More new laws?

[D-G]

I heard something about some new law that will once again effect people on their P and L plates. From the start they had stuffed this up, a learner is allowed to drive a powered car, yet a P plater, one who is more qualified and probably used to the power of the previous car they were driving cannot drive it once on there P plates.

I find this stupid, and if no one understood what i just said...in simple terms, on your L's you can drive basically any car you want, BUT once you hit your P's the laws of power come into play. WHAT IS THE POINT OF THAT!?

Heard some guys on the radio argueing about it and thought i'd say it just incase im wrong about this. Does anyone know what exactly is going on with this, and how the government are planning to "change" or "fix" this "problem"?

These new laws seem to be getting more confusing as they go on with them, it was bad enough they put 40km/h in school zones and even out of school zones for a long duration of time. Something like: 8:00a.m - 10:30a.m and then 2:30p.m - 4:00p.m.

Anyway just please paste a post on the main topic and what you think about it! :uh-huh:

[prae]

That isn't a new law, L platers have been able to drive any car as long as there was a fully licensed person supervising them (parent, relative, instructor etc) for a while now. May be stupid, but eh, as inconsistent as Centrelink

The power-to-weight and engine capacity-to-weight ratios imposed in Victoria were put in place to reduce P plater fatalities and accidents etc. Debatable issue, but as long as the ageing government and traffic authority officials have their way and hoons continue with their actions, these laws are here to stay for quite a while.

[r34_skyline]

Then again, Learners need a full licenced driver next to them. chances of them being stupid with their parents in the car is low.

[leb]

But what if the kid (Learner) is angry at the parent and refuses to obey his/her instructions? Just because theres a fully licensed driver supervising doesn't mean its safe. All the time you hear of Learner driver killing them and their families as they're driver the commonwhore v8 family car.

[D-G]

I would of thought after your L's you get the point of what a car can and cant do. Simple terms is a car cannot be in full control all the time, its a machine. But why should they let Learners drive powerful cars! I really dont understand it... supervised or not, anything can happen.

[BiZzReVhEad]

I just want to say . Tuff Shit to all the P platers out there . I think its time this law came into place im sorry to say . Most of the people driving the High performance cars have never had a chance to LEARN how to drive , and stepping into a car like a Skyline they think they can do anything (dont we all sometimes but ) .

If someone was on their L plates and was driving a Big v8 i would think , oh someone it letting he/she drive their nice car . I wouldnt think they owned it. As for most of the people out there getting their P's being under the age of 20 i would have to agree with theses laws. Most of them dont deserve such a nice car .

I would like to know how many cars they owned before that and how long for .

As i would think learning would take alot more then 1 year. The Advanced driving courses Luffy does are great if u complete it im sure you will have The experience then to consider what type of car you want when your off your P's.

Dont rush it , you dont want to cut your life short now

Sorry If ive offended you all

[TEAMSHADOW]

aye bizzrevhead, would u still be saying tuff shit to p platers if u were still one of em as well?

[oscar32]

I would teamshadow.

The only reason I survied my P plates was the joys of an underpowered car. I totaly agreed with BiZz, there is no way a p plater needs to be driving a massivley powered car.

You may THINK that you can drive great, and no one can quite understand just how great a driver you are.. accidents happen quickly, and can happen to you.

The truth is there is no replacing pratice, and courses to a lesser extent, and on your p's you've only just begun to drive.

These power to weight laws are long overdue, and will probably save lives. Its the only real solution, remember some of the other ideas that were thrown around?? Curfews, older age resrictions... they could have made everyone wait till they were 19 to be able to drive by themselves. So really, having to wait a little bit of extra time to get a fast car is a pretty good compromise.

If anyone can tell me why a P plater needs a horsepower beast, tell me. Cause if the answers on the street you are risking lives.

[SuAvE-1]

I would agree that L platers probly won't be doing stupid things while their parents are in the car with them. L plater gets pissed off at their parents? Even most s..t boxes can do over 100k/hr - doesn't matter how high-powered the vehicle is, unless it is an old datto, or a volvo :wassup: , any car can be unsafe given mistreatment.

The power to weight ratio limit imposed on P platers in Victoria (don't know about anywhere else) isn't really enforced from what I've seen. I see P platers everywhere with cars over the limit (except newer SS commodores which cops know are over) but once again, its not what a car is capable of, its what the driver is capable (or not so capable) of.

The P platers who are going to have an accident are going to have one regardless of whether their car does 12's, 14's, or 17.5's!

Other restrictions on P platers would save more lives than the one in question. The fact that P platers are allowed a zero-alcohol tolerance is excellent I think, even if it does mean I can't have a drink 1-2 hours before I drive.

Bizzrevhead - "they don't deserve it"??? Who knows what endeavours they had to overcome to get "such a nice car". It that generalising mentality which allows ridiculous restrictions and laws to begin in the first place.

Finally, an L plater with 'responsible' parents say who had a VY SS Commodore would learn what its like to lose traction in the wet with a quick throttle. Having the parent there to excercise caution would prove a valueable lesson learnt. I had this sort of experience when I was young, and I'm very proud to say I've never had an accident, never caused one, avoid many accidental attempts by others no matter which car i was driving, rain, hail or shine.

/rant :headspin:

[r34_skyline]

yes, leb. i'd have to agree with that. but really, parents have the power. if my son did something stupid(purposely) or did it in anger. i would be ever soo happy to tell him to get out of the car and walk home. kids are kids. they need to be taught and controlled.

ok, can i ask every single p-plater out there something ?? when u broke the news to your parents saying that your first or 2nd car blah blah was gonna be a skyline, how did they react ? were they like suuure np ? or were they like helll no upfront ?

