StealthX

Thanks for all that info mate. Much appreciated. I just got off the phone with kosteckis and they quoted me $450 for the test plus $135p/h labor charge. benchmark time is 3 hours, so $855. I think if anyone is angry at kosteckis, they should re-think. They are just providing a service, remember they are the ones who forked out almost HALF A MILLION DOLLARS for the testing equipment. Blame our poor excuse of a government. In NSW the RTA will fund the tests for the clients, all the clients have to do is prepare the car to pass the test. Why doesn't the WA government follow suit? Who knows, but it would DEFINITELY make everyone's lives easier... As for the rumor of the mystery $3000 dollar 2nd test (I must add that I miss understood @ first), that is complete BS. The test costs $450 + $135p/h every time, BUT if you fail the first time and employ KEC to engineer your car to pass (re-tune, install different cats, replace old/damaged parts) and then re-test, yes, it can come close to $3000. When I spoke to Dave from kostekis, he said they has a supercharged VE commodore putting down 900HP AT THE TREADS that passed. if a dirty big, old fashioned GM V8 can pass emissions (first time i might add), then I highly doubt that a jap RB engine in good condition with a solid state of tune and working cat converter, will fail. I think the focus should be put on passing the test first time, not getting around it, like mentioned above by DRIFTT. Does anyone think a petition to the government would do anything? I know for a fact that there are dozens of angry WA car enthusiasts out there, I'm prepared to take a few hours out to fully research and come up with something to put to consumer affairs. I've got some fairly extensive contacts in the motorsport industry from uni and my personal endeavors in racing, so I don't doubt a large volume of people could be gathered. I can tell ya for a fact that the sole reason why the IM240 test was made mandatory in WA, was so the govmnt can shut a group of people up. The general public sees a modified car driving past, and immediately stereotypes: the driver must be dangerous, the car must be illegal, and the car must contribute to global warming somehow. The latter of which has been hyped up so much (similar to swine flu!) that just mentioning it, causes the dumb, unwashed masses to squirm, complaining that performance cars ARE THE SOLE CAUSE OF GLOBAL WARMING... Unfortunately, the bulk of us, the (for the most part) law abiding, tax paying, harmless car enthusiasts, have to pay. It's not the first time citizen Jane and citizen Joe have been unfairly disadvantaged due to the government. Think of it from the government's point of view, they aren't making money from this, so its clearly just an effort to win votes. The solution: Give the government another large group of people to quieten - US. Cam.

HAHAHAHAH great thought... knowing the way most of them drive, i cant imagine the cars would be in emissions passing condition lol

Yeh I think most people are getting ahead of themselves. We've not bin given canaries yet, so don't stress too much, just lay low for a while, till the price comes down. Maybe try some sleeper mods? i.e. black painted intercooler, pre-diff dump and a fake rear muffler and tip, and for f**ks sake drive safely. As with most jap cars. My x-trail included, We've got the latest emissions technology, (for our respective vintage of car) like evap canisters, decent PCV systems, lowish volume recirculated BOVs etc... Just if you do get whacked with an IM240 order, spend a bit of coin to make sure yr car passes first time (ADR euro-3 spec cat, stoich AFRs, new spark plugs, clean injectors, and check your compression, valve seals and turbo oil seals - to name a few), and be nice to the boys in blue you might just avoid it altogether... Good luck fellas.

^^^^ got it in one. there needs to be a deviation from the common stereotype that says; nice car = dangerous driver. cos its us car enthusiasts that are being treated unfairly, and its not the car enthusiasts who put the little white crosses on the sides of roads, its the dickheads who treat the road like a racetrack. but unfortunately, the people who run the country aren't as smart as we all hope/think.

it was introduced back in april, and i only just heard of it today, being a few weeks away from finishing my turbo build. i think your correct in saying we should've had some notice... cos what is the average sucker with an average commodore with a little exhaust gonna do when they get whacked with a potential $3700 test to pay for? its pretty much outlawing car enthusiasts, IMO.

