Jump to content
SAU Community

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 108
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

It's not an investment, but it is an asset.

If you are going to try and justify this exercise on economic grounds, then I want to see the math behind it.

Depreciation is a real running cost, just like fuel, maintenance and finance costs. IMO doing a f uckload of km in a performance car seems to be a good way to waste money.

Its true, performance car and saving money don't really go together. I think you would be better off on LPG than Petrol if are doing alot of kms though... and some people might like to drive a GTR for example instead of something else.

Some people like opera... isn't my cup of tea either, seems like a waste... but each to their own I guess.

Also, the resale value is only realised if you actually sell the car, some people may decide to keep the same car for 20+ years... In this way, building a car just how you want it, would be a significant advantage.

I'm 22 and have owned 6 cars. I can tell you, changing cars is expensive! If I found the right car to suit my needs perfectly in the first place, I'd be alot of $$$ better off. That is what someone is trying to achieve here, the perfect car for what they want... Not for track days.

You could convert a GTR into LPG......

Or you could just buy an excel.

I can't see why anyone who was capable of obtaining an R33/R34 GTR would convert it to a LPG system. Pretty sad endeavour IMO. I'm with Thommo...imagine telling people that you own an LPG run GTR. Embarassing.

And if you are REALLY doing this for the environment, then you're a hippie and I don't like you, can't stand the thought of a GTR with peace symbols and flowers painted on it.

Good luck fella, I’ve considered doing the same to my GTR. Don’t let the negative comments put you off. You can really only be accused of lateral thinking...Did you receive any information back from Bill Campbell of Gas Injection Technologies about the "Stealth" injector system? I would assume that with a power fc the "stealth" injectors could be tuned to suit.

ADM

LPG GTR = sacrilidge.

Maybe that could be my numberplate.... SACRLDGE :D

PS... it's not oing to be a GTR as such.. either a Stagea RS4 or 260RS.

Maybe I'm nitpicking.

Did you receive any information back from Bill Campbell of Gas Injection Technologies about the "Stealth" injector system? I would assume that with a power fc the "stealth" injectors could be tuned to suit.

Not Yet... it's been a week... I'm hoping for a reply though.

More research tonight...

ON THE PLUS SIDE

Prices. My opinion is that we are heading for more international instability in the future (just my opinion), and the fact that Australia imports most of its petrol, but produces its own LPG will have a bearing on prices in the future. From an industry point of view, there is a lot less risk investing in Australian LPG than investing in Middle Eastern oil, and hence the price gap will increase in the future.

ON THE MINUS SIDE

The GTR is an icon; a halo car for the entire Nissan range. To make a swap to LPG based on running costs would just be sacrilige. Sorry dude, it's just wrong. Added is the fact that the cost would run into thousands of dollars, so the system would take probably two or more years to pay for itself and start saving you money.

CONCLUSION

If you want economy, buy a Honda Insight and convert to LPG. THAT would make for some cheap running costs. 3L/100km @ 40cent/litre. Slow, cramped, uncomfortable, but cheap. A GTR is purpose built for performance. It is not an economy car. However, if you do decide to go through with the conversion, good luck to you! It will be truely unique, and I will be devastated when my petrol chewing GTS-T gets eaten up by an LPG running "taxi." I can't wait to see the first Enzo or Pagani converted to LPG...

I also clock alot of kms on my GTR (it's my work car). LPG is an interesting consideration given the stupid fuel pricing.

I suggest that people doing the 'sacrilidge' line need to go buy all the GTR's left if they are worried (start a new religion and get a fund together). Personally I think you all missed the point.

What a life to spend endless kms in nothing but a great sports car. Instead of having some puss bucket nanna 4cyl to do 99% of your driving in with the GTR only for weekends. I tell you I can't go back. I seem to recall a few other guys I know in the same boat, notably Ant from X-speed's now 900rwhp daily driver. It's a good thing if you can afford to do it and if you need to go LPG to make it more affordable then I say good for you!....end of rant.

I couldn't help but notice that our website was quoted, so I felt compelled to get amongst it

LPG is not just a cost saving excercise it is a high performance fuel, and in my opinion the only fuel to run on a turbo charged engine. Have you ever heard of a decarb being benificial, LPG cleans out the entire engine and dramatically reduces engine and turbo wear. After 10,000 ks the oil is pretty much as clean as when you put it in.

When LPG is injected the engine power is equivalent to or more than petrol and the power delivery is smoother due to the higher octane rating.

I totally agree with all of the negative press that LPG has obtained over the years - for example Nissan spends several million dollars developing an engine and engine management system so it runs sweet and Jo from down the road installs a LPG system that he put together from a few parts that worked ok on the family commodore..... need I say more, but if you spend a S**t lot of money and put in a H**l of a lot of work believe me LPG runs Bloody good!!!!! :blink:

Bradkazz,

Im assuming your from the profire group. Could you provide the forum with an update on how well the Laser Turbo is running on the gas injection. Maybe a run down on the mods that were required to make it work. Also could you provide the power output and fuel economy its achieved.

Edited by ADM
I couldn't help but notice that our website was quoted...

... LPG runs Bloody good!!!!! :(

Nice input.

bradkazz, Any chance you can help me out with installing LPG on the Stagea (Series 2, RB25DET Neo engine)? I'm hoping to pick it up next week.

