Labor = Greens = Epa/decc?

[SECURITY]

i was thinking about this today. ever since the Labor party has come in, laws have tightened on emissions which ultimately effect the modified car scene because of what i think is from the greens influence to control emissions.

Labor is tipped to have the majority vote from the greens (so a vote for the greens is generally a vote for Labor, and vise versa).

im not voting Labor in this election, i was happy when the the Liberals were running the country although if you are an employee and/or have a young family im sure you will disagree.

discuss.

[oweban]

I'm not sure of all the policies of Liberal, but the biggest NO to me was Workchoices.

As for this time? Tony Abbot. I'll feel dirty voting for Labour because of Stephen Conroy, but it's the better of two evils; the other will put Australia back to the 1950's. At least I can circumvent the filter if I so choose.

I propose I smash the shit out of his daughters. Bow chikka.

[FrangaR33]

i was thinking about this today. ever since the Labor party has come in, laws have tightened on emissions which ultimately effect the modified car scene because of what i think is from the greens influence to control emissions.

Labor is tipped to have the majority vote from the greens (so a vote for the greens is generally a vote for Labor, and vise versa).

im not voting Labor in this election, i was happy when the the Liberals were running the country although if you are an employee and/or have a young family im sure you will disagree.

discuss.

No way i'm giving even more power to the Greens those enviro-mentals already have too much sway when it comes to the future of our great country. So I would rather vote for what in my opinion is the lesser of two evils, I have no doubt Abbott will rip the heart out of the welfare system and cut costs wherever he deems he can. Gillard and Brown will only deliver Australian into the hands of the Chinese. People will call me alarmist but look at Greece they had to go cap in hand to their creditors the European and get a massive bailout from the world bank and the Germans. Our creditor is the Chinese government and they arent going to be as forgiving or as nice as the European union was to the Greeks. They will demand policy concessions because we will owe them so much money, we will no longer be able to refuse them being allowed to buy into Australian industry because otherwise they will cut off our line of credit. Much like the Untied States controlled the former European powers of Britain and France after WW2 because they couldnt finance a war or military action without a loan from the U.S.

As the baby boomers start to retire and put even more stress on the governments bottom line as they go from being the largest contributors of tax to being a drain on the system our deficit and debt will continue to rise under the control of Gillard and Brown.

As of 2001 the ratio of Taxpayers to Pensioners was 5:1 today its more like 3.5:1 which means if you do the math of $644 per fortnight per pensioner x 52 = $16,744 anually, divide that by even 5 taxpayers per pensioner thats $3,348 of your taxes that go directly to a pensioner every year, when the ratio drops to 3:1 it will be $5,581.

Abbott is willing to make those hard choices that will make life harder for most people in this country but they are choices that have to be made unless we want to become a defacto province of the People's Republic of China in the next 25 years.

Edited July 19, 2010 by FrangaR33

[GTR-N1]

3 years ago, we were at a "FORK IN THE ROAD"

But now, we're "MOVING FORWARD"

It doesn't matter what direction, so long as...

we're "MOVING FORWARD"...

around the roundabouts of Canberra > "SPIN"

I'm already dusting off the dvds for the next 33 days.

[CatsEyes]

Is this really the right place for this topic? Shouldn't political canvassing belong elsewhere?

[Angus Smart]

As of 2001 the ratio of Taxpayers to Pensioners was 5:1 today its more like 3.5:1 which means if you do the math of $644 per fortnight per pensioner x 52 = $16,744 anually, divide that by even 5 taxpayers per pensioner thats $3,348 of your taxes that go directly to a pensioner every year, when the ratio drops to 3:1 it will be $5,581.

Should be 26.. since its per fortnight?

[FrangaR33]

Should be 26.. since its per fortnight?

Sorry you are completely correct. $644 per fortnight per pensioner x 26 = $16,744

The figure of $16,744 is correct though I just accidentally wrote 52 instead of 26.

[NISMO]

As the baby boomers start to retire and put even more stress on the governments bottom line as they go from being the largest contributors of tax to being a drain on the system our deficit and debt will continue to rise under the control of Gillard and Brown.

