Torque of an F1 engine

[Smurf]

Hi,

You always hear about the hp of F1 engines and CART engines. I've heard anywhere between 800hp (approx 615kw) and 950hp (approx 730kw) for F1 engines and 750hp (approx 577kw) for CART engines. Any idea the level of torque these engines have. I think someone said a couple of years ago that F1 engines have around 700nm. I guess torque isn't as important due to the low overall weight. Has anyone have some info they can share.

Note: All hp/kw figures are at flywheel.

Cheers

[DAN00H]

best place to look is the F1 and cart related web sites.

[INASNT]

They rev to 18,000rpm to compensate for their lack of torque.

The stroke of a F1 engine is so short hence the lack of torque for the amount of hp they put out.

[martydaman]

They rev to 18,000rpm

im pretty sure its 19,000 RPM, not that it would make much of a difference

[djr81]

To give you a ball park number:

To get 750kW at 19,000rpm requires a torque figure of 376Nm. So the peak number would be of the order of 400Nm, ie not much.

[siksII]

im pretty sure its 19,000 RPM, not that it would make much of a difference

Different teams use different rev limits depending on track/engine longevity etc..

so there is no set limit, but most teams run betwen 17000 and 19000 depending on the track.

if u watch f1 lately you would have seen they show live telemetry on the screen that shows speed and revs... pretty good to watch the revs rarely drop below about 13500 in most races.

[martydaman]

yea i did see them, and basically every team i saw shitfed at 19,000... its possible that other teams such as minardi and jordan have lower limits but all the top sides shift at 19,000 (eg. Ferrari, Williams and jag were the ones i saw)

[Silver-Arrowz]

The revs you see on the TV aren't accurate. ITV use the accustics of the engine to determine the RPM. Teams wouldn't want to give away how many revs their engines are producing to the opposition.

Check out

http://www.f1technical.net/article13.html

[leb]

To give you a ball park number:

To get 750kW at 19,000rpm requires a torque figure of 376Nm.  So the peak number would be of the order of 400Nm, ie not much.

400Nm of torque is a heap, especially that f1 cars weigh bugger all

[siksII]

The revs you see on the TV aren't accurate. ITV use the accustics of the engine to determine the RPM. Teams wouldn't want to give away how many revs their engines are producing to the opposition.

Check out

http://www.f1technical.net/article13.html

i knew that all the teams are secretive about the specs of their cars, and was surprised when i saw the revs on the screen, you have just resolved that issue for me! i knew they would never reveal their revs

[nmcmahon83]

I once heard Martin Brudle say that the pistons in an F1 car about the size of a biscuit!

Hence how they get them to rev so hard.

Also the reason why they only last 200km maybe 300km these days.

[martydaman]

the regulations say that the total displacement cant be more than 3 ltr (3000cc)... is this going to remain the same when the V8 regulations are put in?

[lwells]

I once heard Martin Brudle say that the pistons in an F1 car about the size of a biscuit!

Hence how they get them to rev so hard.

Also the reason why they only last 200km maybe 300km these days.

Actually, the piston size has has much to do with the displacement requirements too. The high revving has a lot to do with pnuematic lifters.

[Silver-Arrowz]

New regs say that engine has to be a 2.4L V8.

Simply, they are the old V10's with 2 pistons chopped off the end. This would save teams having to R&D engines from scratch, hence costing more money.

Yeah if it weren't for pnuematic valves they would have real issues reving high cause of valve bounce.

[martydaman]

holy shit... 2.4L V8?? im interested in seeing what kind of power they'll end up putting out. But in the past, for example when the V10 3000cc rule was implemented the cars still pulled out record power and broke lap records, so the engines will still be poweful but ill miss that high pitched scream which they have down the straight... it wont be the same

I heard these rules were put in for cost cutting and to attract more teams into the competition by making it cheaper to compete. Are there other reasons??

[INASNT]

holy shit... 2.4L V8?? im interested in seeing what kind of power they'll end up putting out. But in the past, for example when the V10 3000cc rule was implemented the cars still pulled out record power and broke lap records, so the engines will still be poweful but ill miss that high pitched scream which they have down the straight... it wont be the same

I heard these rules were put in for cost cutting and to attract more teams into the competition by making it cheaper to compete. Are there other reasons??

Yes because ferrari can afford to spend billions on on part of their car when other teams have even less money for their whole car.

[awurth]

I don't think That figure of 400nm is right. The Honda VTR1000S SP2 is 99Kw/102NM, and that is a simple 1 liter production engine. There is no way a multi million dollar motor is only going to put out around 400NM. But in saying that I don't know what they put out.

I also heard on RPM that teams are going to run a breakaway series in 2006 (Date?).

[Silver-Arrowz]

The figures are pretty much on par. F1 engines really lack torque. Engine manufacturers chase after power, not torque.

The breakaway series is after the current Concord agreement which expires after 2008. It's all about Bernie Ecclestone's profit from the F1 series. The teams want a more bigger slice of the action.

[SS8_Gohan]

I was watching the Indy cars for a little bit before work last Sunday, and they say they were running Turbo 2.4ltr V8's??? Weird combo, altho i understand that higher revving engines seem to have less displacement, but i thought it was interesting to see a small capacity V8 with a Turbo and they said around 700hp

I like it. Compact'ish V8 with a blower, think that would be cool to see in a production car. Altho it seems torque may be a problem

So is Indy the CART thing people are talking about?

Are the F1's going to go Turbo again? Oh yeah, the Indy engines were running STUPID boost, i must have heard the commentator wrong, 30-40 psi??? Must have heard wrong...

cheers.

[martydaman]

im pretty sure that turbo's arnt going to ever be allowed in F1. They have rules against the forceful manipulation of air.

I remember reading about the F1 fan car, which basically used a gaint fan to suck up air from the ground (thus keeping it down), that model was scraped due to the rule that was put in.