Harey Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Hi All, Just looking at next steps and how to push things from my current 279rwkw (hypergear hi flow turbo with return flow intercooler and standard piping). I am wondering what power people have made with a return flow intercooler and standard piping inside the engine bay? Possible areas of restriction are the 2.5" cold pipe and the fact that the cold pipe and hot pipes are right next to each other. Any help much appreciated! Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birds Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Eeeeeeeee Eighty Five Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5747704 Share on other sites More sharing options...
R31Nismoid Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Seen a certain brand of return flow max @ 270rwkw recently on a car that was done. That said - you shouldn't be asking the question, you should be testing it. Measure boost pressure turbo outlet, measure pressure near the plenum. No point trying to theorise something like this as there are many factors to take into account. Testing will tell you without a doubt if there is a problem or not. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5747795 Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulr33 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 exhaust backpressure would limit power well before intercooler pressure loss and resistance would Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5747852 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 Eeeeeeeee Eighty Five Yup thats the plan just dont want to find out that the setup is restrictive so I couldnt get the most out of E85. Trent was saying they did an RB30 with a GT35 and 0.63 rear and it only gained 10-20 rwkw with E85, but I attribute that to the stupid 0.63 rear on an RB30! Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5747925 Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvpsi Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 piping is not really going to make a diffrence look at ripsfed he is running 2.5" from turbo to intercooler then 3" to throttle and god knows how much power he is making im running 2.5" from turbo to cooler then 3" from cooler to throttle body Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5747950 Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostn0199 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 260 to 307 when I converted to e85 plus tomei cams on less boost and im still using air box and jjr return flow cooler so you shouldnt have a probelm I would expect you to make around 310-315kw mark Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5747951 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 Seen a certain brand of return flow max @ 270rwkw recently on a car that was done. That said - you shouldn't be asking the question, you should be testing it. Measure boost pressure turbo outlet, measure pressure near the plenum. No point trying to theorise something like this as there are many factors to take into account. Testing will tell you without a doubt if there is a problem or not. Yeah I understand, my hot intercooler pipe is currently getting a fitting welded onto it so I can measure the pressure before the intercooler. I also just purchased an infrared thermometer so I can measure the temps at different stages along the piping. More just interested to hear peoples stories of how much power they are making through a return flow intercooler with standard piping. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748240 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 piping is not really going to make a diffrence look at ripsfed he is running 2.5" from turbo to intercooler then 3" to throttle and god knows how much power he is making im running 2.5" from turbo to cooler then 3" from cooler to throttle body I am assuming both of you are not running return flow type intercoolers though where the pipes run side by side, plus my intercooler to throttle is also 2.5". Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748254 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasnt me Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 I run a Blitz return flow on my 34 and it has no problem with 350rwkw on E85 Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748284 Share on other sites More sharing options...
R31Nismoid Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Yeah I understand, my hot intercooler pipe is currently getting a fitting welded onto it so I can measure the pressure before the intercooler. I also just purchased an infrared thermometer so I can measure the temps at different stages along the piping. More just interested to hear peoples stories of how much power they are making through a return flow intercooler with standard piping. Depending on where the piping is it could be sucking up radiant heat. Doesn't mean the air inside the pipe is the same temp though... That again, needs to be used with a in-pipe sensor to really get a good idea. You'll get an indication yes, but given you weld a bung in anyway to test pressure - not hard to have it dual purpose and get it 100% accurate. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748298 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 260 to 307 when I converted to e85 plus tomei cams on less boost and im still using air box and jjr return flow cooler so you shouldnt have a probelm I would expect you to make around 310-315kw mark Great to hear, I believe you have the 0.63 housing as well? I am concerned as my current turbo cant make any more boost so I am worried that will limit the E85 conversion power increase. Great to hear that you have a JJR return flow cooler and an airbox, thats exactly the info I was after! thanks! Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748318 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 I run a Blitz return flow on my 34 and it has no problem with 350rwkw on E85 Great news thanks! Do you run the standard intercooler piping? Is there anywhere I can read up on your mod list? Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 Depending on where the piping is it could be sucking up radiant heat. Yes good point although if the pipe is super hot on the outside some of that heat is passed on the air flowing past. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748328 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasnt me Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Great news thanks! Do you run the standard intercooler piping? Is there anywhere I can read up on your mod list? stock 25NEO 3076 .82 rear .6 front cover E85 1000cc injectors 044 intank running 27psi Power FC Blits Return flow cooler. As paulr33 said. the exhaust will be a restriction before the cooler pipes will be.. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
R31Nismoid Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Yes good point although if the pipe is super hot on the outside some of that heat is passed on the air flowing past. Some yes - but the difference could be quite significant, meaning what you are reading on the pipe exterior essentially is useless information until you know whats going on inside. Remember @ peak, 280rwkw there is a fair bit of air flowing (45-50lb/min IIRC). It's mostly going to be driven temp wise by how much work the cooler is doing, which is inturn also affected by how much pressure drop - or rather restricton - there is from turbo outlet to intake. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748358 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harey Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 stock 25NEO 3076 .82 rear .6 front cover E85 1000cc injectors 044 intank running 27psi Power FC Blits Return flow cooler. As paulr33 said. the exhaust will be a restriction before the cooler pipes will be.. Hahaha love your work! Im happy to run some big boost too, but damn 98 fuel and this turbo wont allow me anymore! What exhaust do you run? Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748379 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasnt me Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 3 inch dump and front, decat and 3.5 inch cat back (HKS). Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748385 Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvpsi Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 I am assuming both of you are not running return flow type intercoolers though where the pipes run side by side, plus my intercooler to throttle is also 2.5". yeah sorry my bad im still running the standard cross over pipe aswell to go with the standard throttle body until i can afford a aftermarket throttle body. but your right im not running a return cooler only thing i can suggest is maybe run some ceramic tape on the piping where the they are close to each yes it doesnt look the best but if its performance your after it could keep the temps down i might be wrong but thats just my opinion Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748446 Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostn0199 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Great to hear, I believe you have the 0.63 housing as well? I am concerned as my current turbo cant make any more boost so I am worried that will limit the E85 conversion power increase. Great to hear that you have a JJR return flow cooler and an airbox, thats exactly the info I was after! thanks! yeah 0.63 and as I told you before aswell im dropping boost aswell from 17 to 14 and still get that power so you will make it no worries, sure youll make more if you hold boost but yeah thats another problem to be solved. Link to comment https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/359972-most-power-with-a-return-flow-intercooler-and-std-piping/#findComment-5748458 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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