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Question On Pon Cams

writeoff

By writeoff,
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writeoff Mentor

writeoff

Posted
Posted

I'm finally about to order the gear for a power upgrade on my R32 GTR.

The list so far includes:

HKS GTSS

HKS dumps

Apexi PFC + HC

Sard 700cc injectors

Bosch Z32 AFMs

Tomei AFM Adapters

Tomei Sump Baffle Plate

NISMO Fuel Pump

N1 Oil Pump

I've already upgraded the clutch, oil cooler, oil relocation kit, oil catch can, turbo back exhaust with a high flow cat, 125mm FMIC, front pipes, HKS airpods, suspension, brakes, flywheel and gearbox.

I'm after 300-320 kW that spools early, has low-end power and is responsive. Car is driven mainly in the Adelaide hills with an aim to do track days. I will probably take it to the drags once (more if I enjoy it) but that's not my priority.

My question is do I need pon camshafts and if so which one?

From the nengun site it states: http://www.nengun.com/tomei/pon-camshafts-pulley-set

Type A

In order to get stable idle and raise low-mid RPM torque, we set the duration of EX camshaft shorter.

Best suit used with stock turbine or N1 turbine.

Duration IN 260 EX 252 Lift 9.15

Type B

By giving longer duration timing than type a, it eables to raise both response and peak power at the same time, even with mid-large sized turbine.

Duration IN 260 EX 260 Lift 9.15

Looking at the other SAU guys who've posted their dyno results here http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...showtopic=93880

most with HKS GTSS turbos & poncams have the IN & EX 260 (Type B). But reading the info from Nengun and believing that the GTSS are similar to N1 turbos wouldn't the Type A be more suitable?

Cheers.

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GTRsean Grand Master

GTRsean

Posted
Posted

Most people aim for the mid to high end of rpm range cos they see the peak outputs up there. I'm interested to know as well as I was planning on around step 1 262 cams. I'd get some opinions on what people have got and what they drive like. Should be a few....

Good luck with your choice.

writeoff Mentor

writeoff

Posted
  • Author
Posted
I've been advised to use stock cams with my GT-SS/RB26 setup.

That's interesting. Why?

I kind of expected to get answers or opinions on this question from R31Nismoid, Beer Baron, wrxhoon, pnblight & 700HP-GTR33.

I would really appreciate input from HKS26T, Snowman, williamsF1, GTR032, jonn, yug r34, pure_methamphetamachine, The Alchemist, SLVR32GTR & RH9 who either have the turbos, poncams, or both to know what info they had that effected their decision to buy. What are your experiences/recommendations?

Cheers

Blitz Grand Master

Blitz

Posted
Posted
That's interesting. Why?

I kind of expected to get answers or opinions on this question from R31Nismoid, Beer Baron, wrxhoon, pnblight & 700HP-GTR33.

I would really appreciate input from HKS26T, Snowman, williamsF1, GTR032, jonn, yug r34, pure_methamphetamachine, The Alchemist, SLVR32GTR & RH9 who either have the turbos, poncams, or both to know what info they had that effected their decision to buy. What are your experiences/recommendations?

Cheers

Im currently using all the same parts you have listed including GT-SS's with Type B Poncams and putting out ~315awkw on CRD's dyno.

I have seen other cars with the same turbo setup setup but stock RB26 cams only manage 280awkw on the same dyno.

writeoff Mentor

writeoff

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
im doing similar mods to you but im using gt2860r-5 and will not be using cams.aiming for 320kw so maybe save money and see how the setup goes without them..

my2c

I've been reading about your power upgrade with interest. I may contradict myself now as I saw the HKS 2530s for sale and $2000 seems a good price for these turbos with HKS dumps. Mushi Mushi states that they come on at full boost at 3200-3500 rpm but from what I've read this is about 1000rpm sooner than I could expect... right?

With the money I'd save over new turbos & dumps I could get the Type B pon camshafts.

Edited by writeoff
R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

Posted
Posted

Why? Because my tuner has played around with it all.

And i trust the best result will be attained. :D

I will have cam gears on there though to move things around a bit.

I also wanna push the stock gear as far as it can go and then compare with Nick(blitz), Andrew(Snowman) and others who have differing parts to what mine will have and see what strengths and weaknesses all setups have.

I dont mind giving things a go even if they dont workout right.

If, after comparing with the others that i feel there is a gain to be had, then for sure i'll start fishing around and looking at cams and that sort of thing, but i wanna give the stocker gear/tuners advice a crack first as i have not been failed by the advice ive been given :)

In saying that, Ferni has GT-SS/Stock cams and has made 300rwkw thus far and i have a couple extra parts than him for mine.