EXACTLY! the rule's not the problem, the single company that charges $700 for the first, then $3000 for every one after that, is the f**king joke/problem.

in short, yes. it gives the police the power to make you have an IM240 if they suspect you have any emission's affecting mods (cams, bigger turbos, exhausts, cat deletes etc) and if you get a yellow sticker, and you go over the pits with any of the above mods, youl need am IM240.

you guessed them and conveniently, they 'new' 'ADR compliant' cat converters. fkn government.

thats what i plan

Hey all, just thought I'd share some pretty shitty news I've come across. Went to the DPI today, and got some info for the legal stuff regarding my turbo x-trail project. Its all pretty simple, i don't even need MOD plates or engineer's certificate. What i need to do is fill in an modification application form and send it in, then ill get a response as to what i need to do next. I might need to do whats called an IM240 test, which is a VERY expensive emissions test involving several gas levels being monitored for a period of 4 minutes (hence 240 seconds). These cost ~$700, and if the car fails, the next test will cost, brace yourself, almost $3000! The joke of this is that there is only one company in the entire state that does these tests. They have a monopoly on the emissions testing 'market'. Hoping I won't have to do one of these, if i do, then ill just take the gamble and drive with it not fully legal, cos 700 dollars per test is an effing joke, its the biggest money making scheme I've ever seen. After that, it just needs to pass an inspection over the pits, which should be fairly easy. I don't condone driving an un-road worthy car at all, this will be my choice, and only under absolute worst case senario and untill I can find a way around the test, or spend some more coin for the stupid test. The problem with the IM240 test, is that was introduced back in April, and to date, not one test has been carried out in Western Australia. :dunno: From what i hear from the guys at hyperdrive motorsport (im using them to tune my EMS when its done), 3 cars were tested independently over east, by a car dealership. I might add here that in NSW, this test is free, funded by the RTA! (correct me if im wrong). The cars were a MY09 Subaru Impreza WRX, a 3.6L V6 base model VE commodore, and a VE SS (6.0l V8) ute. ONLY THE V6 COMMODORE PASSED THE TEST. You read correctly. The WRX and the SS failed due to to higher carbon emissions on start-up (before the cat-converted had even bin given a chance to warm up to correct operating temperature). If a stock car cannot pass this test, what hope does even a slightly modified car have? According to the DPI's website, 80% of the cars on the road are (as of April 09) REQUIRED to undergo an IM240 test to still be legal. This includes any car with any exhaust mods at all, turbo or supercharger, LPG or CNG conversion, imported from another country or that was manufactured before 1989. This means that every LPG conversion must undergo this $700 (or potentially $3700 if it fails the first time) test in order to be legal. Thats more than the conversion itself, and its certainly not covered by the gov'mnt grant. I thought the government was trying to promote LPG conversions??? Read about the test here: http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/mediafiles/lic_ib...ht_vehicles.pdf and some discussion on the LS1 (commodore V8) forum here: http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=121352 This test marks the end of modified cars in WA. Yeh I'm seriously considering the future of this turbo project now. That said, its not exactly that easy to just undo what I've done already (fuel pump, intercooler, exhaust, manifold and dump pipe that's bin custom made, BOV, injectors, the turbo itself and even the catch can!). I'm not going to be able to sell all of this stuff (especially with the new laws) and thanks to our lovely, helpful government, a hard working, law abiding, tax-paying student is thousands out of pocket. To say I'm annoyed would be an understatement. I'm not sure about the status of cars that are already modified pre-April, but from what it sounds like, it gives police the power to whack a $700 or $3700 test on ANYONE, even if the car is stock and/or they just suspect an exhaust modification has bin carried out. The only bit if hope us WA'ers have, is that the test is under review in 12 months time (next April), all it takes is a smart lawyer from a car company to pipe up, and plead that the test undermines their company's ability to sell cars, that are considered "legal". What do you guys think?

still available?

haha 1. poor fuel consumption (might not be that noticeable) 2. rich spike(s) (if youve got an A:F ratio gauge, check it out.) 3. big carbon deposits on associated cylinder in the turbo mani (rich condition will leave unburnt fuel in the exhaust) 4. noticeable oil consumption (rich condition in 1 cylinder will wash the bore - again not that noticeable) ecu shouldn't retard the timing, dont know how skyline ECUs are built, but most injected cars wouldnt shouldnt depend on engine temp. a leak is a leak.

gotta love the wacky conversions. i got my inspiration for my turbo x-trail from a similar LS1 conversion into a 180. cant wait to hear/see the outcome! good luck fellas!

