems to be in the above link) then I think it'll be ok to get these discs.

Does anyone know what the replacement name/brand disc and hat is for these brakes and where I can get them?

Edit: I believe the Brembo part numbers I need to get are either 09.5682.70/80 or 09.5900.70/80 for the 190/194mm flange diameter respectively.

[Ronin 09]

I'm not sure I understand you JimX

They're a 10 bolt rotor so it's likely that the rotor will be avail from Brembo... the 12 bolt ones are AP and other manufacturers.

I got my AP rotors from Competition Friction in Sydney or Canberra... i forget - maybe give them a buzz 02 6226 8877

[JimX]

The easiest way to work out what I'm saying is if you download the Brembo disc catalogue from here - http://www.brembo.com/NR/rdonlyres/B059B96...schiinghisa.pdf (same as what I linked above) and go to pages 25 and 26, and play "spot the difference" between the 2 part numbers 09.5682.70 and 09.5900.70 by paging up and down between them. They're lined up with each other nicely so it's easy to do.

There are only 3 things different, the air gap, weight, and inner flange diameter. The last one is the only thing that will matter to fitting my old hats, because it's this part that the hat fits into. If the flange is too small, my hat won't fit. If it's too large, there will be too much free play or it might even slip down and get wedged in at an angle.

I will measure my hats again tonight or tomorrow when I have time to take the disc off again, but I think the only way this will give me a definitive answer is if I find that it's 191mm in diameter, which will obviously mean the 190mm flange disc is too small. If it's between 190 and 194mm though, then either disc will fit and I won't know if the smaller disc will be too tight or the larger disc too loose, or even if either disc will be fine.

[JimX]

Here is the pic I linked above, but I've put red circles around the "gap" I'm talking about. In this photo you can see that the hat sits pretty flush with the disc, but after I take photos of my disc, you'll see how much of a gap there is and I'm pretty sure it's a fair bit more.

[Beer Baron]

forget measuring the hats. providing you have had no problems with the current set-ups, measure the disks instead, then buy the same ones you have now. look around the edge of the rotor, there may even be a part number visible.

[djr81]

Look I may be WAAAAYY of target here, but the 332mm rotor I understand to match the F40 caliper. This setup is offered as a set for the Z32 rather than the R32 although from what I can gather it fits up. So maybe have a look at the part numbers for the 300ZX kit...

Cattledog:

http://www.brembo.com/CatalogoHPGT/Templat...T=NoModifyGuest

Disc code (Note slotted, not drilled - don't get drilled)

09.5682.92/93

Do you know how much the rotors are out of interest?

Also providing the disc offset is the same & the other diameters match as does the width you could get yourself a new hat & rotor from another manufacturer.

Edited June 21, 2007 by djr81

[JimX]

Beer Baron, I actually do have problems. The disc is making a strange metallic grinding noise. There's not metal being ground off though, all the adonizing is intact and no metal shavings are around. If not for that then I would do as you suggested. Also, I want to buy your nuts! Check your pm

djr81, I plan to get slotted only discs. The 332x32mm discs are $675 each including mounting kit from vsport, but the guy didn't specify which part number specifically so I would have to double check that with him either way. From the Zeckhausen site though, they are approximately half price including shipping from the US, so you can understand why I'd like to get the AeroRotors in preference if I am able to! But they only have the 190mm flange diameter.

It would even be worth me ditching my old hats completely and buying new ones to fit the Stoptech AeroRotor discs, it would end up being around the same price as buying the discs locally but I'd have brand new complete rotors. Unfortunately I have confirmed that Stoptech don't make a hat of the appropriate offset for the GTR. However Racebrakes in Sydney are able to build custom hats so I might check with them if it comes to that.

Maybe I should just go back to standard!

[Ronin 09]

they are rubbish jim, give them to me and I'll deal with the pain.

[djr81]

Beer Baron, I actually do have problems. The disc is making a strange metallic grinding noise. There's not metal being ground off though, all the adonizing is intact and no metal shavings are around. If not for that then I would do as you suggested. Also, I want to buy your nuts! Check your pm

If the thing is making grinding noises is it coming from worn pads or from something else.

djr81, I plan to get slotted only discs. The 332x32mm discs are $675 each including mounting kit from vsport, but the guy didn't specify which part number specifically so I would have to double check that with him either way. From the Zeckhausen site though, they are approximately half price including shipping from the US, so you can understand why I'd like to get the AeroRotors in preference if I am able to! But they only have the 190mm flange diameter.

So its $675 including hats, yes? Or just for the discs? Tony (?) from V-Sport is good value.

It would even be worth me ditching my old hats completely and buying new ones to fit the Stoptech AeroRotor discs, it would end up being around the same price as buying the discs locally but I'd have brand new complete rotors. Unfortunately I have confirmed that Stoptech don't make a hat of the appropriate offset for the GTR. However Racebrakes in Sydney are able to build custom hats so I might check with them if it comes to that.

