Real Old Skyline Info

[C-Red]

I've heard Martin Donnon say his parents had a 54 on triple carbs - A GT-B perhaps?

Jash

[MegaGTS4]

I have a 91 R32 GTR that I just imported from japan, so if I wait till 2006 will I be able to register it without compliance plate?

Sorry GTAAH my wrong again!!!

MEGA

[C-Red]

Like to see you get a '91 in without a C3 Cams licence, but yeah thats the general idea.

Jash

[MegaGTS4]

GTAAH someone imported it and then I bought it from them, I guess they have the C3 Cams licence!,Thanks for the info!

MEGA

[C-Red]

What are you going to do with it? Its unregisterable without paperwork and I cant see it having the right paperwork.

Jash

[gtrken]

Originally posted by MegaGTS4

GTAAH I paid someone to import it for me!!  I guess they have the  C3 Cams licence!,Thanks for the info!

MEGA

Mate if it's come in on Rally Reg then it will stay on Rally reg forever more.

Considering the diff in costs , hardly seems worth it.

Cheers

Ken

[MegaGTS4]

aahhh.. well it wont be registered then and I will use it for the engine,gearbox,brakes,spares and so on.., in my GTS-4!(orignal plan)

Sorry GTAAH I didn't mean to hijack your thread!

MEGA

P.s They imported it and then sold it to me!!! sorry I have a way of wording things wrong!!(edited to suit and removed name!!)

[hakosuka]

For what it's worth, there are tests by Wheels Magazine and Sports Car World that have the triple Weber GT-B so it should have been sold here. It was listed in the new car prices at the back and you do see triple carbed B's for sale occasionally.

[Guest bwob]

Right again hakosuka. Roads tests of a GT-B (referred to textually only as a 'Skyline GT') appeared in the September, 1966 issues of both Wheels and Sports Car World.

I read both issues today and while the reports themselves are different, the performance data is common for Wheels and Sports Car World (both Wheels and Sports Car World were from the K.G. Murray publishing company and while they had different staff, the two magazines frequently doubled-up on performance testing). The importer was Wheelmar Motors and the car had an as-tested price of $2850.

Top speed was limited by road length, with 108.2mph (174.1km/h) the terminal velocity attained. The writer of the test in Wheels indicated that 115mph (185.1km/h) would be possible with a long enough run and that 120mph (193.1km/h) might be attained in ideal conditions. Standing start figures were 16.7 for the quarter mile, and 10.6 seconds from 0 to 60mph.

The archive at Wheels also says that there's a GT-A test in another issue (which I couldn't find in the library) and the article in Sports Car world makes a vague reference to a previous comparison test in Wheels with a Skyline GT and other machinery. I'm on deadline with news for the March issue and can't try to chase these up today. Sorry.

bwob

[C-Red]

Bwob,

I'd be real keen for a photocopy of that mate.

Jash

[Duncan]

btw bwob, your sig is spot on

[hakosuka]

Hey bwob,

was the S20 GTR/432 engine related in any way to the Prince twin cam 2 litre six that was raced in the late 1960's? I think this racing car was called the R380 or something, and it might have been rebadged Nissan R380 after the takeover.

In regard to brochures, do you have a spare KPGC10 or KPG10 brochure you want to sell, or know where I can get my hands on one? Maybe a colour copy/scan of one of yours ? I am serious.

[Guest bwob]

was the S20 GTR/432 engine related in any way to the Prince twin cam 2 litre six that was raced in the late 1960's? I think this racing car was called the R380 or something, and it might have been rebadged Nissan R380 after the takeover.

Yes it was. The R380 and R380-2 ran with the Prince-developed GR8 2.0 twincam, four-valve six. This engine served as the pattern for some aspects of the S20, though bore/stroke relationships were different. The R380 initially ran as a Prince, but it soon morphed into a Nissan and when the R380-2 redesign of the body and some chassis modifications arrived, the transformation was complete.

Nissan replaced the R380 as the company's motorsport flagship with the R381, designed to compete at Le Mans and later modified for Japan's local Can-Am like series. The engine planned for the R381 was delayed, so the car ran in Japan with a built Chevrolet big-block.

The R381 was followed by the R382, powered by a 6.0 litre twincam V12 designed by the ex-Prince mob at the former Prince R&D centre in Ogikubo. The oil crisis in late 1973 caused the pin to be pulled on the R382 (and Toyota's 5.0 litre, twin-turbo Toyota 7). I saw the R381 run at FISCO and man did it sound great. You felt the noise right down to the bone.