My parents didnt take the news too well about me gettin the skyline, even though i've been driving for awhile now. actually, at first they forbidded me to drive such powerful cars. but later on, they kinda went like, think with your head when you're on the road with the car. mind u, i still havent got the car yet.

Another thing. whats with this craze of needing to mod up your skyline with bigger turbos etc ? if you're a regular tracker i can understand. but if you're on the road, why do u need more power than required ? its not like a race against time. i dont mind the usual catbak exhaust etc. thats ok. guess im abit crazy eh ? lol

[DivHunter]

Most of them dont deserve such a nice car .

Couldn't afford one then yourself? I know 19yo guys with BRAND NEW 350Zs, good on 'em too bad my dad couldn't give me a high paid cushy job.

If anyone can tell me why a P plater needs a horsepower beast, tell me. Cause if the answers on the street you are risking lives.

If you can tell me why a fully licensed driver needs one I'll tell you why a P plater needs one

About the 'L plater less likely to be stupid'. How do you think this whole debate came up again? A L plater in a clubsport killed the whole family of 5, head on with a truck - NOT the truckies fault which was nice to see pointed out.

[arm85]

I may be a bit biased because i drive a skyline and am a green P plater, i dont feel you can out right ban us from driving high performance cars because alot of us are very responsible behind the wheel but i believe a one chance policy should apply if they F**K up once i mean dangerous driving burnouts, major speeding take there car off them for 6 months and make them pay to keep it in a lockup its the only wat they will learn, they do it again and take there car and sell it.

[slow13dude]

There's no substitute for practice.

Just because you can drive your FF 1985 Corolla OK in the dry on a sunny day doesn't mean you can handle a FR Turbo R33 GTST in the wet at night. Learn the conditions in a lesser car, so the consequences of making a mistake are a lot less.

Too much throttle accidentally on the Corolla? No worries, you go from 60KM/h to 65KM/h

Same mistake in the Skyline takes you from 60KM/h to 75KM/h

You have to be able to bench press 100Kg before you can bench press 120Kg, etc.

[Jordan]

I have had my fair share of stupid "at fault" accidents all thru my first years of L's and P's.

Each accident was my fault. You dont know your limits untill you break them and with luck you will still be alive to have learned something from them.

I have exceeded all my limits AND the gone past the edge of the cars capabilities already and I know exactly where they are. I know to back off when its getting too dangerous, for myself and for others around me.

You say you are safe because you have never had an accident?

GTF away from me, your a timebomb with no fuse. It will happen one day and I dont want to be around you or especially inside the same vehicle with you when it does.

Now I'm not arguing that some of you dont know what the right things are, or how to drive well. But do you know what NOT to do?

For example, You know its not nice to squeeze in front of a Semi-trailer when coming up to a set of lights, but do you know WHY? Do you sit in the turning lane waiting for a gap in the traffic with your wheels pointing into the line of oncoming cars? Have you ever been caught in traffic tailgating someone at speed and suddenly realising that they have already hit the breaks and YOU wont be able to stop in time? Pop quiz hotshot, its too late to break it down and think about it because its already happened and I hope the damage is something that can be fixed at a panel beaters and that all parties were comprehensively insured.

Can YOU see all the hidden dangers and potential disasters waiting out there? Can you really?

I cant, and it scares the shit out of me when I think about the close calls I have had in the past 10 years.

Going to the track and open days will fast-track your growth for the better in regards to vehicle response and reaction. The best drivers out there are the ones who have had both the time AND the experience in the real world and who stay sharp and learn from everything that happens around them.

Because as soon as you stop learning and watching out for others as well as yourself then why bother anymore*.

*then you will be no better than my mom.

She has been driving for 40 years and hasnt learnt anything new with her driving for the last 30. Always speeding and not looking around, I remember she was being followed by the police for 10 mins with their lights on and flashing because she didnt look in the rear-view mirror unless the car was going backwards (she was speeding 20kph+ at the time).

We got her a new Subie Outback not too long ago and it WAS looking a little ruff around the edges. Dings and scrapes everywhere from carparks, bumping into parked cars, reversing into waist high bollards that she didnt see behind her. She dosent have an excuse, she dosent even accept what she's done, but she points the finger and blames everyone but herself.

I do mean "was", because last month she left the drivers door open and reversed out of the garage fast and took down the side corner of the garage and dropped the raised roller door onto the roof, Insurance covered everything and the car is in much better condition now. It still wasnt her fault it happened.

[SuAvE-1]

I'm a time bomb? You got no idea what sort of driving experience that I've had. My last car was a series 4 rx-7, i tested the limits of that car and exceeded them, jus as you have (in a controlled environment ofcourse). I've become very familiar with every car i've owned, if i'm not familiar with it, i'll be very cautious with it.

This debate is about whether or not L platers should be allowed to drive over powered cars, and there is no subsitute for experience. They reccommend 120hours on L's, I did at least 500 hours. I got my L's the day I turned 16, got my p's the day I turned 18 (pretty much). I did 40,000klms of driving in my first year. This may not seem like much to someone over 21, but don't assume anything about me or anyone else who drives on the road. I haven't had an accident yet because I regonise many tricky situations waiting to happen. I don't do stupid manouvers and I drive a relatively high powered car because when I want or need power, I got it.

Btw, you'll never see me doing stupid s... with other people in the car, no matter how safe i think it is.