In need of help urgently !

[MRK25T]

Have a look at nengun for the parts you need.

If you dont know what nengun is, do a search on this forum.

Mark

[GTS-t VSPEC]

It is audible, but still fairly quite, I haven't tried to shield the noise yet.

[Yakuza]

Did you guys change the intercooler ?

If so, how much were you charged for the piping alone ?

[Gradenko]

Yakuza, installing the cooler using factory turbo to guard piping and alloy piping everywhere else should cost around $6-700. It could be more or less depending on what you want done.

If you've gone to all the trouble of getting a new turbo, why do you want to short change the engine on management? As great as the safc is for mild mods (I'm using one myself), it's very, very easy to reach the point where good driveability is only going to come from a full fuel and ignition control.

What turbo is going in, btw?

[Yakuza]

gradenko,

its a T04E

I'm kinda on a budget setup as i mentioned earlier. I want to go all out on management later on, maybe MoTeC ? if not then haltech.

[rob77]

If you have the dosh to lash out on a motec just buy a powerfc now. Seriously, dont waste the money on a safc2 and a tune, put it aside and run with the stock ecu till you can afford an ecu, I've been driving around on the stock ecu for about 6 weeks now since putting in the turbo and it hasnt caused any problems, if anything its kept the engine and turbo safe because it runs extremely rich.

[Gradenko]

Motec is absolutley overkill on the street. Take other ppls suggestions and go for a wolf, power fc or something plugin replaceable in that price range.

Everyone is on a budget.

[Yakuza]

What do you guys think of Microtech ?

[JimX]

For a start, 350rwhp is pushing the limits of what is safe for the stock engine internals, so I would either be rebuilding the engine with forgies or reducing your power goals slightly.

Secondly, for anything around or under this amount of power I would think an S-AFC would be an excellent intial upgrade. You should get 20-30rwkw more power over the stock ECU with the rest of the work done. I had one until recently and was mostly happy, though power started to dip once I got above 160rwkw for reasons unknown. I still managed to max out the fuel system, just power delivery above 5000rpm dipped and surged twice before redline.

I thought a PowerFC would be able to fix it so I sold the S-AFC, but while pulling everything out I discovered that my Fuel Cut Defender (which came with the car) was not hooked up at all! So now I'm thinking it would have been fine if only I had it hooked up all along.

Yes the PowerFC is definitely a better solution, but costing a grand more than the S-AFC, you have to work out if it's worth the extra money. I could have kept my car the way it was and saved $1000, and it still would have been pretty good if not perfect. An extra 30rwkw is nothing to be sneezed at. I don't expect much more power from the PowerFC, but I do expect it to be smooth out the power curve.

The only reason I decided to do this upgrade is because I sold some bit of my old PC and my old phone and put the money towards it along with the S-AFC sale. If I just had the S-AFC sale to fund the upgrade I would have held off for a lot longer.

My advice (and I've said it before) for when you're on a tight budget is to buy a second hand S-AFC, then save up for the PowerFC, and sell the S-AFC for pretty much what you paid for it when you can afford the PowerFC.

Edit: Substitute "PowerFC" above for your programmable ECU of choice

[Yakuza]

Thanks for all that info JimX ! :uh-huh:

How many kW are you running now ?

Does power FC uses MAP while tuning ?

[JimX]

Pre-tune I was getting 185rwkw on the Hills dyno. Post tune it got up to 215rwkw but dipping/surging and leaning out. Even though power does go up slightly overall from 5000 to 7000, because of the dips it feels like there's absolutely no extra power after around 5000rpm.

PowerFC uses AFM usually, but I think there are variants which use MAP. I'm happy to stick with AFM for fuel economy reasons.

[Yakuza]

JiMx,

what turbo are you using ?

Actually ppl normally tune with MAP is because of the accuracy of the boost pressure instead of just air flow. So it would be more accurate if done with MAP, doesnt mean you have to change your sensors to MAP though, its just for tuning.

[JimX]

My turbo is a T04E, flowing 450hp.

[Yakuza]

How is it ? When does it start spooling and when does it reaches its optimum point of boost ?

[JimX]

Starts pretty low, maybe 2000rpm? 10 or 12 psi by around 3500rpm. I've got it set to 1 bar so it hits full boost at around 4000. With the S-AFC tune I had there was an absolute mammoth power spike at around 4000-5000rpm which felt like a real kick in the pants, but after 5000rpm there's nothing because torque dropped right off. Power still climbed gradually and peaked at 215rwkw, but it still felt gutless above 5000.

There were a few theories thrown about as to why it does that, but the latest one is the Fuel Cut Defender not being connected. I discovered this when removing the S-AFC to sell. Hopefully it will be fixed when I install and tune the PowerFC. Even if my peak power doesn't increase, it will still feel a lot better without that torque loss up top. Example: It made 160rwkw at 5000rpm, and only 175kw at 6000rpm (and 215 at 7000).

For a cheap plain bearing turbo I think it's pretty good. Although if it is the turbo itself causing the power restriction at high revs, I may have to sell it and get something bigger. Or at least upgrade the exhaust housing.

[Yakuza]

Does the SAFC help your car alot ?

I went to a couple of tuners and they said it was a toy.

Care to elaborate on that ? I'm in dilemma now !

[Steve]

yakuza, I would recommend a full ecu, or interceptor like the e-manage. Microtech doesnt have knock detector, so I wouldnt run it personally. That little flashing light on the dash has saved my bacon a few time I am sure.

350rwhp is fine on stock internals.

The reason I would recommend management over just a SAFC is that being able to alter timing is a big advantage when trying to keep detonation at bay, rather than just fuel - and will mean a much better power delivery and therefore driveability.

You can pick up a power fc for around $1000-$1100, controller for around $400 (not that it is necessary, but a very handy thing to have). And if you ever want to sell it, you will get close to what you paid back, no probs.

There have been a few threads that go into the virtues of different ecus, doing a search would probably open your eyes a bit:)

[JimX]

Originally posted by Yakuza

Does the SAFC help your car alot ?  

I went to a couple of tuners and they said it was a toy.  

Care to elaborate on that ? I'm in dilemma now !

If you think +30rwkw is nothing, then yes the S-AFC is a toy. As Steve said though, the PowerFC is better, but it does cost a grand more. (well, $700 more if you don't want the hand controller) It's up to you what you want really. I never had any detonation problems with the S-AFC, but the cost was it was tuned a little richer than it could have been with the PowerFC.

If you have the bucks then get then PowerFC. But if you don't, get an S-AFC until you.

Edit: Another thing to consider is the tuning of both. The S-AFC is simple to tune, and costs only around $150. The PowerFC takes a lot longer and can cost upwards of $500. When I get mine I am going to road tune it as best I can before bringing into the dyno for fine tuning, which will hopefully bring the cost down.

[Yakuza]

I think i should just get an SAFC2 first and later on upgrade to a power FC or haltech. Like i said, i dont want to spend too much on parts and have no money to get the parts installed and tuned.

I really appreciate your help with all my questions, steve and jimx. Cheers mates !

Whats the average hp an RB25det can take with stock internals ?

[Steve]

300rwkw approx