Jump to content
SAU Community

R33 Rb30 Conversion

JNR24

By JNR24,
in Engines & Forced Induction

 Share

Recommended Posts

NickR33 Grand Master

NickR33

Posted
Posted

hmmm... it apparently had the wrong oil filter when it came over from Japan a year ago, so perhaps the damage was already done by the previous owner and it just hung in there long enough for me to break it?

I would know if I had starved it of oil because the oil pressure would indicate this? ie driving around with unacceptably low oil pressure.

I will definately make sure it is as terminal as suspected before I replace or rebuild but it was diagnosed by 2 very experienced import gurus... so I have been scratching my head... a lot.

What is the best method of diagnosis, compression test? leakdown test?

  • Replies 7.2k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Popular Posts

Duncan
Duncan

Just thought I would bump this 20 year old thread because the Skid Factory have just posted up a video summarising a lot of the content, format might be more familiar for newer members

JNR24
JNR24

fyi guys, Well yesturday i picked up a RB30 for my conversion into my R33. I will be using my RB25DET head on the RB30 block. So i started stripping the motor down, pulled the crank, pistons, girdle

Cubes
Cubes

Here is all I have at the moment: http://www.geocities.com/r32_jjc/ Unless you are on broad band make sure you right click then save as. The file is around 120kb. If there is anything I have got w

Posted Images

predator Grand Master

predator

Posted
Posted
But new engine blocks don't have any numbers, so there is no "original number" to bring up. Stamping of damaged block numbers on replacement blocks is of course completely legal, otherwise Nissan (and the other manufacturers) would not be able to sell new blank blocks.

Call me cynical, but in many cases I don't think they even check too closely.. when i bought a car recently I wrote down the engine number on the reg papers - response: "this is not the engine number on file" .. me: "guess it must have had the engine changed then", them: "err, ok, probably, what is the new engine number?", me gives new engine number (not checked.. might have even got away with rb26xxxxxxxxx), and away we go... good 'ol QLD..

Sydneykid Grand Master

Sydneykid

Posted
Posted
hmmm... it apparently had the wrong oil filter when it came over from Japan a year ago, so perhaps the damage was already done by the previous owner and it just hung in there long enough for me to break it?

I would know if I had starved it of oil because the oil pressure would indicate this? ie driving around with unacceptably low oil pressure.

I will definately make sure it is as terminal as suspected before I replace or rebuild but it was diagnosed by 2 very experienced import gurus... so I have been scratching my head... a lot.

What is the best method of diagnosis, compression test? leakdown test?

Wrong oil filter :headspin: , that makes no sense either. If the oil filter leaked you would know about it, oil everywhere. It can only then get blocked, in which case the bypass kicks in and the oil stills flow at normal pressure. It just doesn't get cleaned. You can tell if that's the case by looking inside the cam covers, no filter = dirty scum.

Compression test or leak down test tells you nothing about bearing condition. Noise is the best test, main bearings rumble like a heavy train on railway tracks. Big end bearings knock, like someone at the front door. As you free rev the engine the noise dies down and as you back off it comes back louder. Once heard it is unmistakeable. The other test is oil pressure, a good quality gauge will fluctuate with bad big ends. The needle flicks around as the oil pressure jumps as it feeds that crook big end bearing.

I suggest you find an old mechanic, he doesn't need to know anything about imports. A big end bearing knock is a big end bearing knock. He will pick it in an instant because it used to happen a lot. A lot of young mechanics have never heard a big end knocking because it doesn't happen very often these days

Hope that helps :D

NickR33 Grand Master

NickR33

Posted
Posted

Thanks that helps alot...

my gf's dad would qualify as an 'old' mechanic lol... maybe time to tow it to his shop... If it does end up being a terminal problem would you go with renowned import specialists and pay the $$$ or go with the family member mechanic who will make the labour costs minimal (is not experienced with modern turbos, though still a good mechanic)?

Roy Grand Master

Roy

Posted
Posted

You make the decision, talk to a few places you would like see do the work, get a firm price and hold them responsible for their work and the price. An engine rebuild is big money. Some say 2k isnt big money, but thats 2 months work for me.

Why is it mechanics refuse to given written quotes, is it a time thing. It would be cool to see a quote that says, Price X in labour, price X in parts so you can compare apples with apples.

Worst case scenario you could be wary of the buck fitty quote as you know they havent allowed for certain things, or you can see that they are actually just good operators with low overheads.

Hope you get it back on the road soon with as little pain as possible. if your car is relatively std, turbo, injectors ecu and boost, then wrecker motors often come with 3 month warranties etc etc. So thats $2000 (?), sell your head etc for $500-700, sell off the bottom end etc, or just throw new bearings in your RB25. A std nissan engine takes a good flogging if you have the std turbo hanging off it.

