Jump to content
SAU Community

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 82
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

It's about 3 years old and has about 5000 km on it so I suspect tiredness probably isn't the issue. I haven't done the wiring conversion so I'm wonder if it's a volt drop problem.

And sorry my bad, they're recommending 044.

Only other thing I can think of is that the Nismo purples are the issue although they should be good for 600hp or so at the fly?

Check the fuel pressure and you'll soon know if its the pump, or then the voltage.

Either way should be fine so you have an issue somewhere.

What CC are the injectors? You'd know if they were running out though due to duty cycle. Either way the Bosch isn't the answer just yet.

It's about 3 years old and has about 5000 km on it so I suspect tiredness probably isn't the issue. I haven't done the wiring conversion so I'm wonder if it's a volt drop problem.

And sorry my bad, they're recommending 044.

Only other thing I can think of is that the Nismo purples are the issue although they should be good for 600hp or so at the fly?

Scooby, I have a 044 in-tank and also had a fuel issue which had us stuffed for a while. It acually ended up being the stock pickup. It has a plastic 'skeleton' which keeps its shape. Turns out it had cracked, but while you had it in your hand it didn't look like it. This caused the filter to collapse at higher RPM/load and stifle the pump.. on dyno it just looked like the pump was running out of legs.

May not be your issue, but thought I'd suggest it just in case. Nismo pump should be good for some serious hp. (and yes, do the relay thing as well)

hey mark - if you are going to upgrade your pump, get the pierburg which flows 360lph, when compared to 044 which is rated @ 200lph it flows 65% more!

although, i'd also agree to firstly the source as to why the nismo will not flow as much & support your setup.

Hey Marko

Saw your thread re in tank fuel pumps and the Pierberg. At what pressure does it flow 360 lph? I've seen the 044 quoted at 200 and 300, but the 200 was at 5 bar and I think the Nismo's 276 lph was at 3 bar.

But yeah as others have suggested I need to find out the problem first, I'd have thought 600cc inj would be close to maxing if the Nismo pump can't keep up. I'll have a talk to Jim tomorrow to find out what's happening.

Cheers

Thanks for the input everyone.

Lol yes everything was fine until the -5s and cams came long...-7s were always on boost and falling over by 6750 rpm with stock cams. Adj cam gears made little difference. About 300rwkw on a very conservative tune.

I thought rule of thumb was roughly 1cc/hp so 600cc injectors should be good for 600hp/447kw at the fly. Assuming that's not totally wrong they should be good for 350rwkw? I'm not keen to go over that as I want longevity.

Well depends - you need to go and check everything

Fuel pressure

Injector duty (are they maxing out?)

Fuel pump voltage

Fuel filter been changed recently?

So how much power are you currenty limited too? Sounds like less than 350rwkw?

And ye, -7 fall over ~7000rpm, given they come on @ 3300rpm, fair trade. Can't have response and top end :)

Hey Marko

Saw your thread re in tank fuel pumps and the Pierberg. At what pressure does it flow 360 lph? I've seen the 044 quoted at 200 and 300, but the 200 was at 5 bar and I think the Nismo's 276 lph was at 3 bar.

But yeah as others have suggested I need to find out the problem first, I'd have thought 600cc inj would be close to maxing if the Nismo pump can't keep up. I'll have a talk to Jim tomorrow to find out what's happening.

Cheers

hey mark,

The Bosch 044 runs 200lph @ 5bar (more info: http://www.bosch.com...s/fuelpumps.pdf)

The Pierburg (aka Bugatti Veyron pump RAAAAR) runs 330lph @ 5bar (more info http://www.compsyste...2:ecu&Itemid=14)

I dont see why people dont test their fuel systems before tuning - its the simplest thing to check.

Boost gauge and air compressor is all that is needed. Put whatever boost pressure your going to run onto the fuel reg - watch you boost gauge to see the pressure. Put the return line into a measurable container (arround 5L), then start and run car for 1 minute. If there is 6x600cc/min = 3.6L/min then you have enough fuel system.

We need a sticky on this - as I know it pisses me off as a tuner when you get setup on the dyno only to find no fuel flow on the first dyno run.

They ordered it anyway? :/

I'd be wanting to know its been tested, and proven dead before you pay anything.

Yes they did, my thoughts exactly, but I think they'll easily use it on someone else's if not mine. I told them not to go ahead until I find out what's happening. I actually do trust their judgement but I still want to know what the issue is.

Ash I did see a thread in which I think you suggested there was conjecture around whether a Nismo pump is the same as a stock Nissan one but a third of the price? What pump are you running on the GTR?

Nismo :)

I see 65% max duty on PULP with 700cc injectors on a 4 degree night. 20psi (2.6l) with -5 and 365rwkw.

Not running factory fuel pressure though, i have a modified reg so it would probably be closer to 70%, maybe 75% if using a stock reg.

