Afm In The Cooler Piping

[abu]

so skyline's are the new VL turb's now?

Weren't they always?

I wish all you dosing (fully sick) skyline owners would sell up and go back to Homodores.

Sick of all this bullshit modification for the sake of a stupid sound which impresses very few people anyway!

Save your time and money on actually modifying for a performance gain perhaps.......aahhh whatever each to their own.

Flame away my dosing freinds.

Jeez ease up, like you said each to their own.

I dont know why some of you guys are so against dose/flutter. I dont think I have met anyone who doesn't turn there head when they hear a dose/flutter?

It sounds good, and there is nothing wrong with it. Doesn't even compare to the poofy sound that a BOV makes.

I'm not trying to start a dose/flutter/bov debate, but if he wants to make it dose, let him.

All he asked was, is it ok to put the AFM into the cooler piping, not "hey, how can I make my skyline dose!?"

Edited September 4, 2007 by abu

[paulr33]

i done this only for the reason this to my car was to eliminate the 4 inch inlet of the turbo being reduced to like 2 1/2" from the afm so i put it on the pressure side of the piping so i can have 4 inh all the way to the turbo inlet

f*#k the dose i try my hardest to get rid of it if you want a dose get a vl

muzza'z lol

the restriction is the other way around

what size is the pipe work after the compressor outlet ?

[abu]

oh, and btw, what the hell is "dose"?

dose/flutter = compressor surge?

shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh (spool up)

ttttttuuuuuuuuuutttttuuuuuuuuuttttuuuuuuuuuuuttttttuuuuuuutuuu!!!!.. (compressor surge - backing off throttle)

Edited September 4, 2007 by abu

[teazn_r33]

paul i think you have this one wrong

my intercooler piping is two and a half inch all the way thru all the way to the plenum and the afm is around 60 cm before plenum after the intercooler piping

the inlet on the turbo is 4 inch so to put the afm in front of that would limit the air flow into the turbo

i have a power fc to tune the lil gritty bits

[teazn_r33]

also doesing out of any turbo will limit the turbos life as the air pushing thru the turbo cause the turbo to slow the spool hence the chopping noise

[WazR32GTSt]

ha ha i must be too old for that fully sick lingo. why not call it compressor surge as that is what it is?

also, in regards to the comment that "I dont think I have met anyone who doesn't turn there head when they hear a dose/flutter?", then you obviously haven't spoken to ANYONE why doesn't own a skyline or performance vehicle. most people hate it. in fact, i even hate it. i think it sounds stupid and wanky and when i hear it i cringe and vomit a little bit in my mouth

[teazn_r33]

Weren't they always?

Jeez ease up, like you said each to their own.

I dont know why some of you guys are so against dose/flutter. I dont think I have met anyone who doesn't turn there head when they hear a dose/flutter?

It sounds good, and there is nothing wrong with it. Doesn't even compare to the poofy sound that a BOV makes.

I'm not trying to start a dose/flutter/bov debate, but if he wants to make it dose, let him.

All he asked was, is it ok to put the AFM into the cooler piping, not "hey, how can I make my skyline dose!?"

also to make it does have no bov then she will does also use stainless steel longer the better with a 90 bend in it

[abu]

ha ha i must be too old for that fully sick lingo. why not call it compressor surge as that is what it is?

also, in regards to the comment that "I dont think I have met anyone who doesn't turn there head when they hear a dose/flutter?", then you obviously haven't spoken to ANYONE why doesn't own a skyline or performance vehicle. most people hate it. in fact, i even hate it. i think it sounds stupid and wanky and when i hear it i cringe and vomit a little bit in my mouth

LOL

But your from Brisbane, I think maybe thats way. No one up QLD way doesn't seem to know what dose is, not having a go!

I haven't met anyone from VICTORIA then, that doesn't turn they head when they hear it.

This is way off topic haha.

[abu]

also to make it does have no bov then she will does also use stainless steel longer the better with a 90 bend in it

Yep.

I was just saying ist off topic to what he was asking.

I have found a 45 deg, 2.5" to a 3" pipe doses best. Not to long though.. my personal opinion since where on the dose topic.

Edited September 4, 2007 by abu

[WazR32GTSt]

LOL

But your from Brisbane, I think maybe thats way. No one up QLD way doesn't seem to know what dose is, not having a go!

I haven't met anyone from VICTORIA then, that doesn't turn they head when they hear it.

This is way off topic haha.

i am a victorian who recently moved to brisbane, so there goes your theory!

Edited September 4, 2007 by WazR32GTSt

[abu]

i am a victorian who recently moved to brisbane, so there goes your theory!

Damn! lol

How old are you if you dont mind me asking?

Might have to put you in the "mature" category since you don’t meet the minimal requirements of the QLD one.

Edited September 4, 2007 by abu

[GeeTR]

i htink this idea is flawless at best without an ECU tune of some sort to compensate for the new AFM location

my understanding of hte AFM is this..

the AFM works by calculating. it does not directly measure airflow.

it has a wire that hangs into the lumen of the pipe. this wire heats up to a certain temperature that correlates with a certain resistance in the AFM (contains a variable resistor). when ambient air flows over that wire, it cools the wire down. the more air that flows over the wire, the more it cools the wire down. thus, as airflow increases the wire cools down more and the resistance in the AFM changes. this correlates with a change in voltage to the ECU.

this way, the ECU knows approximately what the airflow is based on the hot wire's operation.

now i see 2 major flaws with placing the AFM in the cooler piping

1) the air is compressed. there is absolutely no evicence that i've ever seen that says that compressed air will cool the wire at the same rate as air at atmospheric pressure. let's look at it from the particle model. say i have 100 particles of O2 in a fixed space and it cools the hot wire by 0.1degC. well if this is compressed to 1bar i now have 200 particles in that fixed space. who's to say that this compressed air will cool the wire by 0.2degC? i don't think the relationship will be as linear as you might think.