yeh thats true. but i know for a fact, the B15 (2000 - 2007) QR25DE used in the sentra is EXACTLY the same engine as the T30 (2001-2007) x-trail's. same sepcs: 245nm of torque @ 4000rpm, 132kw @ 6000rpm and very similar torque curves from what i hear, everyone reports the same decrease of power over 5000rpm and the mass amounts of lowdown torque. i know for a fact the new x-trail's engines are very different from the new sentra's. the aussie spec qr has a 9.5 CP where as the US spec has 10.5 with completely different internals. plus the aussie spec was down tuned in 2006 to 125KW due to emissions, and the us spec is rated at 151KW. with the HP rating, keep in mind im not after mass amounts of peak HP. maybe 250-270whp at the most, and as you said yourself, my aim is to add mid range. if things work out well, i might build up then engine including cams and low comp pistons later down the track if im looking for a high rpm monster. but for the moment, everything's going as conservative as possible. im after driveability in this setup. i just want it to be plain fun to drive - not a 1/4 mile killer or a dyno car...

the x-trail has a 3 mode 4WD system, 2wd, auto mode (uses sensors to distribute torque between front and rear wheels) and 4WD mode. it is front wheel biased, and the rear wheels are activated by a wet clutch system just before the rear diff. 4WD mode locks this clutch and drive is set @ 50:50 ive already upgraded the clutch and flywheel, plus i dont think this will be an issue too much. consider how much torque gets put through the drivetrain (post gearbox) in 1st gear. theres a shit load now consider that no boost level is gonna match that amount of torque in any other gear. plus with what ive dont already, i can break traction to ALL FOUR WHEELS (in AWD mode) in 1st gear, so any more torque is just gonna induce more wheel spin, because im already reached the maximum tractive effort that the tyres can handle - if i had 10-inch wide tyres all round, it would be a different story, and MUCH more stress would be introduced to the drivetrain. i know for a fact my gearbox is tough as. the sentra guys in the US use a similar gearbox, and theres a few guys in the 600whp club, all using stock gearboxes. the GReddy e-manage ultimate has full ignition timing maps. as for the breathing rate of the two engines, the VG30ET that my turbo comes off, flows this: .00005305 (approx density of air @ 6psi) X 183cui x 6800rpm / 1.8 = 36.675 lbs/min @redline and my QR flows only 30.662 lbs/min @ redline so if that turbo was designed to flow 36 p/min at 6psi, then my engine that only flows 30 p/min should give me a little bit of headroom in terms of restriction. in laymans terms, that turbo was built to flow 3000cc through its hotside @ 6psi, and my engine only has 2500cc worth of flow, so as long as i keep the boost pressure @ 6psi, it should be fine. in this equation, compression ratio has little impact on flow rates, because air goes in, it is compressed at a the comp. ratio, then it expands to roughly the same density when it leaves the cylinders - disregarding the effects of heat on density + the addded mas of the burnt fuel BUT if the comp ratio of an RB25 (as someone already pointed out) is 9.5, and guys can slap on '25 turbochargers on, then my 9.4 comp. ratio should do fine. having said all that, im still looking for a cheap way to obtain a slightly bigger turbo. can replacement exhaust housings be swapped onto factory nissan turbos? that would be the ultimate solution IMO krizza_ca18det, check out myspecv.com thats a car in the US with the same QR engine. DOZENS of guys have turbocharged those engines. a few guys have even used a GT2871r turbo, which is infact smaller than the VG30ET turbo i have sitting infront of me.

hey mate yeh ive been doing all my research on that forum! its called MSV (my spec-v) myspecv.com have a look if youve got a spare 2 mins. the B platform is americas version of the N platform over here. and yeh the sentras come with QG18DE, SR20DE, and the upper spec SE-R and SE-R spec V came with the QR25DE, tuned for 130 and 135KW respectively, taking the car from 0-100 in 6.3 seconds - not bad for a FWD four banger. my x-trail is based off the the FF-S platform, essentially, the 4WD variant of the B platform. in 2007, the FF-S platform was super seeded by the C platform, making the new X-trail shape, shared with the murano, rouge and dualis and of course the 2007 and up (B16 model) sentra. JWT make heaps of parts tfor the QR engine. some of these include, balancer shaft removal kits, clutches, flywheels, cams and multi layer head gaskets specifically for turbo applications. back on the turbo... i think im gonna stick with this turbo for the moment. if the poweband turns out like shit, then i can always sell it and look for something different, but it should be ok.