Yes I am one of the designers of Profire engine management. The laser, which is actually my car, is running multipoint gas injection and direct fire ignition. The engine is a Jap spec BPT (134KW version) which is basically the same as the later model TX3. It is producing approx 175KW @14 psi and gets about 10km/L. Drivability is basically the same as petrol except that the power delivery is smoother and the gas gives more bottom end torque. LPG injectors, 1 per cylinder, replace the gas carby and the LPG vapourises is a high pressure type ie the gas is delivered to the injectors at about 20psi. The laser runs straight LPG so I installed the gas injectors into the factory petrol injector ports.

I/we are willing to help anyone who wants to run LPG especially turbo owners.

i used to have a mazda rx3 turbo that run straight lpg . went faster and harder on lpg than it ever did on petrol loved the running cost as well . i would consider converting my skyline to straight lpg one day to all those thinking of it good on ya. dare to be different dont just be a sheep following the flock

Edited by mid life crisis

Thanks for the info Bradkazz,

I understand one of the issues with LPG injection is the reliability of the injectors themselves. What injectors are you using and how reliable have you found them?

Also, could you lay out a rough cost and parts guide for retrofitting a gas injection system.

I’m surprised at the economy you’re achieving. Am I correct in my observation that it is similar to the stock car running on Petrol. How is this achieved with LPG having a significantly lower calorific value?

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • Nah, that is hella wrong. If I do a simple linear between 150°C (0.407v) and 50°C (2.98v) I get the formula Temperature = -38.8651*voltage + 165.8181 It is perfectly correct at 50 and 150, but it is as much as 20° out in the region of 110°C, because the actual data is significantly non-linear there. It is no more than 4° out down at the lowest temperatures, but is is seriously shit almost everywhere. I cannot believe that the instruction is to do a 2 point linear fit. I would say the method I used previously would have to be better.
    • When I said "wiring diagram", I meant the car's wiring diagram. You need to understand how and when 12V appears on certain wires/terminals, when 0V is allowed to appear on certain wires/terminals (which is the difference between supply side switching, and earth side switching), for the way that the car is supposed to work without the immobiliser. Then you start looking for those voltages in the appropriate places at the appropriate times (ie, relay terminals, ECU terminals, fuel pump terminals, at different ignition switch positions, and at times such as "immediately after switching to ON" and "say, 5-10s after switching to ON". You will find that you are not getting what you need when and where you need it, and because you understand what you need and when, from working through the wiring diagram, you can then likely work out why you're not getting it. And that will lead you to the mess that has been made of the associated wires around the immobiliser. But seriously, there is no way that we will be able to find or lead you to the fault from here. You will have to do it at the car, because it will be something f**ked up, and there are a near infinite number of ways for it to be f**ked up. The wiring diagram will give you wire colours and pin numbers and so you can do continuity testing and voltage/time probing and start to work out what is right and what is wrong. I can only close my eyes and imagine a rat's nest of wiring under the dash. You can actually see and touch it.
    • So I found this: https://www.efihardware.com/temperature-sensor-voltage-calculator I didn't know what the pullup resistor is. So I thought if I used my table of known values I could estimate it by putting a value into the pullup resistor, and this should line up with the voltages I had measured. Eventually I got this table out of it by using 210ohms as the pullup resistor. 180C 0.232V - Predicted 175C 0.254V - Predicted 170C 0.278V - Predicted 165C 0.305V - Predicted 160C 0.336V - Predicted 155C 0.369V - Predicted 150C 0.407V - Predicted 145C 0.448V - Predicted 140C 0.494V - Predicted 135C 0.545V - Predicted 130C 0.603V - Predicted 125C 0.668V - Predicted 120C 0.740V - Predicted 115C 0.817V - Predicted 110C 0.914V - Predicted 105C 1.023V - Predicted 100C 1.15V 90C 1.42V - Predicted 85C 1.59V 80C 1.74V 75C 1.94V 70C 2.10V 65C 2.33V 60C 2.56V 58C 2.68V 57C 2.70V 56C 2.74V 55C 2.78V 54C 2.80V 50C 2.98V 49C 3.06V 47C 3.18V 45C 3.23V 43C 3.36V 40C 3.51V 37C 3.67V 35C 3.75V 30C 4.00V As before, the formula in HPTuners is here: https://www.hptuners.com/documentation/files/VCM-Scanner/Content/vcm_scanner/defining_a_transform.htm?Highlight=defining a transform Specifically: In my case I used 50C and 150C, given the sensor is supposedly for that. Input 1 = 2.98V Output 1 = 50C Input 2 = 0.407V Output 2 = 150C (0.407-2.98) / (150-50) -2.573/100 = -0.02573 2.98/-0.02573 + 47.045 = 50 So the corresponding formula should be: (Input / -0.02573) + 47.045 = Output.   If someone can confirm my math it'd be great. Supposedly you can pick any two pairs of the data to make this formula.
    • Well this shows me the fuel pump relay is inside the base of the drivers A Pillar, and goes into the main power wire, and it connects to the ignition. The alarm is.... in the base of the drivers A Pillar. The issue is that I'm not getting 12v to the pump at ignition which tells me that relay isn't being triggered. AVS told me the immobiliser should be open until the ignition is active. So once ignition is active, the immobiliser relay should be telling that fuel pump relay to close which completes the circuit. But I'm not getting voltage at the relay in the rear triggered by the ECU, which leaves me back at the same assumption that that relay was never connected into the immobiliser. This is what I'm trying to verify, that my assumption is the most likely scenario and I'll go back to the alarm tech yet again that he needs to fix his work.      Here is the alarms wiring diagram, so my assumption is IM3A, IM3B, or both, aren't connected or improper. But this is all sealed up, with black wiring, and loomed  
×
×
  • Create New...