Targa car options

[Timomo]

Hello all, I am keen to tick. A bucket list item and do Targa Tasmania. I am looking at a r32 gtr or an evo 9. Both track cars. I cannot see either before purchase due to COVID. I am interested in people’s opinions. My head says evo and my heart says GT-R. I have owned an evo and a gts4 before but neither track prepared or sorted in any way. I keep reading that the r32 can’t compare to more modern cars but most seem to be talking stock for stock. Does the GT-R still handle with sorted suspension? Or is the Evo more engaging? Any opinions? 

[Timomo]

I think I put this in the wrong place, haven't been here in 15 years..

Hello all, I am keen to tick. A bucket list item and do Targa Tasmania. I am looking at a r32 gtr or an evo 9. Both track cars. I cannot see either before purchase due to COVID. I am interested in people’s opinions. My head says evo and my heart says GT-R. I have owned an evo and a gts4 before but neither track prepared or sorted in any way. I keep reading that the r32 can’t compare to more modern cars but most seem to be talking stock for stock. Does the GT-R still handle with sorted suspension? Or is the Evo more engaging? Any opinions? 

 

[joshuaho96]

1 hour ago, Timomo said:

Hello all, I am keen to tick. A bucket list item and do Targa Tasmania. I am looking at a r32 gtr or an evo 9. Both track cars. I cannot see either before purchase due to COVID. I am interested in people’s opinions. My head says evo and my heart says GT-R. I have owned an evo and a gts4 before but neither track prepared or sorted in any way. I keep reading that the r32 can’t compare to more modern cars but most seem to be talking stock for stock. Does the GT-R still handle with sorted suspension? Or is the Evo more engaging? Any opinions? 

Are you trying to have fun or win? Best Evo 9 time attack I've seen:

Best BNR32:

 

I think it's probably indisputable that the BNR32 has less potential as a platform. You will have to do a lot to the chassis, it's floppy, poor aero out of the box, the stock suspension geometry isn't very good, the engine has really poor oil control, needs a ton of cooling compared to other engines, etc....

[Duncan]

well, I have done targa in both. My race/rally car is r32 gtr and I've race and rallied a leased evo 9 (targa tas and bathurst)

Have you done any tarmac rallying before, do you think you'll do it more than once, and are you looking to lease or buy? 

If buy, keep in mind current purchase cost for a GTR is 50k+ and probably same again to prep for the first time and do the event. Evo probably half the price.

BTW spoiler, the GTR is miles ahead more fun. The evo might be quicker, certainly easier to drive quick

[Timomo]

I can get a track gtr relatively cheap but the Evo is cheaper and ready to go. Duncan, I fear what you say is true as when I owned the Evo it was fast but almost to easy. I'm also thinking of a gtst R32. That would be similar to the Evo in price once I prepared it. Im buying not leasing. My plan is to build and do local events. Targa in 18 months or so (2022). Ive never done tarmac rally before, I'd hope to do it more than once but at least once! I think the gtr may be worth keeping but race prep could ruin future value? Gtst cheap (comparitively), easy to work on, fun? I fear the Evo broken may be a complicated beast to work on but I never had any issues to find out when I owned one.. plus it was much newer back then.

[Timomo]

1 hour ago, joshuaho96 said:

Are you trying to have fun or win? Best Evo 9 time attack I've seen:

Best BNR32:

 

I think it's probably indisputable that the BNR32 has less potential as a platform. You will have to do a lot to the chassis, it's floppy, poor aero out of the box, the stock suspension geometry isn't very good, the engine has really poor oil control, needs a ton of cooling compared to other engines, etc....

For Targa you can't do Aero, you can't do any bracing, you need stock or similar turbo (when going from twin to single), you can do suspension mods and coil overs, ecu.

[Timomo]

54 minutes ago, Duncan said:

well, I have done targa in both. My race/rally car is r32 gtr and I've race and rallied a leased evo 9 (targa tas and bathurst)

Have you done any tarmac rallying before, do you think you'll do it more than once, and are you looking to lease or buy? 