As of 2001 the ratio of Taxpayers to Pensioners was 5:1 today its more like 3.5:1 which means if you do the math of $644 per fortnight per pensioner x 52 = $16,744 anually, divide that by even 5 taxpayers per pensioner thats $3,348 of your taxes that go directly to a pensioner every year, when the ratio drops to 3:1 it will be $5,581.

Abbott is willing to make those hard choices that will make life harder for most people in this country but they are choices that have to be made unless we want to become a defacto province of the People's Republic of China in the next 25 years.

Can i just get this right. Are you saying that abbott will lower the pension, as in aged pension?

I'm all for pissing off things like the dole, but i don't see how any gov can lower the aged pension. If $16744 is what a pensioner recieves per annum and that is there only source of income, would you be able to live off that?

Or are pensioners supposed to eat bread and water and not leave their houses. With EVERY single utility bill rising on what is now a regular basis, can you please explain to me how pensioners are supposed to live on less?

I've got no prob with Abbott taking the "hard" line, but i 100% believe that droping the aged pension is NOT the place to do it.

[SECURITY]

dont forget that the whole idea of superannuation is to stop government assistance. i think it was in 1992 that it all started, so that meant if you were 18 in 1992 getting super then today you would be 36, most people retire in their 55's. the government will probably start phasing out government assistance in 20 years time.

[NISMO]

def agree Joe.

But that has 0 to do with lowering the pension today, and using it as an example of how much tax we pay and why we should vote for abbott. (that is if what that post by Franga was alluding too)

As it stands right now, some people who have worked their whole lives don't have super, and don't have a tonne of investments to live off. They are also the same people who got this country to the prosperous position it is in now.

[FrangaR33]

Can i just get this right. Are you saying that abbott will lower the pension, as in aged pension?

I'm all for pissing off things like the dole, but i don't see how any gov can lower the aged pension. If $16744 is what a pensioner recieves per annum and that is there only source of income, would you be able to live off that?

Or are pensioners supposed to eat bread and water and not leave their houses. With EVERY single utility bill rising on what is now a regular basis, can you please explain to me how pensioners are supposed to live on less?

I've got no prob with Abbott taking the "hard" line, but i 100% believe that droping the aged pension is NOT the place to do it.

I'm saying that the old aged pension will cost Australians dearly in the future unless reformed in quite a large fashion. Personally I believe $16,744 isnt enough to live on especially when your single and I completely agree. When I said Abbott will rip the heart out of the welfare system I was referring to unemployment benefits and student allowances. As a politiican your better off alienating the young than pissing off the pensioners because they will fight back and they have both the time and the resources, young people cant be bothered and think they have better things to do.

What I am saying about the pension is that it will destroy the governments bottom line as the baby boomers retire and reforms will have to be put in place where by the aged pension is either reformed or abolished for those under the age of say 40. Either a system of people saving for their own retirement or a blanket additional tax of a couple of % of annual income that goes straight into the a government sponsored pension plan so they can actually afford to pay out your pension when you retire.

Abbott is between a rock and hard place at the moment, he can either choose the Gillard line which is to out and out lie about the future of our country and our economy or he can do what he's doing tell the truth and get destroyed in the polls for it. Gillards budget projections are based on a large level of economic growth in China, if that doesnt happen we are going to go even further into the red.

As much as I want the mad monk to win, I dont think he will, even he knows that.

[oweban]

What I am saying about the pension is that it will destroy the governments bottom line as the baby boomers retire and reforms will have to be put in place where by the aged pension is either reformed or abolished for those under the age of say 40. Either a system of people saving for their own retirement or a blanket additional tax of a couple of % of annual income that goes straight into the a government sponsored pension plan so they can actually afford to pay out your pension when you retire.

I thought that was kinda happening already, eg. systems in place? That's why we're all busting our asses in superannuation? Cause god knows when I'm 65, there'll be no pension...

[FrangaR33]

I thought that was kinda happening already, eg. systems in place? That's why we're all busting our asses in superannuation? Cause god knows when I'm 65, there'll be no pension...

To the best of my knowledge there is no policy or system like that in place. There is compulsory super but that is going to be no where near enough for someone who has worked for 45 years at around minimum wage with no support from a government funded pension. The government will have to give literally decades of notice to tell people that they wont have a government pension when they retire, they can hardly spring that on someone a few years before they retire.

