New Wa Emmissions Laws

[R33_NICK]

will probably still fail with a 15year old cat anyway

so it makes no difference whether you have an aftermarket exhaust system or not: without the 'special' cat it wont pass pretty much. tho if you send your car to Kostecki's for tuning, cant they tune it to meet your car's emmisions of its day even with an aftermarket cat fitted?

and btw, has anyone here actually had this test done on their cars??

[Nic_A31]

Has anyone reported this scam to the ACCC and if so what has been the response.

@ Turbo x-trail...you mentioned they charge $450 for the test and $135/hr x 3 hours for a total of $855. What's the $135/hr for and why 3 hours for a 4 minute test?

Tests are done in 240 second runs, they have to adjust a lot of paramters in between tests and run a new test each time, until they nail it. Its a matter of how many retunes they need to do to get satisfactory results, sometimes its not many, sometimes its alot.

[ric777]

Tests are done in 240 second runs, they have to adjust a lot of paramters in between tests and run a new test each time, until they nail it. Its a matter of how many retunes they need to do to get satisfactory results, sometimes its not many, sometimes its alot.

Eye C....so assuming the benchmark time for these tests is around 3 hours, they really aren't going to be getting too many done in a day and if all of a sudden the cops and the pits start cranking up the amount of emmision test requests on car enthusists vehicles, there could be a very long wait and inconvenience to people, which makes this one testing facility appear even more of a scam. ...and where do the carbon spewing desiel 4x4's fit into the equation along with the old poluting HQ's and XA's?

Would be nice to be able to monitor which type of cars are being tested to determine who is being targeted. If it appears that it is only car enthusists, then a descrimination case could be levelled at the Minister, after all carbon spewing desiel's and old bunkies must surely be of concern to the environment.

[StealthX]

@ Turbo x-trail...you mentioned they charge $450 for the test and $135/hr x 3 hours for a total of $855. What's the $135/hr for and why 3 hours for a 4 minute test?

this was for set-up too. could take a fair while for car to go from the garage onto the dyno and set all the equipment going.

and Nic_A31 is right, theyll keep doing the test, re-tuning every time until it passes.

and where do the carbon spewing desiel 4x4's fit into the equation along with the old poluting HQ's and XA's?

there's a similar test that was implemented at the same time as the IM240, for diesels.

similar sort of deal, but there's bin alot less noise about it cos (erroneously) big carbon dumping 4WDs dont attract as much attention as well kept, performance cars. if the men in blue/government authorities were really worried about emissions, they would at least target said 4x4s, and the old carbon fiends like the XE/XF HQ (etc) early model cars, not well tuned good condition performance vehicles with modern technology...

[N I B]

$65 just to remove tailpipe probe and Dyno straps. Mates MX5 cost $450 hour and a total of around $3500.

[StealthX]

extracts from my e-mail to Minister O'Brien:

The part that angers most people, is the fact that the testing requires the car's engine meets standards of their respective year. This means that an early model falcons/commodores/kingswoods, most of which my now would be in far less than factory condition, are being passed, while they still blow soot, carbon and unburnt fuel into the atmosphere (due to less strict - read non-existent - emissions laws of that period), while cars of less than 10 years old, prime examples are Falcons, Commodores, Nissan Skylines, Nissan Silvias, Subaru WRXs with new technology and in great condition, are being failed. It is common knowledge that the latter mentioned cars are 'targets' for police inspections, especially with younger drivers behind the wheel. So effectively, old, dirty carbon spewing cars can be still considered legal, while newer cars, with substantially less pollutants, are being defected. How can we (the general public) be assured that the government is doing the best to help out environment, when this blatant contradiction is in existence?

I know I speak for not only myself, but for thousands of car enthusiasts, and everyday drivers who on their next drive, could well receive a bill for upwards of $900 dollars plus.

Although KEC have the appropriate testing facility, they have nowhere near enough resources to be able to test the volume of cars this new regulation now deams "illegal". The testing implies that (with no exaggeration) roughly 70% of the cars on the road would not be legal. Cars that are old or in small disrepair or with ANY exhaust modification, even if it is of manufacturer standards or above, aftermarket performance parts (turbo/superchargers, high spec camshafts, engine management systems etc.) meet this criteria along with a few brand new cars that have been proven to not meet ADR standards. The latter of which was undertaken by an indepentant car dealership in Sydney, with a VE SS commodore ute (equiped - from factory - with a 6.0L GM sourced V8 engine), a Subaru Impreza WRX STi, and a VE Commodore with the 3.6l V6 powerplant installed. Only the V6 commodore passed the testing. These cars, are fresh from the factory, are ready to be sold to average Joe and average Jane citizen, but little do they know that they could well be up for almost $3000 dollars to make their stock car, legal.

Noteworthy at this time, the test itself (which is undertaken on a chassis 'dyno') may not be suitable for some AWD or 4WD cars. Some cars with aforementioned drivetrains, cannot safely be put on a dyno to perform this test without severe, expensive damage to (and not limited to) gearbox, transfer case, differetial, drive shafts and wheel hub and bearings. Who would then pay for this repair?

[bubba]

The last statement is incorrect. You say that most AWD/4WD cars "cannot safely be put on a dyno", that isn't the case. I believe KEC only have a RWD chassis dyno, that is the problem. If they had a 4WD dyno then it wouldn't be an issue.

I'd just be very careful about what you say in your letters guys, any fallacies or inconsistencies will only serve to undermine our efforts. Make sure you know the facts.