2) the air is hot. that's right, its after the turbo. that means that the air going over the wire could be up to 50-80degC having just come out of hte turbo. i don't think hot air will be able to extract heat from the wire as would ambient air, and if it does then it wouldn't be at the same rate as ambient air that passes over the AFM normally.

--> but, i believe that both these issues could be compensated for by a good tuner

so, in summary... my understanding is:

1) the AFM works on a hot wire principal

2) placing it after the AFM means that it measures compressed air not normal air, thus it will not measure effectively without a re-tune

3) placing it after the AFM means that it measures hotter air rather than ambient air, thus it will not measure effectively without a re-tune

this is only based on my understanding of how the AFM works and my understanding of basic physics/chemistry. it might help or it might not, but i thought i would throw it in for discussion

cheers,

Warren

This has been spoken of many times on this and other Nissan forums. I can never stay away from commenting I almost had the NRG to getup and try it, might in the future.

Hotter Air: Common debate, though can you guesstimate the temp of the air going through the AFMs in a stock setup, when car is stand still and its 40 outside? I would guesstimate close to 50-80

Compressed Air: Its the same amount of air, its just moving faster now (pressurized) I believe it would have close to the same ability to absorb heat from the hotwire, as its denser.

I would say, with a re tune it should be fine, only issue being oil from stock recirc setup, or from leaking turbo cartridge.

[WazR32GTSt]

This has been spoken of many times on this and other Nissan forums. I can never stay away from commenting I almost had the NRG to getup and try it, might in the future.

Hotter Air: Common debate, though can you guesstimate the temp of the air going through the AFMs in a stock setup, when car is stand still and its 40 outside? I would guesstimate close to 50-80

Compressed Air: Its the same amount of air, its just moving faster now (pressurized) I believe it would have close to the same ability to absorb heat from the hotwire, as its denser.

I would say, with a re tune it should be fine, only issue being oil from stock recirc setup, or from leaking turbo cartridge.

turbocharged air is going to be way hotter than intake air.

if intake air is 50deg (because you have a pod in an engine bay) then figure after the turbo its going to be higher, even if its only 80deg, its still higher

in regards to pressuresed air, yes it will move faster, but you are overlooking the fact that pressureised air means that there is more particles of air in a given fixed volume. althought it is moving faster, how do you know that it is cooling twice as much? how do you know that its is cooling proportional to normal air? saying its "close" isn't good enough i believe

its just not as simple as it seems in terms of the physics of it all

now an ECU tune changes the game altogether and its great because the tunes doesn't have to know the slightest of any physics of it all, they simply have to look at the exhaust AFRs and adjust the mixture accordingly..

[WazR32GTSt]

Damn! lol

How old are you if you dont mind me asking?

Might have to put you in the "mature" category since you don’t meet the minimal requirements of the QLD one.

only 24, but given the fully sick crowd of skyline owners these days is 16-20 i consider myself old for the skyline community..!

[abu]

only 24, but given the fully sick crowd of skyline owners these days is 16-20 i consider myself old for the skyline community..!

pfffft.. your still young. I'm 20 my self.

Some people on these forums in there 20s act like there in their 40s.

Edited September 4, 2007 by abu

[mad082]

paul i think you have this one wrong

my intercooler piping is two and a half inch all the way thru all the way to the plenum and the afm is around 60 cm before plenum after the intercooler piping

the inlet on the turbo is 4 inch so to put the afm in front of that would limit the air flow into the turbo

the point paul is making is that the piping after the turbo is only 2.5" so having the afm before the turbo isn't really going to add that much restriction. and unless your compressor wheel is actually 4" then there is no real gains had by having a 4" pipe. and i don't know of any pod filters with a 4" outlet, so wouldn't you just have to have it reduce back to 3" anyway, which is the same size as the afm.

also if you were to run this setup with a bov you would have massive stalling issues, whether it is atmo or plumback. with a plumback and the afm in the stock location it doesn't really register any air moving through it when you lift off. with it in the cooler piping when you lift off and the bov opens it would be registering all the air in the cooler piping that is going past it out the bov and dump a heap of fuel in. so you would need the afm right near the throttle body, and have the bov closer to the intercooler than the afm.

[The Mafia]

why doesn't the idiot just block off the BOV ?

Oh, I know why, I bet he has a massive f**ken Trumpet amplified supersonic twisty whirly spinner shiney chrome space ship vent to atmosphere one, because he thinks all of the women he makes it go off in front of a all going to get really wet, and come running and try and get into his car?

Another f**king idiot to make cops hate skylines more. Great.

[KISIN]

FLUTTER FTWWW!!!!

[R31Nismoid]

Searched?

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...;hl=afm++cooler

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...;hl=afm++cooler

And you already asked this a couple of months ago anyhow:

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/in...;hl=afm++cooler