I dont think that there will be abolshing of the pension its more likely that there will just be a blanket amount taken from everyone's income every year and then invested in individual government managed pension funds, this will probably occur in 10-20 years time as the baby boomers start to destroy the budget with their pension payments.

Either way it seems paying into super now seems like the best plan at the moment for ones retirement.

[oweban]

Either way it seems paying into super now seems like the best plan at the moment for ones retirement.

Oh definitely; I know the only way I'll have enough now is sacrificing at least 5% of my pre-tax income into super and having the Govt. match it up to $1500...

[Shazbanger]

Any politician that has the balls to wear speedos in public, and cracks me up with his sayings such as "Ridgy-Didge" and "You beauty" in a national conference gets my vote. I don't care much for politicians though.

Bring Back Bob Hawke.

[Jpower]

i was thinking about this today. ever since the Labor party has come in, laws have tightened on emissions which ultimately effect the modified car scene because of what i think is from the greens influence to control emissions.

Labor is tipped to have the majority vote from the greens (so a vote for the greens is generally a vote for Labor, and vise versa).

im not voting Labor in this election, i was happy when the the Liberals were running the country although if you are an employee and/or have a young family im sure you will disagree.

discuss.

You will find that emission is a global issue.

Car manufacturers have to meet global emissions set points.

So your rhetoric is not only ignorant but very narrow.

Think on a global scale... Australia is so behind for a developed western country it is beyond a joke.

[mattymagoo22]

Oh definitely; I know the only way I'll have enough now is sacrificing at least 5% of my pre-tax income into super and having the Govt. match it up to $1500...

You only get govt contributions it you pay into super with your AFTER tax moneys. so when you get paid it back later you can pay tax on it again...

[mattymagoo22]

You will find that emission is a global issue.

Car manufacturers have to meet global emissions set points.

So your rhetoric is not only ignorant but very narrow.

Think on a global scale... Australia is so behind for a developed western country it is beyond a joke.

Australia is behind in what way? We are such a small country, in comparison to the rest of the world, our emission output is next to nothing when compared to China. The growing trend is towards green practice across most industry, water tanks, water usage awareness, solar panels, gas/solar only hot water, fuel efficient cars and renewable fuels domestically. I thinks we're definitely headed in the right direction. If the Greens weren't so unwilling to compromise we would have some sort of policy in action on the issue of emissions.

Once we do have a policy in place it won't matter, because of the high cost of labor in this country (work choices could have resolved some of these issues) and the addition of all the extra taxes to fund an ETS or whatever it will be called, it will be cheaper to import most things from overseas (China) where no such policy exists and they can keep pumping out crap into the atmosphere.

I could ramble on and on about this stuff, I am in noway and expert on it i'm only expressing my views. For the first time in 10 years i'll be voting for a party not because I want them in power, but because I don't want the other's in.

[NISMO]

You will find that emission is a global issue.

Car manufacturers have to meet global emissions set points.

So your rhetoric is not only ignorant but very narrow.

Think on a global scale... Australia is so behind for a developed western country it is beyond a joke.

Behind from an emissions perspective, in what way.

Thinking on a global scale, we can take every single car in Aus off the road for years and it will make fark all difference to global pollution.

Whats narrow minded is people looking at the air data from the last 50-100 yrs and then thinking they are the know all's of the earth's climate and pollution.

Damn, matty, beat me to it

[NISMO]

But as for the ETS, if you really think one iota of it will be there to stop pollution, you really have issues.

An ETS is nothing but a stroke of genius by various industry groups who will make millions convincing morons that the earth will blow up tomorrow unless we raise prices of goods.

ETS my arse!

eg Electricity company A causes x pollution, in turn they have to pay x dollars in ETS. They then up the prices to me and you to cover this cost.

Please someone show me the incentive for this company to lower pollution. What a farking joke!!!!!!

Now, do the same as the above, but mandate that no company can raise a single price higher than the CPI and all of a sudden you have incentive to lower pollution.

Its so simple my 6yo can understand it. But its ok, people need to believe some bullsh!t and i guess the earth ending tomorrow because i don't have an electric car is flavour of the month.