250 Km From A Full Tank. Dam This Sux

[mad082]

yeah but then you have to spend a heap on a pfc then more for the software to tune it. you can get a haltech for about $1100 at the moment and the software is free and much more user friendly. you don't have to fill in every square. you can fill in a few and it will fill in the gaps. the new wolf v500 software does the same too, as will the greddy emanage ultimate software.

[MBS206]

Who the heck tunes off the hand controller? You use the datalogit, a laptop and a wideband to tune them properly.

Datalogit costs money AFAIK

Why would I want to spend EVEN MORE on an aftermarket ECU to tune it?

Tuning software should be free!

You can DL Microtech, Haltech, LINK (IIRC) Wolf, Adaptronic.

It's all free. I'm not paying $1000 for an ECU, then having ot pay more for software, what a ripoff idea! When you buy an aftermarket ECU, everything to tune it should be supplied (Or be readily available for free)

[RBwhatever]

Datalogit costs money AFAIK

Why would I want to spend EVEN MORE on an aftermarket ECU to tune it?

Tuning software should be free!

You can DL Microtech, Haltech, LINK (IIRC) Wolf, Adaptronic.

It's all free. I'm not paying $1000 for an ECU, then having ot pay more for software, what a ripoff idea! When you buy an aftermarket ECU, everything to tune it should be supplied (Or be readily available for free)

I see where your coming from, and why. Depending which other standalone ecu's your talking about, the FC and datalogit software can still be bought for cheaper price than some other ECU's that includes software.

I'm not saying the FC is the answer to everything because it's not. There are other ecu's that do the job just as good and even better. It comes down to whats going to suit you and your application.

The main point of the story is, whether its an FC or Adaptronic/Wolf/Haltech/Autronic, you take the appropriate measures to tune them properly, whether you have to buy the software or not.

But anyone that goes and tunes the FC via the handcontroller is a dipstick, when its 5 times easier to use the proper software.

It's kinda like saying that a particular performance part is crap because you don't have the proper tools to fit them and it's too hard to do with a shifter, then whinging you don't want to go and buy the right tools because it doesn't come with it.

I'm not taking a stab at you mate, just trying to make point. The FC isn't crap because it doesn't come with software and its hard to tune with a HC.

We all have different opinions as too which is better etc and I respect your opinions and decisions. Peace man

This getting off topic now.

On Topic.

WogsRus: How'd you go? I checked my vac reading last night when the car was warm at idle and it sits at 18-18.5 IN-HG.

[MBS206]

KeyMaker: Not having a go at you.

IMO if a hand controller is supplied, with the ability to tune, you should be able to tune the ECU through it, and it should be made to be done fairly easy.

Yes, the handcontroller is great for checking sensors etc, but the ECU I'm about to install, I plug the laptop in, hit one key, and I have my sensors. Not quite as "great" and "easy" as the PFC, but if I'm diagnosing my ECU/Engine, I like screen captures.

Again, Datalogit can most likely do it, but then, what is the point of the hand controller? Sales gimmick?

[RBwhatever]

KeyMaker: Not having a go at you.

IMO if a hand controller is supplied, with the ability to tune, you should be able to tune the ECU through it, and it should be made to be done fairly easy.

Yes, the handcontroller is great for checking sensors etc, but the ECU I'm about to install, I plug the laptop in, hit one key, and I have my sensors. Not quite as "great" and "easy" as the PFC, but if I'm diagnosing my ECU/Engine, I like screen captures.

Again, Datalogit can most likely do it, but then, what is the point of the hand controller? Sales gimmick?

Well as you said its good for checking all the vitals, and also making changes on the fly.

It's also there for the same reason we like to put gauges in the car, to keep an eye on things. Its not as if you keep your laptop in the car all the time, so having a HC that can edit your map(if you know what doing....i don't) or knock back a few degrees of timing or change rev limits etc is handy to have, but it's not a tuning item, its greatly limited in this respect

But yes the FC is old, and it's being overtaken by later and greater things that has more flexibility eg. MAF & MAP support in the same unit, but it still rates quite well compared to the new boys on the block as it still has its functionality & tunability. They all have their weak points & strong points. As much as being able to fully tune from the HC would be nice, its just not going to happen.

[RBwhatever]

I also understand that you'll be/are going for an Adaptronic ECU. If it was supplied with a HC to make quick on the fly changes, wouldn't that be great? But still, paying for the FC's software is a downfall that we have to accept.

Edited July 7, 2007 by KeyMaker

[WogsRus]

Hay guys, i must admit that you all have good point. I don't like a pfc mainly because of the price youpay for the name, and so forth, yes it's plug and play, but has limited features.

I have done a fair bit of work with a MegaSquirt system form the US on our targa car, and it's GREAT.

Seal map tunning, cold starts exct, but not plug an dplay as such, would need to make up a harnes and some of the sensors would need to be changed. But overall it's great.

In regards to my issues, idle warm at 650 rpm is 18 in Hg an dno more, i have read a whole heap of pages and so forth, doing all their test, it shows that everything is ok, ie no stickying valves ect.

I am doing the full pressure test again tomorrow and see what i find.

One thing i did was put the hand over teh intake and the car stalled straight away, and while under 30 in Hg of negative vac, there was no leaks that i could hear.

I need to reste the timming and the idle to ensure all to spec and go from there.

Thanks for all the advice, i'll keep you all posted.

[WogsRus]

sorry about the spealing mistakes, i'm a wog and a bit drunk.

[WogsRus]

Ok so i did a full vac pressure test, could not find any hisses ect. Took out the AAC valve cleaned it all up, was a fair bit gunky.

Will see how the car behaves tomorrow.

[Adriano]

Datalogit costs money AFAIK

Why would I want to spend EVEN MORE on an aftermarket ECU to tune it?

Tuning software should be free!

You can DL Microtech, Haltech, LINK (IIRC) Wolf, Adaptronic.

It's all free. I'm not paying $1000 for an ECU, then having ot pay more for software, what a ripoff idea! When you buy an aftermarket ECU, everything to tune it should be supplied (Or be readily available for free)

I dont understand your point, datalogit is a completely separate company to Apexi. For 99% applications the car can be tuned with the hand controller, its just easier with datalogit. Its like saying ive bought a haltech, why should i have to buy a laptop to tune it.