Farken Thief

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

alright, im right royally pissed

story goes, i saw a picture of carbon fibre cooling panel being shipped in by a melbourne importer and paid $100 deposit to secure it, item is 2nd hand but i was assured there may be some minor scratches near the mounting holes

once it landed, i tried to organise pickup in melb by my bro (im in syd but not much longer if i have sort this chap out) and couldnt, so im assured he can courier it to me no problem, so i pay the additional courier fee and when it gets here, the carbon fibre panel is creased and looks like shit

i email the bloke and let him know its all screwed up right away with pics to show him, he says he didnt open the package when it got in from japan and just couriered it to me and now wont refund my damn money coz apparently its not his fault.. i tell him i bought it as advertised and not what he's trying to pass on to me

item was packaged with bubble wrap and nothing stiff to stop any flexing etc and he expects me to accept it as is.. on top of that, he is going to do me a good price for the next time i get something off him WTF??? for an additional $150 i could have bought a new one from nengun and he reckons my 20% saving is good for 2nd hand, regardless of the fact its f##ked up

i have given him till middle of next week to sort it out before i take action

what think ya'll?

bwt, here the business policy:

We are happy to exchange or offer credit notes

We will not refund if the customer:

- has simply changed their mind

- discovered the goods cheaper elsewhere

- knew about a particular fault before buying the goods

- damaged the goods by using them in a way they were not made for

- does not give us proof of purchase (receipt or bank statement)

-has item/s longer than 7 days from date received and find out it not suitable for his/her car.

none of the above applies to me as far as i can see

forgot to add, latest offer is for him to give me $50 and call it even, although i paid $420 all up

Edited November 5, 2010 by BWRGTR

[Mr Eps]

hate to play devils avocado here but is there any proof it's his fault? if not then how can you expect him to give money back? sorry to hear this has happened but this threads pretty mean.. to call business man a thief because you aren't happy is a bit cruel. you meanie.

[GTR-N1]

I've read over your Trader Rating comments and there are some credible people there.

If the business person is at fault, he'd have an ABN > lodge a small claims complaint on the basis that the goods are damaged or not as promised. Also cite that the condition of the goods are not within the 5 points he stated to qualify for non-refund. And cite just what condition the goods were meant to be in.

If he doesn't have an ABN, and thus a private seller, the 'caveat emptor' condition has you pinned down with nothing to do but wear it.

I'd ask for pics next time; and from every angle + top and bottom!

'Tis better to say that you've been wronged rather than state he's a "thief".

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

hate to play devils avocado here but is there any proof it's his fault? if not then how can you expect him to give money back? sorry to hear this has happened but this threads pretty mean.. to call business man a thief because you aren't happy is a bit cruel. you meanie.

what I have a beef with is that he is meant to be supplying me product that I paid for based on it's condition (2nd hand), he recieves it from japan, does not check it (he states this) and posts it to me, yes he might not have been aware it was damaged on it's way from japan, but it's his responsibilty to bring it here n sell it on to me, now that it's damaged he does not accept any responsibilty for supplying something that's damaged and his best effort is $50 compensation for something that hardly useable

had he checked it's condition first n seen it was damaged, I wouldn't have had to pay him the reminder of the money n now fight to het any of it back, then again he could have known it's condition n still passed it on as he had my money already

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

I've read over your Trader Rating comments and there are some credible people there.

If the business person is at fault, he'd have an ABN > lodge a small claims complaint on the basis that the goods are damaged or not as promised. Also cite that the condition of the goods are not within the 5 points he stated to qualify for non-refund. And cite just what condition the goods were meant to be in.

If he doesn't have an ABN, and thus a private seller, the 'caveat emptor' condition has you pinned down with nothing to do but wear it.

I'd ask for pics next time; and from every angle + top and bottom!

'Tis better to say that you've been wronged rather than state he's a "thief".

Thanks terry I will look into ur suggestions, I was provided a picture of the item while it was in japan and it clearly does not have marks on it and I doubled checked this with the seller

perhaps calling him a thief is lil strong but it's akin to fraud where I'm paying for something that clearly isn't as promised n him tellng me I should accept it in it's present state n still keeping the full amount

[Mase]

I've read over your Trader Rating comments and there are some credible people there.

What does his trader rating have to do with it?

I say the guy is in the wrong. Money should be refunded and item returned or item replaced. He should be contacting his own supplier for his compensation.

Recently I received an item from an ebay seller damaged. He offered a refund or replacement of broken item. I opted for replacement. This is how it should be.

If it's a private seller, i'd be making the trip to see him. People become a lot more understanding face to face.

[GTR-N1]

^^^ I'm saying that BWRGTR's Trader rating has a lot of credible (well-known SAU) people making glowing reports about BWRGTR.

And this leads me to believe that what BWRGTR says is true!

^^^ Context > Mase > Context.

[Mase]

^^^ I'm saying that BWRGTR's Trader rating has a lot of credible (well-known SAU) people making glowing reports about BWRGTR.

And this leads me to believe that what BWRGTR says is true!

^^^ Context > Mase > Context.

