Sr Wont Start - Need Help Diagnosing It

[Simon-S14]

Hey all. I havent had this SR running before as ive just put it into my KE... and i'm pretty sure ive wired everything correcttly and it still wont start.

It has compression,

Timing is correct,

spark,

power to the coil,

power to injectors,

its got fuel in the rail and the injectors are pulsing while cranking. (checked with node light)

So im kinda stumped as to what it could be. I dont think its a bad ECU since ive got spark and injector pulsing... if the ecu was cooked i woulnt have this. only other thing i can think that might cause a prob is the fact its an Auto motor and ecu converted to manual... would the ecu need to be wired any differently?

any suggestions?

[paulr33]

are you using the auto ecu? it might be checking if the car is in "P", im pretty sure engine wont fire if it cant detect gearbox signal (for auto ECU).

try running ECU diag with a consult port wired that, that wouuld be the quickest way to isolate what is wrong, it even tells you why it failed to start

[VB-]

got firing order right? like wiring to the coils? spark for every cylender? injectors plugs are in right order (im assuming batch fire two cylenders at a time?) CAS is set right? IACV? everything is plugged in? AFM is known to be good? probly not much help but its a start

what model KE is it? pics?

Paul: if it was auto and not seeing park, it shouldnt crank at all?

Edited July 19, 2008 by VB-

[Simon-S14]

im beginning to think paul is on the right track, or its something far more sinister like f**ked plugs or seised injectors. this motor has been sitting around for a while.

Car is a KE70, its a S14 VVT SR20DE, mounted on S14 crossmember in the KE, was auto but i put an RB20 box with SR belhousing behind it along with SR flywheel and clutch assy.

VB: coil firing order is detirmined by the ecu, on the wiring side of things i just need to power up the eccs relay and the injectors and then the ecu takes care of itself. as i mentioned i check the timing with a gun and number 1 is firing when it is suppose to.

no pics yet but will soon

[paulr33]

i dont the logic for the auto ecu and gearbox but if he is using the auto ECU

check the gearbox sensor wire, if its got no signal or its grounded or something wierd

the ecu might not start until a certain voltage is on that signal wire ie: out of park

but this only applies if he is using the auto ecu

[Simon-S14]

the gearbox wiring loom is part of the alternator/starter loom, and the plugs dont match the box im using so nothing is plugged up, regardless, the box loom doesnt get to the ecu loom in any way so the ecu doesnt know anything about the box....

[paulr33]

well are you using the auto ecu? if yes then find what wire on the loom is the auto box signal for "P" and check where the goes

im almost dead certain if you are using the auto ecu it needs signal to detect "P" much like the manual box has "NTR" as a relay in std ECU sensors

[Simon-S14]

yeah i am, i shall have a look at the wiring diagram and suss it out.

[Simon-S14]

def not auto ecu related... i just went out to the shed then and cranked it over and it acctually fired this time... i thought wtf. took all the plugs out and found 2 wet and two dry plugs, plugs were all f**ked and worn out so replaced with new ones and it fired up this time!! didnt run too well tho as its running on either 2 or 3 cylns... signs are all pointing towards seised injectors now

[The Dan]

Hey all. I havent had this SR running before as ive just put it into my KE... and i'm pretty sure ive wired everything correcttly and it still wont start.

It has compression,

Timing is correct,

spark,

power to the coil,

power to injectors,

its got fuel in the rail and the injectors are pulsing while cranking. (checked with node light)

So im kinda stumped as to what it could be. I dont think its a bad ECU since ive got spark and injector pulsing... if the ecu was cooked i woulnt have this. only other thing i can think that might cause a prob is the fact its an Auto motor and ecu converted to manual... would the ecu need to be wired any differently?

any suggestions?

Refer to replies on NS.com

[Simon-S14]

if you read above i have eliminated most of your suggestionms but thanks for helping out anyway. ive come to the conclusion that the injectors are f**ked... it runs on 2-3 cylns now after tapping the side of the injectors with something solid.

[The Dan]

if you read above i have eliminated most of your suggestionms but thanks for helping out anyway. ive come to the conclusion that the injectors are f**ked... it runs on 2-3 cylns now after tapping the side of the injectors with something solid.

If you are local to brisbane, I have an ignition system tester that can fire an injector at 90% duty for as long as we have it connected. We can run a solution through it to try an free it up. Other than that, try swapping the injectors around to see if they move. You could also pull the dizzy out and turn it round with the ign on and see which ones are working/not. But I wouldn't advise this unless you know what you are doing as you may not put it back properly and it will not start again.

Go forth and conquer!

[The Dan]

well are you using the auto ecu? if yes then find what wire on the loom is the auto box signal for "P" and check where the goes

im almost dead certain if you are using the auto ecu it needs signal to detect "P" much like the manual box has "NTR" as a relay in std ECU sensors

Neutral start switch will stop cranking. His cranks...doesn't fire

[Simon-S14]

If you are local to brisbane, I have an ignition system tester that can fire an injector at 90% duty for as long as we have it connected. We can run a solution through it to try an free it up. Other than that, try swapping the injectors around to see if they move. You could also pull the dizzy out and turn it round with the ign on and see which ones are working/not. But I wouldn't advise this unless you know what you are doing as you may not put it back properly and it will not start again.

Go forth and conquer!

cheers for that, im in adelaide sadly so i cant take you up on the offer. I think im going to go with the tried and tested method of running it and unplugging an injector one at a time til i find the ones that arnt firing.

[Simon-S14]

well its defo injectors 2 and 4 that are stuck.... took all the plugs out and crank it over and fuel comes out of 1 and 3 but not the others, have tested the plugs on 2 and 4 with a spare injector and they pulse.

So.. whats the best way to take the rail out of an SR?

[acsplit]

get a screw driver and tap the body of the injector with a hammer on the screwdriver, if your lucky it will free them up

spark plugs can tell you lots of things ....

[BHDave]

well its defo injectors 2 and 4 that are stuck.... took all the plugs out and crank it over and fuel comes out of 1 and 3 but not the others, have tested the plugs on 2 and 4 with a spare injector and they pulse.

So.. whats the best way to take the rail out of an SR?

On an s14 it's a pita. You have to take the top half of the plenum off.

Luckily the gasket is reusable.

[Simon-S14]

GAY

someone kick me in the head... why did i buy an SR again?!?!

[BHDave]

because you're an idiot! No wait, because you're smart! Since crashing my 32 i'll probably be heading down the s chassis sr route myself....

[Simon-S14]

f**k that its an *R*32 for a reason... it wants an RB in it

i got this SR cheap for my KE70 daily... but it seems that i should have gone with my first thoughts and put a 4age in it (even if they are more expensive for an older motor with less power and a shitty EFI system)