If you can get one of the shops to make you some hats or know a milliner you can use a good range of rotors as the 332 x 32 size are very common (Read 13 inches by inch and a quarter). You can perhaps try Alcon & AP as they should have something similar. Did the Z32 part numbers match up as I noted before when looking around that the Stoptech R32 kit is the same as the Z32 kit...

Maybe I should just go back to standard!

If you want to sling us a PM for the bits as I would be interested.

[JimX]

Grinding noise is almost definitely not pads. The noise is more of a rotating kind of grinding/sliding noise that only happens at low speeds especially around corners (like, <10kph, driveway/intersection speeds) and it comes and goes as the wheel rotates (discs not warped at all, no pedal or vehicle shudder under braking) it goes away if I put the brakes on or if I hit normal road speeds. At first I thought it might be oddly damaged CV joints or the front diff or wheel bearings, but my mechanic checked and said it was the rotor assembly and said the disc was sitting too loose on the hats. Since the bolts are a single use item and the discs nearly run out, he said to get new discs and that'd fix the noise as well. He could be wrong I guess, but I think it's the most realistic diagnosis.

Vsport's price was not including hats, just the mounting bolts. I don't think $675 is overly expensive if he is using genuine Brembo discs, but that's why I'm more interested in the aftermarket AeroRotors. I couldn't find any info on the Z32 part numbers, but I'll see if I can find the offset dimensions ("annulus" measurement I think?) and measure what I have, and try to figure it out that way.

And I shall exhaust all my options before I sell them first I've still got half a mil left on the rotors and half the pad left, so as long as nothing goes bang in the meantime I've got a fair bit of time left to sort this out.

Edit: The guy from Vsport just got back to me, he said he's only familiar with the 190mm inner flange discs in the 332x32 size and they have fit all the Jap imports he's done so far. So it's looking good.

[Roy]

Ok. lots of guessing here. Rip the caliper off and measure the piston diameter to see if they are F40 or F50. Im saying they are F50 as the F40s normaly have small ribs along the side where they say Brembo. Yours does nto appear to have the ribs, so = F50. F50s can be used with std 324mm rotors, it all depends on which kit you get.

So this brings you to the rotor. LOL, its pretty simple actually Every Brembo rotor i have ever held in my hot little hand has its model number etched into the outer edge of the rotor. You may need a bit of emery paper or scothbrite to rub some of the corrosion off, but it shoudl not be hard to pick up a part number

[JimX]

Well I have previously measured the pistons, and came up with 35mm and 41mm, but that'd be slightly too small because I only measured the bit after the rubber boot ends which I think taper off. By how much I don't know, but it'd be a uniform size difference I imagine which I think means it's not the F50 because I think the F50 only has 4mm difference in size (40 and 44mm, figures taken from here - http://www.stealth316.com/2-brakeupgrade.htm). The F40 has 6mm size difference though (38 and 44mm). So that's more likely to be the F40, unless I have some weird arsed caliper which is smaller than both of these?! My calipers look pretty similar to this, which seems to be the F40 by the piston size but there's just a part number and no F40 or F50 name. http://www.prosystembrakes.com/20-4862-05-06.htm

I had another idea today. Everywhere I've searched seems to have the same Brembo kit for an R33 GTR, which is part number 1B2.8020A for slotted 355x32 rotors and the same or similar caliper as mine. If my caliper is the same or at least compatible (it seems to use the same pads at least) then maybe I could just buy the larger 355x32 discs and the brackets for the caliper? I have 18 inch wheels so it should all fit. The only thing there is I'd definitely need new hats, and the added cost of the brackets. But I'm already resigned to be spending well above my initial budget.

If I knew the factory rotors would fit then I probably would have kept them! But I thought the pad would overhang the edge of the disc. Also I didn't know if the offset would be the same and I didn't want to risk opening the package to find out (goodbye refund if it didn't work!)

I'll take my wheels off after I have dinner tonight I think, take more measurements and photos.

Oh lastly I don't think I'm going to find a Brembo part number on the discs because I don't think they're Brembo discs. But I'll have a look anyway.

[Angus Smart]

Ever had a pleasant surprise and dismay all rolled into one? That's what happened when I went to change the discs and pads on my GTR the other day, after having already bought factory sized rotors and pads. After removing the pads I discovered that I have upgraded brakes that I didn't know about and I've had the car for over a year now. Luckily I was able to get a refund, but now I'm kind of stuck. I have found a list of Brembo discs here - http://www.brembo.com/NR/rdonlyres/B059B96...schiinghisa.pdf

I believe I have an F40 or F50 caliper. The discs are 332x32mm (new size) and I have found 2 different Brembo discs which may suit, the main difference being the hat flange size. My discs seem to have too much of a gap between the inner flange and the hats. I know that there needs to be a gap there to allow for the different expansion rates of the aluminium and cast iron, but I have a a lot of free play there. More than is present in this photo - http://www.zeckhausen.com/Brembo/Rotor_Replacement.htm

Incidentally, the above site has an aftermarket disc which has the smaller flange diameter of 190mm. I haven't measured my hats yet, but so far it seems like the previous owner has put the larger flange diameter discs on (194mm) when it should have had the 190mm ones. But I don't know what the gap is meant to be around the edge. If it's meant to be 2mm then I won't be able to get these discs. But if it's less (as in, what it seems to be in the above link) then I think it'll be ok to get these discs.