What if all his transactions were selling of stolen goods? (Used as an example, not implied.)

I'm simply saying that because someone has/hasn't made any transactions on here doesn't make them any less worthy of the advice/opinions of fellow members.

My mate just got a new radiator for a 350Z sent over from the states and it arrived bent as a banana. The supplier has offered a return. This should be what you are entitlted to.

Edited November 7, 2010 by Mase

[TM7GTR]

being an eBay seller, I know all about things like this happening. As other people have said, it is a little harsh that you have called the guy a thief as it is something a bit out of his control. As a seller who is the middle man in an operation though (i.e. he sourced the part then handed it over to you) he should have had the common sense to open it up, check that the item in question was of the standard he led you to believe, then re-packaged it properly as to avoid any damage occurring. Now as we don't know when it was damaged (being that it could have been on the trip from japan to aus, or from the seller to your house) it's a bit hard to chase up a shipping company for compensation. Although, I would talk to the seller nicely and civilised and ask him to inform the shipping company of what happened, and see what options they offer in terms of getting your money back.

Now what you shouldn't have done, is got angry with the seller and/or threatened to report him or take action. This will only make the matter worse as he will be feeling that you can shove it because you're blaming him completely; in other wods he won't want to help you at all. Another thing I highly reccommend for next time, is that you ask the seller to ship the item with shipping and handling insurance. That way, if the item is damaged in transit as it obviously was (being that it looked fine in the photo) it is the responsiblility of the shipping company to compensate for both of your losses.

Work together with the seller and see what you can come up with. Due to it being a 2nd hand item he is also in no way responsible for the items condition prior to it being in his control (but the gumby kinda should have checked it when it arrived lol) If the shipping company refuse to pay out your losses (which I think they might) due to having no insurance in transit, then as much as I hate to sound like a douche, you're just going to have to accept what the seller can offer you and move on. Many situations like this are learned the hard way which is unfortunate, but there's blame on all three parties here IMHO.

Hope it works out well for you in the end dude, coz that's a real pain in the arse when your hard earned cash is involved

[paulR32gtr]

Man I honestly think you are completely in the right here. Consumer law in this country backs you - goods are not as advertised.

Get on the phone!

His policy implies that you should be given a refund / credit note.

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

being an eBay seller, I know all about things like this happening. As other people have said, it is a little harsh that you have called the guy a thief as it is something a bit out of his control. As a seller who is the middle man in an operation though (i.e. he sourced the part then handed it over to you) he should have had the common sense to open it up, check that the item in question was of the standard he led you to believe, then re-packaged it properly as to avoid any damage occurring. Now as we don't know when it was damaged (being that it could have been on the trip from japan to aus, or from the seller to your house) it's a bit hard to chase up a shipping company for compensation. Although, I would talk to the seller nicely and civilised and ask him to inform the shipping company of what happened, and see what options they offer in terms of getting your money back.

Now what you shouldn't have done, is got angry with the seller and/or threatened to report him or take action. This will only make the matter worse as he will be feeling that you can shove it because you're blaming him completely; in other wods he won't want to help you at all. Another thing I highly reccommend for next time, is that you ask the seller to ship the item with shipping and handling insurance. That way, if the item is damaged in transit as it obviously was (being that it looked fine in the photo) it is the responsiblility of the shipping company to compensate for both of your losses.

Work together with the seller and see what you can come up with. Due to it being a 2nd hand item he is also in no way responsible for the items condition prior to it being in his control (but the gumby kinda should have checked it when it arrived lol) If the shipping company refuse to pay out your losses (which I think they might) due to having no insurance in transit, then as much as I hate to sound like a douche, you're just going to have to accept what the seller can offer you and move on. Many situations like this are learned the hard way which is unfortunate, but there's blame on all three parties here IMHO.

Hope it works out well for you in the end dude, coz that's a real pain in the arse when your hard earned cash is involved

yes, i can understand if he was unaware of the damaged goods and unwittingly passed it on, i did not import this item, the seller had already bought this in japan and was being shipped in container with other items for him to sell in aus, i just saw it, secured it so he doesnt sell it when it gets here and paid the reminder before getting it sent, i dont believe there is a middle man in this instance, as the item was already bought by seller in japan and when in his possession and he was satisfied with his purchase, he was simply on-selling this to me

as for working together, my first response via email was that i was disappointed with the condition of the item and provided him several pictures, after this point it was 3-4 days before had to resend another email stating im awaiting his response (normal response timeframe was within 24hrs prior to this).. at this stage i had not asked for my money back nor accused him of any wrong doing.. i thought he would man-up and admit that item is not as promised and offered some sort of compromise.. it took me 10 emails over the course of a week before he offered $50 compensation and offer of discount for further purchases.. at this point i was very annoyed, as i had given him reasonable time to sort something out and stated i wanted a complete refund, anyways i know where he lives and it may take a trip to melbourne to sort it

Man I honestly think you are completely in the right here. Consumer law in this country backs you - goods are not as advertised.

Get on the phone!

