50K 2Nd Hand R35's In Japan With $A At Record Highs Against The Yen

[GT-R OZ]

I think you can definately say we are getting shafted in this country by Nissan Australia. New R35's should be at least 35K cheaper!

What a shame we can't import!

http://www.lucusjapan.com/search/index.cgi?key=141

[NXTIME]

Yeah..that would be $70K landed. Cheapest one in Aus is $100K

[domino_z]

thought we've done this dance already

nissan australia has nothing to do with it

stamp duty + lct + gst = aus retail

[GT-R OZ]

Yes but the price of the car itself should be 20% cheaper before you add all the taxes based on the current exchange rate. The problem is car companies don't adjust their prices when there are fluctuations in the rate. Nissan Australia are receiving the cars from Japan 20% cheaper due to the weaker Yen.

Edited March 12, 2013 by GT-R OZ

[domino_z]

cool story but reality is alot more complicated

low production cars like the GTR are ordered in pre-sold allocations. nissan aus would need to forecast and commit to how many cars they think they can sell/want built in RHD to ADR's long before a spanner is even turned, so they wouldn't be basing that on the current exchange rates you're seeing on xe.com/ucc/ at the time of walking into the dealer, but more so a worse case average with a healthy margin of error cost'd into the consumer's bottom line

no doubt nissan aus are making money on the pre-tax price - if they weren't they wouldn't be in business

[Wardski]

cool story but reality is alot more complicated

low production cars like the GTR are ordered in pre-sold allocations. nissan aus would need to forecast and commit to how many cars they think they can sell/want built in RHD to ADR's long before a spanner is even turned, so they wouldn't be basing that on the current exchange rates you're seeing on xe.com/ucc/ at the time of walking into the dealer, but more so a worse case average with a healthy margin of error cost'd into the consumer's bottom line

no doubt nissan aus are making money on the pre-tax price - if they weren't they wouldn't be in business

+1 ^ this

Explains why I paid $69k for my first Subaru STi in 2001, and paid $69k for my 2nd Subaru STi Spec R in 2009.. Car manufacturers here set the price and sell at a price regardless of how strong or weak the AUD is against the Yen. Its their risk if there's market fluctuation or they don't sell the Australian bound allocation..

its also interesting to note that aside from 2008-2009 (GFC), there have been no real major fluctuations in Yen vs AUD over the last 10 years.. lots of mild ups and downs all pretty much evening out if you take the mean.

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=JPY&to=AUD&view=10Y

[GT-R OZ]

I certainly agree with all of the above and car companies have always argued that when the exchange rate goes against them they don't increase the price of their vehicles and that the price is based on an average and set well in advance. In saying that what we are seeing here could be the start of a sustained devaluation of the Yen. The Japanese Government through the Bank of Japan is deliberately de-valuing the Yen in order to boost exports and get Japan out of a recession which it has been in for over 2 decades. They intend to de-value the Yen by a further 20%. A 40% reduction in total. I'm sure you'd agree that this is more then just a fluctuation in the rate, it's a fundamental shift. Wonder how many more GT-R's they'd sell in Australia if they were 40% cheaper. Same profit per car now but with a massive increase in volume, which is what Japan needs.

http://english.caixin.com/2012-03-23/100372177_3.html

In the coming years there well could be a large price adjustment on Japanese goods, including motor vehicles with the A$ set to remain strong. Anyway the Australian government will just probably increase the tariffs on these cars to protect the local industry and as far as the GT-R goes, well Nissan Oz will just probably pocket the difference. They obviously make more money and of course it protects 2nd hand values. We'll just have to wait and see. I'm sure there are numerous other factors involved which I haven't thought of ie. specialist vehicle, made in low volumes etc etc.. Just putting it out there for some healthy discussion. Anything could be possible in the coming years.

Edited March 12, 2013 by GT-R OZ

[Wardski]

The problem with the devaluation of the Yen is that come Election time and the LNP retain power from the red haired muppet, there will be no choice but for the new Government to do the same thing here in order to avoid a full on recession. The preferred basis point for the AUD is around the USD$0.75, and I have no doubt this is where we will be same time 2014.

While I'm working the magic ball, any devaluation of the Yen will be short lived and offset by the devaluation of the AUD and thus there will be no change in the fully imported jap car market from what we see today.

Many countries watch what Japan Inc does (including Australia). Japan has already suffered through tougher times than many and they've learnt the hard school of knox way to good economic policy.

Edited March 13, 2013 by Wardski

[nismo83]

Is that you Tony Abbott...?

Wardski....without being too disrespectful...mate your grasp on basic economics is WOEFUL to say the least.