Still room to move either way, your 600's "should" flow enough for 350rwkw and be 80% or less duty. Hence if you do have 100% duty its somewhere in - pump / voltage / pressure

Rob - do a write up, ill gladly link it to the FI Guide :thumbsup:

at the same time though every engines different, aswell as every dyno. sure something might not be up to scratch but its not always a given. for example i maxxed (properly maxxed, 100% on cold mornings) standard 25 injectors at 185rwkw with adequate fuel pressure. combination of an engine that never made as much power as others, a slightly lower reading dyno and a slightly rich tune. on the same low powered engine and same dyno i came close to maxxing nismo 555s at 250rwkw.

but yer, flow test the pump first

hey mark - you know you are in the best hands possible @ crd & there is absolutely no way that jim would have ordered the 044 without further diagnosis...jim is always of the opinion if its not setup right, he is not happy to push it & this is great, signs of a perfectionist IMO :)

are u just running the single 044 intank mark? i.e. no other external pumps or surge tank?

what power level are u aiming for & what did jim say he can achieve for you?

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • I had 3 counts over the last couple of weeks once where i got stranded at a jdm paint yard booking in some work. 2nd time was moving the car into the drive way for the inspection and the 3rd was during the inspection for the co2 leak test. Fix: 1st, car off for a hour and half disconnected battery 10mins 4th try car started 2nd, 5th try started 3rd, countless time starting disconnected battery dude was under the hood listening to the starting sequence fuel pump ect.   
    • This. As for your options - I suggest remote mounting the Nissan sensor further away on a length of steel tube. That tube to have a loop in it to handle vibration, etc etc. You will need to either put a tee and a bleed fitting near the sensor, or crack the fitting at the sensor to bleed it full of oil when you first set it up, otherwise you won't get the line filled. But this is a small problem. Just needs enough access to get it done.
    • The time is always correct. Only the date is wrong. It currently thinks it is January 19. Tomorrow it will say it is January 20. The date and time are ( should be ! ) retrieved from the GPS navigation system.
    • Buy yourself a set of easy outs. See if they will get a good bite in and unthread it.   Very very lucky the whole sender didn't let go while on the track and cost you a motor!
    • Well GTSBoy, prepare yourself further. I did a track day with 1/2 a day prep on Friday, inpromptu. The good news is that I got home, and didn't drive the car into a wall. Everything seemed mostly okay. The car was even a little faster than it was last time. I also got to get some good datalog data too. I also noticed a tiny bit of knock which was (luckily?) recorded. All I know is the knock sensors got recalibrated.... and are notorious for false knock. So I don't know if they are too sensitive, not sensitive enough... or some other third option. But I reduced timing anyway. It wasn't every pull through the session either. Think along the lines of -1 degree of timing for say, three instances while at the top of 4th in a 20 minute all-hot-lap session. Unfortunately at the end of session 2... I noticed a little oil. I borrowed some jack stands and a jack and took a look under there, but as is often the case, messing around with it kinda half cleaned it up, it was not conclusive where it was coming from. I decided to give it another go and see how it was. The amount of oil was maybe one/two small drops. I did another 20 minute session and car went well, and I was just starting to get into it and not be terrified of driving on track. I pulled over and checked in the pits and saw this: This is where I called it, packed up and went home as I live ~20 min from the track with a VERY VERY CLOSE EYE on Oil Pressure on the way home. The volume wasn't much but you never know. I checked it today when I had my own space/tools/time to find out what was going on, wanted to clean it up, run the car and see if any of the fittings from around the oil filter were causing it. I have like.. 5 fittings there, so I suspected one was (hopefully?) the culprit. It became immediately apparent as soon as I looked around more closely. 795d266d-a034-4b8c-89c9-d83860f5d00a.mp4       This is the R34 GTT oil sender connected via an adapter to an oil cooler block I have installed which runs AN lines to my cooler (and back). There's also an oil temp sensor on top.  Just after that video, I attempted to unthread the sensor to see if it's loose/worn and it disintegrated in my hand. So yes. I am glad I noticed that oil because it would appear that complete and utter catastrophic engine failure was about 1 second of engine runtime away. I did try to drill the fitting out, and only succeeded in drilling the middle hole much larger and now there's a... smooth hole in there with what looks like a damn sleeve still incredibly tight in there. Not really sure how to proceed from here. My options: 1) Find someone who can remove the stuck fitting, and use a steel adapter so it won't fatigue? (Female BSPT for the R34 sender to 1/8NPT male - HARD to find). IF it isn't possible to remove - Buy a new block ($320) and have someone tap a new 1/8NPT in the top of it ($????) and hope the steel adapter works better. 2) Buy a new block and give up on the OEM pressure sender for the dash entirely, and use the supplied 1/8 NPT for the oil temp sender. Having the oil pressure read 0 in the dash with the warning lamp will give me a lot of anxiety driving around. I do have the actual GM sensor/sender working, but it needs OBD2 as a gauge. If I'm datalogging I don't actually have a readout of what the gauge is currently displaying. 3) Other? Find a new location for the OEM sender? Though I don't know of anywhere that will work. I also don't know if a steel adapter is actually functionally smart here. It's clearly leveraged itself through vibration of the motor and snapped in half. This doesn't seem like a setup a smart person would replicate given the weight of the OEM sender. Still pretty happy being lucky for once and seeing this at the absolute last moment before bye bye motor in a big way, even if an adapter is apparently 6 weeks+ delivery and I have no way to free the current stuck/potentially destroyed threads in the current oil block.
×
×
  • Create New...