Does anyone know what the replacement name/brand disc and hat is for these brakes and where I can get them?

Edit: I believe the Brembo part numbers I need to get are either 09.5682.70/80 or 09.5900.70/80 for the 190/194mm flange diameter respectively.

Hey mate,

i went through this a few weeks ago

go to gav sport at st marys with your rotor.

tell them its the f50 for gtr 32. same that they did a few weeks back. it will cost you arounds 1300 for two rotors with custom hat two piece job. but then replacment rotos are 300ish

that was the only place i could find any good after a few months of searching! with the problem of buying just the rotors from japan and hope they are the right ones. all i came close to was dixcel rotors that looked the same! and your rotor and hat you have now looks identicle to mine except the colour! 10 bolt two piece 332x32ish

good luck to you

Edited June 21, 2007 by Angus Smart

[Angus Smart]

oops, just realised you have a 33gtr

but you could still go to gav sport and give it a shot or specalised brake and clutch.. same shop at st marys

this is what they made for me

Edited June 22, 2007 by Angus Smart

[djr81]

It shouldn't matter whether it is an R32 or a 33. The offsets & dimension should be that same. Remember the Brembo gear supplied by Nissan (ie not the F40's, 50 etc) bolt up to both cars without a problem.

There are only two critical dimensions you need for a hat to be manufactured.

1. The thickness of the centre of the hat, ie the mounting face thickness. This is so your wheel sits right.

2. The offset of the rotor from the mounting face. In plan view this basically defines how much "offset' the rotor has. It need to be accurate to about 0.5mms. This allows the rotor to sit in the middle of the caliper, not off to one side.

After that as long as you have the right rotor thickness, od & enough radial depth for the pad to wipe on you are away. Anything else is the suppliers problem eg how many bolts the hat uses etc.

Lastly I still would put money on this being the 1B2.7011A kit from the Z32.

[Adriano]

Just got a price for 356mm rotors and hats from Just Jap, for $495 ea, $990 for the lot to suit my gt3 porsche brembos

[Roy]

Hey mate,

i went through this a few weeks ago

go to gav sport at st marys with your rotor.

tell them its the f50 for gtr 32. same that they did a few weeks back. it will cost you arounds 1300 for two rotors with custom hat two piece job. but then replacment rotos are 300ish

that was the only place i could find any good after a few months of searching! with the problem of buying just the rotors from japan and hope they are the right ones. all i came close to was dixcel rotors that looked the same! and your rotor and hat you have now looks identicle to mine except the colour! 10 bolt two piece 332x32ish

good luck to you

Can i ask what brand of rotor they are using. Also confirm that they are 332 x 32mm thick? Have you given the brakes much of a work out, all good?

[JimX]

Thanks for all the info guys. Earlier today I decided to order just the 332mm AeroRotor discs from the US. The reason being that I am happy enough with my brakes the way they are (I was happy enough when I thought they were stock!), and I may as well take the chance that I can save some money if I don't have to buy new brackets and hats. If they do fit (and I'm 90% sure they will) then I'll spend the money I saved on some bigger injectors and/or a PowerFC tune which I've been meaning to do for a long time.

I will report how it goes after they arrive, hopefully this turns out to be a decent but still cheap alternative to the usual RDA and DBA discs.

[Roy]

Can i ask where you are sourcing them from and how much?

Im tossing up between 340 x 32mm PF rotors and the brembo based stuff

[JimX]

http://www.zeckhausen.com/

I'm getting the slotted left/right rotors (US$235) and titanium backing plates ($79) listed here - http://www.zeckhausen.com/StopTech/consumables.htm#Rotors

Freight with insurance was US$163, so with the current good exchange rate the total cost was almost spot on A$840. Even with the expensive shipping cost that's still pretty damn cheap.

There are other stores that sell Stoptech parts, the other one I was considering was http://performancenissanparts.com/ . Prices were virtually the same but it seemed to be harder to find things there, in fact I couldn't find any hats listed at all except as part of the full kits. I went with Zechausen because it has technical drawings of most things and it just seems to be a more complete and practical enthusiast store, without any fancy website bling.

Obviously I can't comment on the quality of the Stoptech products yet, but from researching on the web they seem to be a good quality but inexpensive brand and have lots of resellers. The co-owner of Zechausen Racing (Dave Zeckhausen) has been nothing but friendly and helpful in the several emails he's written back to me too despite changing my order once and then asking more questions about the Stoptech brake kits. He cautioned me to make sure I was getting the right discs, so even if they don't fit I wouldn't hold him responsible at all.

He also sells full Stoptech brake kits for our cars - http://www.zeckhausen.com/nissan_products.htm

No GTS-t/GTT Skyline kits listed but the 240SX (180) or 300ZX kit would probably fit.