yeh would be a logical choice, but its too small i think. even tho the engines are the same size, my engine has a huge stroke. and as a general rule of thumb, the larger the stroke, the larger the turbo. the VG30DET turbo is essentially a ball bearing version of the '25 turbo, with a slightly bigger turbine housing...

from what the sentra guys have experienced over in the US, 8psi is the safe limit without meth or alky on a stock motor. the pistons, crank, bearnings are good for 350-400hp. its the rods that are the problem, they are pencil thin. (the rods on QR25s from 2007 and up are BEEFY as, so along with some forged, low comp. pistons, theres a great option for a build right there, cheap as chips too) having said that, 90% of those guys only use SAFCII or NEO to tune with, leaving no control over ignition timing, or FULL control over new injectors. since im using a full piggyback as opposed to just an air flow converter, id suggest theres more potential on a stock motor but to be on the safe side, im gonna start off at 6pound, then if i feel confident, ill up it from there with a boost controller. a few guys have suggested using the 2871, but how much would that set me back, and wheres the best place to look?

thanks for your help but i think thats gonna be a little too small. after all my engines got 500cc more than an SR20 and 700 more than a CA18 also due to my engine having a huge stroke (100m vs 89mm bore), it will be kinda restrictive. im thinking along the lines of keeping this turbo for a while, trying it a little, see how it goes , then upgrading to a Garrett T-series (about 600-700 bucks) which would get me a solid quality product, and i can sleep easy at night...

thanks mate! how far did ya get with the kit before ya decided against it? i saw a custom turbo'd HYANDAI EXCELL, flutter its guts past me one day and i thought, f**k it, if that thing can be blown, why cant mine?

thanks fellas. yeedogga, ive heard many ppl having problems with boost spikes and shit too. ive never seen one used for under 1 bar of boost, pretty sure its a def no go. the x-trail motor is a QR25DE. it was made to be the replacement of the SR20 and KA24. its engineered to be light and powerful like the SR and torquey and reliable like the KA. but unfortunately the manifolds/fuel rails/intakes of both dont fit. theres a car sold in the us called a Sentra, which has exactly the same engine as my x-trail. several companies (turbonetics, treadstone and a few others) make full, high quality turbo kits for the cars, they give a 12month warranty on 9psi... so im copying everything off that. the manifold and dumppipe is getting made professionally by my best mate whos a fabricator (oh joy!) at his work... teh WRX injectors are perfect fit, same size, same o-rings, everything. they flow 440cc and max out at 10-12psi and are high impedance top feed even the wiring clips are the same... wytsky, my motor has a 9.4:1 compression ratio, which is pretty low for a new, all alloy motor IMO. im going with the intercooler just for a little added piece of mind. everything about this kit is extra conservative (fuel pump doesnt really need to be upgraded, dont really need an IC, but im doing it anyway) + im getting it tuned professionally with a GReddy emanage ultimate. thanks for ya help. Cam.

Hey all. I've bin researching for the last 3-4 months and slowly piecing together my turbo kit for my X-trail Im looking for no more than 6psi of boost, and i dont want to spend a thousand dollars on a turbo. What would you guys suggest? Since my engine is that same size (2488cc - less two cylinders tho) as an RB25, the logical suggestion is a stock RB25 turbo. I've followed the same lines as that, and gone with the T3 turbo from a VG30DET (single turbo 300zx) with a .48 AR exhaust housing. From what i understand, its sorta the same as a '25 turbo, but with a slightly bigger exhaust housing. The internal gate is set at 6.5 psi. On paper this sounds like a perfect turbo for making around 240-260whp on 6 pound (10 psi yields 300whp on my engine no problem, proved by dozens in the US) Its in great condition, no shaft play, ball bearing, genuine garrett airesearch product, just wanting some input from some of you guys on if it is the right selection or if i should sell it and look for something bigger/smaller. Besides this, I'd be leaning towards a KKR, second hand garrett or the like. Thanks

hello?

its more about the clutch than the gearbox pretty sure (not 100%) a pull type, "pulls" the clutch away from the fly, and a push type "push"es it away. im not sure of any other info tho. sorry.

ill take the blow off valve... would you take $100? plus shipping to Perth, 6020, should be about 20-30 bucks... ive msged ya too, but my numbers 0424 438 501 just in case thanks mate consider it sold...