Talk to ppl you trust and see how you go.

Cubes Grand Master

Cubes

Posted
Posted

Its not just going to cost for the engine rebuild its also going to cost extra for the head welding which could possibly involve R&R of the valves etc.

Then there's the ECU. You will need a powerfc.

Get the motor in get it tuned.

Run the motor in get it tuned again.

There's a lot more initial money invloved with the rb30 than simply slapping a set of bearings in the rb25.

NickR33 Grand Master

NickR33

Posted
Posted

yeah I've got quotes on dropping a new (wrecker) engine in and pretty much know how much it will cost. I'm not too stressed about that as I know I can have that work done cheaply and reliably and be back on the road relatively quickly.

I just want to weigh that up against going for a rebuild and I really haven't got an solid quotes on that to have made a decision yet. It would be a shame to spend $2xxx on putting it back the way it was...when for a couple of extra grand I could have a relatively stock but tough and tourquey 3L motor?

I guess the first decision is whether or not to pay to have the engine stripped to see exactly what the damage is? ... or just out with the old... in with the new...

thanks for the comments guys...

Roy Grand Master

Roy

Posted
Posted
Its not just going to cost for the engine rebuild its also going to cost extra for the head welding which could possibly involve R&R of the valves etc.

 

Then there's the ECU. You will need a powerfc.

Get the motor in get it tuned.

Run the motor in get it tuned again.

 

There's a lot more initial money invloved with the rb30 than simply slapping a set of bearings in the rb25.

Oops, i wasnt actually referring/comparing to the RB30 :Oops: , just commenting on how to cheaply /sensibly get the car back on the road :D

Cubes Grand Master

Cubes

Posted
Posted

I don't consider a 2.6ltr second hand motor a much better outcome than a bran spankin' 3ltr.

It would be more than $1000 to fit as you first have to remove the old motor then drop the rb26 in.

The rebuilt, blueprinted, balanced to race spec (heinz), crack tested (block, rods & crank), forged pistons, multilayer metal headgasket, fitting of the head, cam belt & relocating tensioner set me back $3700.

The head reco, port inlet/exhaust, polish exhaust, roughen up inlet & deshroud inlet valves cost ~$1100.

Total - $4800

+ R&R ($2000) it would come up around 7k.

If you think you can buy a RB26DETT and drop it in without bugger all extra expense think again. Expect turbo's to be replaced and a motor that may have been thrashed or a motor that is a little long in the tooth.

Eventually needing a rebuild with forged pistons anyhow.

People build the 3ltr because they want response, torque and a linear less snappy more tractable hi-po 250-300rwkw+ motor.

GTR-Ben Proficient

GTR-Ben

Posted
Posted

Yeah stock second hand GTR motor.. dime a dozen here for around $5k... I wouldn't use a second hand one with stock turbos if I was going to drive it seriously.

On that note I just painted my engine bay and got a new swaybar that goes around my sump so the RB30 will be dropped in and lowered as much as possible. :D

Guilt-Toy Grand Master

Guilt-Toy

Posted
Posted

Well I was just thinkin bout the cost of my engine rebuild for RB30DET. It did not cost me anywhere near $7,000. Details...

Note that everything is pretty much at trade price & mates rates prices.

Block $100

RB30E Re-ring kit + bearings + Genuine nissan head gasket $440

Rebuild engine hone block machine crank pins to over size / clean deck block $330 (Mate)

Engine Mount $125

Clutch Plate $105

Exaust Manifold Studs $60

Mate at his own workshop to store car and do work after hours after work or weekend, he supplied everything needed from VCT setup to sending head away to be cleaned and reconditioned with new valve stems / competition fittings for sump for VVT oil drain & Turbo oil drain labour to remove engine dismantle and put all back together was only $2900.00 (+ many nights on the piss)

So totally cost me abouts $4000.

I think I got a great deal from my mate to do the RB30DET Conversion. He basically chucked in a free head rebuild and used new manifold gaskets.. I also put countless hours of work into it doing it with him.. The outcome was awesome but took us 4 months to do.

Guilt-Toy Grand Master

Guilt-Toy

Posted
Posted
Pays to have mates in the trade. :P

 

7k I would think would include a set of Forged pistons.

 

RIPS from NZ can ship RB30DET's complete with head for around the 4.5k mark.

No 7k was drive in drive out with a $50 wrecker engine without even cracking it open. (developed a engine knock later)

I think he supplier head and turbo and manifolds also. it was a NA VL.