Hope that gives you my insight into it.

JAGR33 Grand Master

JAGR33

Posted
Posted
I've been reading about your power upgrade with interest. I may contradict myself now as I saw the HKS 2530s for sale and $2000 seems a good price for these turbos with HKS dumps. Mushi Mushi states that they come on at full boost at 3200-3500 rpm but from what I've read this is about 1000rpm sooner than I could expect... right?

With the money I'd save over new turbos & dumps I could get the Type B pon camshafts.

What hp shot of NOS is mushi mushi running?? or is he running a stroker?? stock turbos get full boost above 3000rpm, can't see how 2530's can get full boost by 3200rpm...

maybe mushi can post up a dyno graph to prove it...

Let's just say that 2530's are bigger than the 2560R-5, and they get full boost above 4000rpm....

Am I the only one thinking this is a croc???

DVS JEZ Grand Master

DVS JEZ

Posted
Posted

my car has a different turbo setup but thought i would gilve ,my 2 cents,

found with stock cams my car was making 321awkw and then with poncams 260 9.15's went up to 344awkw, boost was came on sooner with more midrange and topend torque/power, was quite happy with the results,

will be good to see the setups you guys have and see the differences in power with/without cams,

blk180 Veteran

blk180

Posted
Posted

I will be having my car tuned soon 2530s with stock cam soon but i can tell you they dont come on to after 4000rpm on my current tune.

current tune has stock dump/fronts which is being rplaced now with full HKS turbo back exhurst system.

edited

R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

Posted
Posted

I think we should only compare GT-SS with GT-SS, the 2530's definately get cam treatment of some kind... where (what we are debating here) is whether the GT-SS need them or not, which is interesting thus far :D

writeoff Mentor

writeoff

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
Im currently using all the same parts you have listed including GT-SS's with Type B Poncams and putting out ~315awkw on CRD's dyno.

I have seen other cars with the same turbo setup setup but stock RB26 cams only manage 280awkw on the same dyno.

Thanks for your input Blitz. This is the kind of information I was after.

I note that williamsF1, The Alchemist & HKS26T also have HKS GTSS Turbos with the Type B poncams. Has anyone ever seen or heard of using the Type A poncams?

PS - going to stick with the original plan. Just got excited over the thought of cheap(er) turbos.

Edited by writeoff
R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

Posted
Posted
What hp shot of NOS is mushi mushi running?? or is he running a strocker?? stock turbos get full boost above 3000rpm, can't see how 2530's can get full boost by 3200rpm...

maybe mushi can post up a dyno graph to prove it...

Let's just say that 2530's are bigger than the 2560R-5, and they get full boost above 4000rpm....

Am I the only one thinking this is a croc???

I worked out where it was said.

For Sale section, he is trying to sell off a set of 2530's... so of course he is going to make them sound as good as he can... even if its highly unrealistic

wrxhoon Grand Master

wrxhoon

Posted
Posted

Cams will make a difference mid to high RPM, you can use either type A or B, not much difference in them but i would go for type B.

I don't have cams in my car because I didn't want to open my engine and its easier to pass emisions test if need be.

You can't really compare different cars on different dynos because you will get different power figures. Even the same car on the same dyno the same day you can have different power figure .

The bits you listed above will give you good power through the rev range and a very good response if you have a healthy stock engine but don't expect huge power up high.

I have GTSS turbos in mine with stock AFM's and she has stock like response with much more power mid to high . I have run a 11.8 second 1/4 mile with a 118 mph trap speed but its a very low ( genuine ) km series II 34.

How do you intend to install the oil pump? Sump baffles? Engine out?

writeoff Mentor

writeoff

Posted
  • Author
Posted
How do you intend to install the oil pump? Sump baffles? Engine out?

Thanks for your input wrxhoon. The short answer is that I'm going to pay someone else to do it. I have very little mechanical knowledge and have limited movement atm due to a serious car crash on Jan 3rd. I haven't decided which workshop I'm going to get to do the work yet. I want to drive to the various workshops and talk to them first but I'm carless atm. The Bentley was written off, the grey GTR has a blown turbo (hense the upgrade), the white GTR is sold although the buyer is stuffing me around with payment & the Peugeot is in for repairs. 4 bloody cars and I'm catching taxis. :(

I take your point about not being able to comparing dyno figures - they are a only a guide - I am interested in the thoughts and opinions of people with the GTSS turbos with or without the poncams. However dyno figures can give an indication of when the turbos come on boost which is what I'm interested in.

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