[StealthX]

You say that most AWD/4WD cars "cannot safely be put on a dyno", that isn't the case.

this is the case for my car (x-trail) i know for sure.

due to the electronic nature of the 4WD system it cant be run on a dyno without removing the rear prop shaft - but not many x-trail owners know that.

its not possible to (even in 2WD mode) to just run two wheels independently, several of the safety features of my x-trail kick in, cos it senses that the front wheels are spinning and tries to engage the rears. goodbye rear diff.

i think 100series landcruisers have a problem with dynos too.

so yeh, we now have two problems if thats the case with their dyno.

im sure i read somewhere that they do have a 4WD dyno, but i cant find it, so i think your right.

more ammunition...

[Hanaldo]

this is the case for my car (x-trail) i know for sure.

due to the electronic nature of the 4WD system it cant be run on a dyno without removing the rear prop shaft - but not many x-trail owners know that.

its not possible to (even in 2WD mode) to just run two wheels independently, several of the safety features of my x-trail kick in, cos it senses that the front wheels are spinning and tries to engage the rears. goodbye rear diff.

i think 100series landcruisers have a problem with dynos too.

so yeh, we now have two problems if thats the case with their dyno.

im sure i read somewhere that they do have a 4WD dyno, but i cant find it, so i think your right.

more ammunition...

I think what Bubba was saying is that in your statement, you said AWD/4WD cars can not be safely put on a dyno, not that they cant safely be put on Kostecki's single drive dyno. It makes it sound like you are not aware there are AWD/4WD dyno's out there, which undermines your whole letter.

Load of rubbish, but i see where the government would get their claim from.

[bubba]

That's exactly what I was saying

[StealthX]

may not be suitable for some AWD or 4WD cars

I'm certain i read somewhere that they have a 4WD dyno.

I can't for the life of me find it, but I'm pretty sure of it...

[endless]

Well some news that one of the members on Antilag posted up this evening.

Good news..

- MEMBER ALERT -

ARD, AADA, IVD, AAR, ATD, FID, ERD MEMBERS

20 August 2009

CHANGES TO EMISSION TESTING TO LIGHT VEHICLES IN WESTERN AUSTRALIA

As a result of considerable concern within the automotive industry about a complete change to emission testing arrangements for light vehicles in Western Australia a meeting was held at the MTA last week involving automotive repairers and representatives from the Department of Transport involved in the emissions testing arena. At that meeting a number of issues were discussed that have arisen as a result of the release of Vehicle Safety Standards Information Bulletin in March 2009 which took effect in April 2009.

The issues included;

· The lack of consultation with industry ;

· The inadequacy of the number of testing facilities;

· Problems with the replacement of catalytic converters;

· A series of issues relating to LPG installations;

· The lack of education campaign for members of the public; and

· No procedures in place for present for 4WD emission testing.

As a result of the discussions at the meeting, the following actions have been proposed to the Minister for Transport and his Department:

· The Information Bulletin on IM240 testing needs to be immediately withdrawn to allow consultation with industry and only reinstated when there is appropriate infrastructure in place to support the policy.

· That consideration is given to setting up a government testing facility along similar lines to that available in NSW.

· Testing facilities need to be made available to regional Western Australia.

· There needs to be a public education program to inform the community about the changes.

· There is a need to consult with the Police about the changes and future enforcement measures.

· There needs to be further consultation with industry over a 4WD testing regime.

· There needs to be much greater consultation with industry over the testing of LPG fitted vehicles particularly those that would fail an emission test prior to the installation of a gas system.

· There needs to be a system of accreditation of component parts that are deemed to be compliant particularly with catalytic converters and exhaust systems.

I have urged the Minister to take immediate steps to suspend the Information Bulletin to avoid any further outcry from industry and the risk of embarrassment to the Department. I will be meeting with the Minister tomorrow, Friday 21st August and emissions testing will be high on the agenda for that meeting.

I will keep you informed of all further developments.

Yours sincerely

PETER FITZPATRICK AM, JP, FSAE, GAICD

Chief Executive

[Nic_A31]

f**kin BAM!

Keep the complaints flooding in on them guys!! they'll crack eventually!!! yeeeeeehaaaaww!!!!!!

AHEM, sorry...nah, good work guys! Bout time we saw some light.

[Mayuri Krab]

Thats some good news.

[R33_NICK]

gee finally they've realised the error of their ways. good news indeed. the test might come back but at least it will be better than when they started then.

[Guest]

So who is going to be pro active by replacing that De Cat pipe just not with a "race use only" cheap arse Chinese cat but a descent OBD II/Euro compliant one.

The more people who get pinged for De Cat pipes and $15 US Cats the more strength policy's like these have............ What do think rushed this one through.

[bubba]

Nothing has been won yet guys, all that release states is that the MTA is pissed off and on the case. Fortunately, they (as a body) are in a much better position to fight this than your average Joe.

DRIFTT, I don't think anybody should be proactively doing anything in regards to purchasing new cats until there is an accreditation system as mentioned by the MTA.. wouldn't want to go spend $_$ on a supposedly compliant cat to then have it fail the test or not be on the list.

Edited August 21, 2009 by bubba

[R31 POWER]

So this means i can leave the yellow stain on the rear bumper now?

[urtwhistle]

HOOORAYYYYYY A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION AT LEAST

[Probation]

one of my mates who just finished doing an evo 5 transplant into a ce mirage had these hoops to jump through too, the lucky thing for him was, in his state its funded by the government or sumthin, and he only had to pay a couple of hundred dollars, if you ship your car to the eastern states to get the emissions test done im sure that would work out cheaper?