His policy implies that you should be given a refund / credit note.

i hear you mate, it didnt think it would be this difficult to sort it out as clearly im not in breach of any of his refund policy, i wonder if i can register a complaint in the first instance with police for fraud (or something alike) prior to taking it to small claims tribunal, it is a registered business

[Truffles]

In my personal opinion, you're most certainly within your rights as the buyer in this circumstance to ask for a full refund/replacement.

As I've read above, the seller has a list of policies. Followinng which, you're entitled to a refund.

I think it's irrelevant the seller was unaware goods were damaged whilst still in the package. He should have known better. If you saw photos and made an agreement to purchase the item in the condition photographed, then you've made a contract to purchase that item in that condition. Regardless of whether the seller damaged the item or not, he agreed to sell you 'X' item in a certain condition. This was not fulfilled.

[mad082]

the only real mistake the seller made was to not check the item when he recieved it. this means he doesn't know whether it was damaged before he got it or not. if it was fine when he had sent it out then it isn't his fault and he has no reason to do anything about it. unfortunately because he didn't check it before sending it out it is unknown when it was damaged. it really puts it into a grey area. but it really has very little to do with the actual seller. he wasn't the one who damaged it and is purely the middle man and the damaged occured outside of his control.

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

the only real mistake the seller made was to not check the item when he recieved it. this means he doesn't know whether it was damaged before he got it or not. if it was fine when he had sent it out then it isn't his fault and he has no reason to do anything about it. unfortunately because he didn't check it before sending it out it is unknown when it was damaged. it really puts it into a grey area. but it really has very little to do with the actual seller. he wasn't the one who damaged it and is purely the middle man and the damaged occured outside of his control.

there is no middle man here, seller bought the goods from someone in japan, his property now, then sells it to me.. he should not have sold it to me damaged yet expect to keep all my money.. yes he f##ked up by not checking the condition of the panel before sending it to me, but why am i the one paying the price for his mistake?

[mad082]

there is no middle man here, seller bought the goods from someone in japan, his property now, then sells it to me.. he should not have sold it to me damaged yet expect to keep all my money.. yes he f##ked up by not checking the condition of the panel before sending it to me, but why am i the one paying the price for his mistake?

my point is that you don't know that it was damaged when he sent it. it may have gotten damaged after he sent it to you. and if it was, how is that his fault, and why should he have to wear the cost of something damaged by australia post? his mistake was not checking the item, he isn't responsible for the damage though. i'm not taking sides here, just looking at it from all angles. you aren't.

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

my point is that you don't know that it was damaged when he sent it. it may have gotten damaged after he sent it to you. and if it was, how is that his fault, and why should he have to wear the cost of something damaged by australia post? his mistake was not checking the item, he isn't responsible for the damage though. i'm not taking sides here, just looking at it from all angles. you aren't.

yup already considered that as well, point i would like to make is, i was looking at picking this up in person (well my bro wud anyway) cause i was very concerned about damage during post in aus.. this was mentioned to the seller when he offered to courier it to me and i was assured it wont be a problem.. i also emailed him prior to him sending the item and requested it be packaged very well, it was only bubble wrapped with no backing or cardboard etc.. counts for little now i guess

he did sfa to ensure there would be no flexing, negligence or laziness whateva you wanna call it, he may as well as have not bothered putting two layers of bubble wrap around it.. his attitude has been, its not his problem, he reckons i got my monies worth, a feeble $50 compo on top.. he states he doesnt run his business in a dodgy way and im yet to hear why under his business policy i dont qualify for refund.. some business!!

[paulR32gtr]

None of this matters anyway!

He had a responsibility to ensure he was fulfilling his end of the contract (i.e. check the goods) before sending on - that way he could be sure where the damage occurred and rectify issues if required. You fulfilled your end of the contract by paying for the goods.

Everything was out of your control... so it is for him to take back the goods, give you back your money and follow up with the courier for compensation.

Anyway - you can tell a good business by the way they behave in situations like this. Treat your customers this way and you are destined for failure - surely if he acted in a suitable manner BWRGTR would become / stay a repeat customer and recommend him to others.

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

small update, i have been in contact with consumer affairs who have assured me i'm covered by fair trading act and requested i send another letter before lodging a formal complaint, thereafter taking the matter to small claims tribunal if needed

also noticed he is a trader on sau so this will be interesting

[Peter89]

ya should have posted up a copy of the letter. great for business

and yes, he should pay.

i remember a friend asking an autobarn what oil filter was required for his 180sx, they gave him the wrong filter. however, since it was very similar, we didn't notice until $60 worth on oil was on the ground. the refused to replace the oil even though we took their advance. we didn't buy the oil from there again.

Edited November 15, 2010 by Peter89

[Truffles]

i remember a friend asking an autobarn what oil filter was required for his 180sx, they gave him the wrong filter. however, since it was very similar, we didn't notice until $60 worth on oil was on the ground. the refused to replace the oil even though we took their advance. we didn't buy the oil from there again.

Never take advice from any employee of a autobarn/repco/supercheap as bible. At the end of the day a lot of them just sell parts and have no idea what they're doing. Granted however, you do get some that know their stuff.