I'm not sure what you do for a crust....but it's prob best to leave your Liberal party propaganda at home. Let me guess...you read a few News Ltd 'articles' and believe whats written..?

Ummm....you're more than welcome to sit in in one of my classes over the next few weeks as i will be discussiong EXACTLY what the implications to the rest of the macro economy would be if we were to devalue the aussie dollar.

First of all that redhead you refer to....as much as i dislike her personally.... along with who i call Mr Numnuts (our current treasurer)...actually kept us out of what would mostly likely have been a mild recession. Note - i actually detest both the Liberal and Labor parties. But i do prefer to give my students qulaified facts and figures and not just random bullshit coz its just my opinion.

Secondly as Domino mentioned above stamp duty, LCT and GST do have a major part to play in what we pay for cars like the GTR here. Exchange rate fluctuations also play a role.....but not as bigger role as you may think. Car companys generally "insure" themselves against these by hedging. There are many other factors which are taken into account when setting the australian retail price for a high performance car like the GTR. Actually....this goes for most imported goods into Australia.

Thirdly there are HUGE structural changes going on in Japan. Rising commodity prices, an aging population which means a shrinking labour market, and a 200%+ debt to GDP ratio are just some of the challenges facing Japan right now. Just because Japan devalue's their currency doesnt mean Australia (nor the rest of the world) will follow.

The problem with the devaluation of the Yen is that come Election time and the LNP retain power from the red haired muppet, there will be no choice but for the new Government to do the same thing here in order to avoid a full on recession. The preferred basis point for the AUD is around the USD$0.75, and I have no doubt this is where we will be same time 2014.

While I'm working the magic ball, any devaluation of the Yen will be short lived and offset by the devaluation of the AUD and thus there will be no change in the fully imported jap car market from what we see today.

Many countries watch what Japan Inc does (including Australia). Japan has already suffered through tougher times than many and they've learnt the hard school of knox way to good economic policy.

[Wardski]

Ummm....you're more than welcome to sit in in one of my classes over the next few weeks as i will be discussiong EXACTLY what the implications to the rest of the macro economy would be if we were to devalue the aussie dollar.

"EXACTLY the implications"? Sounds like your crystal ball is much better than mine. As far as sitting in on one of your classes, I couldnt think of anything more boring and rhetorical, especialy considering you firmly believe Dumb and Dumber saved us from a recession.

Edited March 15, 2013 by Wardski

[domino_z]

all they've done is prolong our inevitable recession imo

the remnants of the big bang left in our soil is the sole reason we aren't having to sell tassie off to the germans right about now

[fatz]

Any muppet who says the 160k + price is justified if farked in he head

There is a reason why t hey are called stealerships!

When the gtr first cam out the yen was 100+ yen .... but they still priced the car on a 50 to one exchange rate

Pretty sad when used(4 year old cars) gtrs are going for the price of what they should have been new

[MJR35]

Is that you Tony Abbott...?

Wardski....without being too disrespectful...mate your grasp on basic economics is WOEFUL to say the least.

I'm not sure what you do for a crust....but it's prob best to leave your Liberal party propaganda at home. Let me guess...you read a few News Ltd 'articles' and believe whats written..?

Ummm....you're more than welcome to sit in in one of my classes over the next few weeks as i will be discussiong EXACTLY what the implications to the rest of the macro economy would be if we were to devalue the aussie dollar.

First of all that redhead you refer to....as much as i dislike her personally.... along with who i call Mr Numnuts (our current treasurer)...actually kept us out of what would mostly likely have been a mild recession. Note - i actually detest both the Liberal and Labor parties. But i do prefer to give my students qulaified facts and figures and not just random bullshit coz its just my opinion.

Secondly as Domino mentioned above stamp duty, LCT and GST do have a major part to play in what we pay for cars like the GTR here. Exchange rate fluctuations also play a role.....but not as bigger role as you may think. Car companys generally "insure" themselves against these by hedging. There are many other factors which are taken into account when setting the australian retail price for a high performance car like the GTR. Actually....this goes for most imported goods into Australia.

Thirdly there are HUGE structural changes going on in Japan. Rising commodity prices, an aging population which means a shrinking labour market, and a 200%+ debt to GDP ratio are just some of the challenges facing Japan right now. Just because Japan devalue's their currency doesnt mean Australia (nor the rest of the world) will follow.

Nismo83, you are spot on with your analysis.. A lot of multinationals work at a Plan rate for currency to set their Local financial model for year or two. This can go both ways with depending which way the currencies move.. All the other political BS above by the other two contributors have nothing to do with the currency rates with Japan or the price of GT-R's for us in Australia.

