Front And Dump Pipe In 1 Dilemma

[Johnny Cash]

Hey guys,

I'm asking for your help (once again), this time with the front and dump pipe set-ups available.

I noticed the Flying Performance and X-Force ones on eBay are around 250 delivered, whereas the Batmobile Split dump ones are around 470 delivered.

While I admit that the BTMBL ones give out more power, it's only around an additional 5-10rwkw. When you consider it's an extra $200 on top of a Flying Performance / X-Force style front and dump, I'm not sure if it's good value for money.

No offence to Mr. BTMBL, I'm sure for people that want to squeeze every last kilowatt, it's really good. But I'm thinking that the $200 I'll save by getting a cheaper dump and front pipe allows for a fuel pump, and that's probably a better use of the money for me.

Just asking if you all think that the BTMBL dump and front is worth the extra cash, or should I just get the X-Force style one and put the spare money towards other parts.

Let me know!

Thanks,

Adrian.

[paulr33]

batmbl will be worth it

its a front and dump in one combo and its split for more 30 cms which is ideal

[RBFIRE]

200 bucks for 5-10kw, that is good for the money, IMO

[Johnny Cash]

Fair enough, I guess I spent $160 on the high flow cat, and thats only good for around 10rwkw, so it probably does work out.

That just means I'll have to hold out for a while longer. Maybe I should get fuel pump first.

[paulr33]

you want to decrease backpressure and prevent turbulance when the int gate flap opens, the batbml split dump accomplishes this by splitting them for more than 30cms. the xforce one will just be a bigger pipe

[Johnny Cash]

you want to decrease backpressure and prevent turbulance when the int gate flap opens, the batbml split dump accomplishes this by splitting them for more than 30cms. the xforce one will just be a bigger pipe

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

True, but at the same time, you have to look at it as $200 for around 10rwkw, which works out to around $20 per rwkw.

I guess a front mount intercooler kit is around $500 and only offers a gain of around 15rwkw. That's around $35 per rwkw, so I guess this is even better value for money. Guess I gotta do it!

Thanks.

[paulr33]

an intercooler will give you 0rwkw.

rubbish figures. i dont even reckon the exhaust will give you that much.

again the point of split dump is to take away turbulance in the exhaust housing, you can't put a rwkw rating on that

[Johnny Cash]

an intercooler will give you 0rwkw.

rubbish figures. i dont even reckon the exhaust will give you that much.

again the point of split dump is to take away turbulance in the exhaust housing, you can't put a rwkw rating on that

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

An intercooler gives you 0rwkw? Doesn't it cool down intake temp, making more power???

Correct me if I'm wrong, please!

[Aaron32]

Go with the xforce 3" mild steel from justjap. $180 delivered

I installed mine on friday, very good fit.

[paulr33]

fitting an intercooler to your car as is and changing nothing else gives you;

no power gain, 0, zilch, nothing

a bit of throttle lag as you have pressurize the pipework and core

this means each time you open the throttle you have to fill up the nice big 600x300 core and pipework with pressure before the throttle body see's anything else, its a noticable slight delay

[Johnny Cash]

Go with the xforce 3" mild steel from justjap. $180 delivered 

I installed mine on friday, very good fit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is it worth the extra $70 to get the polished one? Won't mild steel rust?

I'll have to check out justjap.

Thanks.

[Roy]

an intercooler will give you 0rwkw.

rubbish figures. i dont even reckon the exhaust will give you that much.

again the point of split dump is to take away turbulance in the exhaust housing, you can't put a rwkw rating on that

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Cant agree with you there. On an R32, even without a boost controller you will pick up a few psi purely becuase of the improvement in flow. So the few psi for nothing is bound to give you more power, and you cant wind any boost out of it as you will be running the minimum spring pressure. Even if it doesnt really cool the inlet charge a whole lot (which it is bound to) the extra psi will give you power.

As for the dump pipe. Technically to hook up to the car you need a dump pipe and a front pipe. From memory the X-Force is a dump pipe, the Batmbl ones are a combined dump front pipe so are great value. No point having upgraded dump and cat if you are still goignto run the shocking press bend front pipe

[paulr33]

sorry do you disagree with the fmic comment ?

im confused which one you dont agree with

[Aaron32]

From memory the X-Force is a dump pipe, the Batmbl ones are a combined dump front pipe so are great value.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The Xforce is a one piece front and dump pipe.

[Roy]

sorry do you disagree with the fmic comment ?

im confused which one you dont agree with

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you put your std R32 GTST with exhaust on a dyno, you will get XXrwkws. If you bolt on an intercooler and throw it back on the dyno you will make a few extra kws. Wont be huge, but like anything with turbo cars, its about having the right building blocks to make the power you are after. If you can somehow increase the effeciency of turbo cars its almost free power

There are guys making the same amount of power with std intercoolers, side mount intercoolers etc... but i know what i would rather then minute i boost the thing up for a blast up and down the gears a few times

My boost went from about 0.7 to 0.85 bar just by installing my HKS Type S intercooler. Didnt touch the wastegate. And the car had more top end, so i disagree that you wont make any more power if you just fit an intercooler

[paulr33]

i dont understand how it would increase pressure ?

[Roy]

I dunno...it does

I could sit back and say that the pressure is still pumping out whatever airflow and psi. Rather then having a rather large 4-5 psi pressure drop accross the std piping and intercooler. The pressure drop is removed so the inelt manifold now sees more pressure.

Its been that long since i have seen the std turbo setup on an RB20, but i seem to recall that the wastegate is plumbed up to the compressor cover, so it opens based on the discharge pressure form the nozzle of the turdo, not from the pressure that the inlet manifold sees.

Well at least thats the best i can make of it

[paulr33]

taking away the heat charge should change the air density, so that would possibly increase pressure or make it more dense

[Roy]

taking away the heat charge should change the air density, so that would possibly increase pressure or make it more dense

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe...i suppose its possible...but i think it comes back to the simple fact that the RB20DET uses a vacuum/boost like straight off the compressor housing. So it is dumb/clueless to whatever pressure the engine is seeing.

All it knows is it sees a certain pressure on the discharge nozzle of the turbo and it will begin to crack open the wastegate robbing the engine of power.

So between the compressor cover and the inlet manifold there is this abomination of piping and an intercooler with a large pressure drop. Not only does this pressure drop rob the engine of boost but it does a pretty poor job of cooling the air.

So introduce something with only a 1 psi pressure drop accross it, and all of a sudden the engine will be seeing basically the same pressure as the compressor cover. You are not working the turbo any harder, you are not stessing anything more then std, in fact its probably less stressed. Its stress / guilt free power provided you can afford the intercooler

[Busky2k]

You know, if anything an aftermarket core will have more pressure loss because of the much much longer tubing (ie 500-600mm!) it has to travel thru. I wouldnt be suprised if the stock one outflowed an aftermarket one. But the temperature drop would be second to none.

FMIC doesnt give power on its own really, it allows more power to be made by letting you turn up the boost safely especially in hotter weather.

EDIT - To illustrate my point a while ago with my stockie intercooler (same size on the skylines I believe) I had a boost gauge pre and post intercooler. THe difference was only about 1.5psi at 6000rpm, when the car was making approx 170rwkw. Thats stuff all really...

Edited February 13, 2006 by Busky2k