I'm afraid when we moved to Australia my wife made me cull the dupes from my brochure collection, so I haven't any spares of anything hakosuka. I'll see if I can locate the GT-R catalogues (Karen made sure everything got filed and stored by series) to see what colour Xerox copies might run.

bwob

[MegaGTS4]

Nissan did well in Japanese racing with their Prince R380, R381, and R382 Group 7 grand prix cars. The story of the development of the R380 is interesting. It actually started as a defeat for the Prince Motor Company in the 1964 Japanese Grand Prix, the same race that saw victory for Nissan in the Touring Sedan

R381's and 2's

Dr. Sakuri of Prince took his Skyline GT's out to race at the 64 GP, only to have them defeated by a privately entered Porsche. Immediately after the race, Dr. Sakuri set up the Prince Motoring Club and began development of the R380. The original car used a Lola chassis as its platform, with 2.6 liter 6 cylinder Prince engine as its powerplant.

The car was ready to race for the 66 Japanese GP, held on May 3 of that year. It creamed the competition, taking 1st, 2nd, and 4th places, with a Toyota V8 landing in the third spot. This was the last year these cars were raced as Princes. Nissan took over the company in August of that year. The block as well as the cylinder head were modified and of new titanium rods made their appearance, which allows a power of 240 horses.

Nissan let Dr. Sakurai continue with the development of the R380's, which turned out to be a wise move. At the 1967 Grand Prix, second generation R380's took spots 2,3,4, and 6, with Porsche Carreras filling in the blanks.

In 1968, a closed coupe R380 set an E class world record with an average speed of 251 kph over 200 miles. Third generation r380's and the all new V12 r381's were supposed to race in the 68 Jap GP, but there was a small snag. The 6 cylinder 380's were ready, but the V12 for the R381 was not. So what does a good racer do? Get another engine of course! Dr. Sakurai flew to California and bought a few Chevy V8's from famed engine builder Dean Moon. Three 6 cylinder R380's and three 430ci Chevy V8 R381's raced in 68...and won! A Chevy powered V8 Nissan took first, with another taking 6th, and the Nissan 380's taking 3,4 and 5th places. The last car suffered severe clutch damage early in the race and still managed to beat the competition.

V12 R382

The Nissan V12, basically a melding of 2 inline 6's was ready for 1969 when Motoharu Kurosawa took the checkered flag in the R382. Environmental concerns killed the program that year, but it didn't really matter, Nissan just brought the Z cars to the GP and won three years straight starting in 1971. The Z Cars wouldn't be the only ones ot make thier mark, the Skyline GT-R's would make a litte noise of their own in the years to come.(from Datsun history)

But my question is in 1966 did the R380 received a transistorised Mitsubishi Cd ignition system and a system of lucas fuel injection is this correct?

MEGA

P.s Hakosaka and bwob do you know anything about the attached pic! It might be nissan's first concept car? It was made around the same time as the R380 but if it is a nissan it would have to be the weirdest ever made! Maybe you could shed some light because I thought the 270X from 1970 was nissan's first concept car! Sorry this post was way too long!

[Guest bwob]

Mega, I've got to run out the door in two minutes to get a cab to the airport (and will be away for a week or so), but as I understand it the R380s from 66 on used the Mitsubishi ignition across the board (with a Hitachi-built copy used on two of the R380-2s at the 1968 Japan Grand Prix), though not all were using the Lucas mechanical injection hardware - some post 1966 380s were still on carbies. I'm relying on memory here, so be forewarned that I may be off-base with this one.

That picture is eerily familiar, but I won't be able to dig into the library till I get back. Sorry.

bwob

[hakosuka]

I haven't seen that car in the attachment. I remember reading about the Chev powered racing car somewhere in my vast and dusty collection of rags. I think the same issue had something about the Toyota 7 V8 too.

Lucas injection, hmmm - the mighty Prince (no pun intended ) of Darkness - didn't anybody trust Bosch in those days? Apart from Triumph, Maserati and Aston were crazy enough to opt for this system.

Did the S20 motor in the GTR ever race with Hitachi injection? It is amazing how so few people outside Japan knew how advanced the Japanese were in the car field even 30 odd years ago. When one thinks about the rubbish the Australian car industry was churning out back then (not that it has improived a great deal in 2003) it is absolutely incredible...

[hakosuka]

I haven't seen that car in the attachment. I remember reading about the Chev powered racing car somewhere in my vast and dusty collection of rags. I think the same issue had something about the Toyota 7 V8 too.

Lucas injection, hmmm - the mighty Prince (no pun intended ) of Darkness - didn't anybody trust Bosch in those days? Apart from Triumph, Maserati and Aston were crazy enough to opt for this system.

Did the S20 motor in the GTR ever race with Hitachi injection? It is amazing how so few people outside Japan knew how advanced the Japanese were in the car field even 30 odd years ago. When one thinks about the rubbish the Australian car industry was churning out back then (not that it has improived a great deal in 2003) it is absolutely incredible...