Guilt-Toy Grand Master

Guilt-Toy

Posted
Posted

well considering the engine had to be supplied by customer - and thats what he choose to start off with.....

The 7k including head manifolds vg30 turbo rb25 wiring harness all vct setups etc etc engine pulled out built up and installed and tuned... dunno bout the intercooler

That doesnt sound too bad does it ?

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing


  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • Kinkstaah
      Are you an oil nerd?

      By Kinkstaah · Posted

      I think the concept is highlighting the various scenarios where thicker oil helps, and thicker oil potentially doesn't help and only generates heat and costs power, in turn for safety which isn't actually any safer (unless you're going real hot). If anything this does highlight why throwing Castrol 10w-60 for your track days is always a solid, safe bet. 
    • GTSBoy
      Are you an oil nerd?

      By GTSBoy · Posted

      Jason should have shown a real viscosity vs temp chart. All the grades have very little viscosity difference at full operating temperature.
    • dbm7
      BCNR33 Blower Motor Resistor - Testing

      By dbm7 · Posted

      Oops... I meant to include the connector  view... BR/W - power from fuse L/W - motor negative to fan control amp (and off to HVAC pin19) OR/B - PWM signal (from HVAC pin20) B --  ground  
    • Murray_Calavera
      Steps to DIY sanding car back ready for respray....

      By Murray_Calavera · Posted

      Yep, if you are applying filler it sounds like there is something wrong with the body lol. Safe to assume there is going to be a lot of sanding going on if your still applying fillers.  Picture a perfect bare metal panel, smooth as glass. You lay down your primer, it's perfect. (why are you going to sand it?) You lay down the colour and clear, it's perfect. No sanding at all took place and you've got a perfectly finished panel.  You won't be chasing your tail, sounds like you were prepping to start laying filler. If your happy with the body after the sanding, there is some bare metal exposed and some areas with primer, no issues at all, start laying the filler. You are safe to lay filler on bare metal or primer (of course check your technical data sheet as usual for what your filler is happy to adhere to).  This isn't a 100% correct statement. There is primer that is happy to adhere to smooth bare metal. There are fillers that are happy to adhere to smooth bare metal. Just make sure you're using the right materials for the job.  Typically if you are using filler, you would go primer, colour and clear. I've never seen any instances before where someone has laid colour over body filler (maybe this happens, but I haven't seen it before). So your plan sounds pretty normal to me. 
    • Kinkstaah
      Mistakes were made, my R34 Story

      By Kinkstaah · Posted

      I don't think there's any way someone is push starting this car.. I honestly can barely move it, and moving it and steering it is just flat out not possible. I'm sure it is, but needs a bigger man than me. I have a refurbished starter now. The starter man was quite clear and consise showing me how nothing inside a starter really should contribute to slow cranking, and turned out that for the most part... my starter was entirely fine. Still, some of the wear items were replaced and luckily it didn't show any signs of getting too hot, being unfit for use, etc. Which is 'good'. I also noticed the starter definitely sounded different, which is a bit odd considering nothing should have really changed there.... Removed and refit, and we'll pretend one of the manifold bolts didn't fully tighten up and is only "pretty" tight. GM only wants 18ft/lb anyway. I also found a way to properly get my analog wideband reading very slightly leaner than the serial wideband. There's Greg related reasons for this. The serial output is the absolute source of truth, but it is a total asshole to actually stay connected and needs a laptop. The analog input does not, and works with standalone datalogging. Previously the analog input read slightly richer, but if I am aiming at 12.7 I do not want one of the widebands to be saying 12.7 when the source of truth is 13.0. Now the source of truth will be 12.65 and the Analog Wideband will read 12.7. So when I tune to 12.7 it'll be ever so slightly safer. While messing with all of this and idling extensively I can confirm my car seems to restart better while hot now. I did add an old Skyline battery cable between the head and the body though, though now I really realise I should have chosen the frame. Maybe that's a future job. The internet would have you believe that this is caused by bad grounds. In finding out where my grounds actually were I found out the engine bay battery post actually goes to the engine, as well as a seperate one (from the post) to the body of the car. So now there's a third one making the Grounding Triangle which is now a thing. I also from extensive idling have this graph. Temperature (°C) Voltage (V) 85 1.59 80 1.74 75 1.94 70 2.1 65 2.33 60 2.56 55 2.78 50 2.98 45 3.23 40 3.51 35 3.75 30 4.00   Plotted it looks like this. Which is actually... pretty linear? I have not actually put the formula into HPTuners. I will have to re-engage brain and/or re-engage the people who wanted more data to magically do it for me. Tune should be good for the 30th!
×
×
  • Create New...