If buy, keep in mind current purchase cost for a GTR is 50k+ and probably same again to prep for the first time and do the event. Evo probably half the price.

BTW spoiler, the GTR is miles ahead more fun. The evo might be quicker, certainly easier to drive quick

Duncan you seem like the man to talk to, can you break down gtr prep cost if it isn't too much trouble? Curious what 50,000 gets you. 

Edited September 27, 2020 by Timomo

[robbo_rb180]

I'd go the evo, seen plenty of them and wrx's. Tarmac rally is unforgiving when you have a moment but heaps of fun. 

Best place to start is have a good read of the sporting and technical regulations, then decide what class (depending on the build plate gtr may sneak into classic but u likely) if not that experienced even tsd or thoroughbred is good experience. 

One thing to factor in is freighting car to tas and accommodation for you and a crew as it adds up quickly. 

[Timomo]

Thanks

[GTSBoy]

R32 GTSt has all the same problems as GTR (poor front upper control arms, poor rear lower control arm geometry) and none of the good parts (enough power, AWD). RB20DEt with enough turbo to make power has a light-switch power onset and will give you nothing-nothing-nothing-wheelspin every time.

[Duncan]

I'll start by saying there are much cheaper ways to rally than buy and build your own car, especially if you aren't sure how committed you are to it or if budget is tight/not realistic. In order of cost

1. find a manufacturer or rich friend willing to give you a car. this is by far the cheapest way to do a rally, and some people do it this way

2. lease a car. something like the sirocco that chris gough leases is a safe/predictable way to see if you enjoy it and to learn the billion things that go into completing a tarmac rally without worrying about a car that might be tricky to drive (or expensive to replace)

3. buy someone else's proven, finished car that they don't have time/budget to race any more. generally because they now have kids.

4. build it yourself from scratch. this way you get to choose and keep the car but have to sort everything.  Assuming you need to pay someone to do it (labour is probably 1/2 - 2/3 the cost), basic setup on something like a GTR or Evo 9 would be:

Base car $x

Prep car $54k

Safety gear - Rollcage, seats, harnesses, kill switch, other general stuff like triangles, first aid, kitty litter etc) $10k

Intercom, video cam, rallysafe $2k

2x sets of gear for driver and Nav $5k (+ licenses and OLT $1k for first time)

Suspension $5k

18x10 forged wheels $5k (6x)

Brakes (calipers, discs, lines, pads, fluid) $5k

Engine / turbo rebuild (good idea for prep) $10k

ECU $2k + wiring eg oil temp, dash?

Other likely prep - clutch, oil coolers, radiator, hoses, potentially gearbox, 2x diffs, transfer case, all bushes, exhaust to meet regs $10k

Consumables/ event costs $20k+

Tyres 6x ($3.5k)

Fuel (1.5x tanks per day rally car + 1 tank per day crew) = $1.5k

Accommodation & food (driver, nav, 1 crew/2 works better) $500pd x 8d (+before and after) = $4k

Spirit return trip 2 vehicles 2 people $1.5k

Event Photos/videos etc $1k

Entry $8k

Pace notes $0.5k

Damage/repairs - somewhat in the crew's control.... $x

+ refresh after the event (fluids, brakes, anything else worn like clutch, engine/gearboxes/diffs/driveshafts/bearings/bushes) and you are ready to go again

Yes, people do it cheaper, but others also do it way more expensive....BTW it was on my bucket list for a long time (along with racing at Bathurst) and I'm lucky enough to have done it 3 times now, even finished once (Kel is up to her 15th of course, Navigators, especially good ones, have it much cheaper). No regrets doing it but it costs a bomb.

[2pee]

One thing to consider with EM, you'll be lucky to garner any coverage, beyond a few seconds even if you "win".

It's ok, if everything is off your own bat,  trying to offset your costs with a bit of sponsorship on the other hand, might be a hard sell. The tour participants probably see more TV time.