The other thing to add is Nissan Australia and its HP Dealers have invested big $ in GT-R R35 and I wonder if you look at the small number of them in Australia, whether it has been a very profitable deal for all.

[nismo83]

"EXACTLY the implications"? Sounds like your crystal ball is much better than mine. As far as sitting in on one of your classes, I couldnt think of anything more boring and rhetorical, especialy considering you firmly believe Dumb and Dumber saved us from a recession.

'Exactly what the implications would be' were my words. I can pretty much guarantee it would be a futile exercise by the RBA and one which would undermine the rest of the Australian economy. At the moment the Aussie dollar might 'seem' high - but considering the strength of our economy vs the rest of the world the Aussie dollar is probably at a level where you would expect it to be.

[DAN00H]

gee nismo83 - I don't know why we aren't all listening to you and run the country with your 'qualified facts and figures' - which is based on your school opinion. That sounds like it's directly from the swan playbook.

Let’s just ignore the elephant that was the surplus and is now deficit shall we, next we’ll be hearing that the increased tax I pay now is actually less, than the Howard government years…

Back on topic, and as mentioned, there are a lot of influencing factors that affects the price we pay for cars here, but like some have already mentioned, the price of a new GTR is more than what a purchaser should pay.

[R31Nismoid]

Porsche Aus have already been pulled up on the gouging - lets just hope other manufactuers see the same.

Even with Stamp, LCT, GST & whatever other costs you wanna include - the price of high-end cars is still not even close to justifiable.

But that's the Aussie consumers fault - for paying it.

[nismo83]

Any muppet who says the 160k + price is justified if farked in he head

There is a reason why t hey are called stealerships!

When the gtr first cam out the yen was 100+ yen .... but they still priced the car on a 50 to one exchange rate

Pretty sad when used(4 year old cars) gtrs are going for the price of what they should have been new

Well there are a few things to consider there Fatz. Paying x amount for a GTR here in Aus compared to x amount elsewhere is comparing the proverbial apples with oranges.

There's been some rather interesting debate recently about the prices we pay for the same goods here in Aus compared with the rest of the world. A local MP Ed Husic here in Sydney has been championing this cause for quite a while now. It does appear for some goods we are paying way too much in Aus....no doubt about that. ie the cost of software. But there are other goods where it seems we are being ripped off but the reality is the prices are rather justified. I'm not sure where the auto industry in this country sits but id say it's somewhere in the middle. Probably leaning more towards the 'justified' end though.

When looking at the high cost of GTR's in this country - you need to remember:

Economies of scale. I will give you Australia vs USA as an example here to make things easier.

Just say for every 1 x Nissan GTR sold in Australia it equates to around 15 GTR's sold in the USA....

Theoretically - if a dealer in the US sells 15 GTR's per month at a net profit of $10k for each car sold this works out to around $150k total profit made on GTR sales for that month.

Based on the above profit margins - a Nissan dealer here in Australia will have to make do with $10k per month in net profit for GTR sales. Hence why you would expect the Aussie dealer to jack up their prices to say something like $20k or even $30k profit per vehicle.

You need to also consider wages here in Australia are generally higher. That means the guy selling you the car in Australia makes more money than his counterpart in America. The salesguys manager would theoretically have a higher salary also. The salesguys managers manager....and so on and so on. Heck... even the person hired to clean the windows of the dealership in Australia is making atleast $16 per hour (minimum wage) compared to the (roughly) $7 his/her counterpart is making over in the USA. You can also conclude the rent being paid by the dealer is generally going to be higher.

Some of these costs may not seem to be alot - but they all add up.

So when you think about it.. the high cost of living here in Australia does have something to do with price you pay for a GTR.

If you prefer to pay $90k or so for a brand spanking new GTR - then by all means move over to the USA. But i also hope you are prepared to take a substantial hit to your pay packet (average median incomes in USA are about half of what they are here in Australia).

So i think alot of us need to take the emotional aspect of what we pay for "most" goods here in Australia and balance it out with some rational thinking.

[nismo83]

Actually...the SURPLUS from the Howard years... which so many people seem to go on and on about - do you know HOW this surplus was achieved...?

Would you believe me if i told you between 70% - 80% of this so called surplus was achieved by selling off Australia's public assets...? including Telstra.

Have a read of this interesting article: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/hey-big-spender-howard-the-king-of-the-loose-purse-strings-20130110-2cj32.html

And yes I do try to let facts get in the way

gee nismo83 - I don't know why we aren't all listening to you and run the country with your 'qualified facts and figures' - which is based on your school opinion. That sounds like it's directly from the swan playbook.

Let’s just ignore the elephant that was the surplus and is now deficit shall we, next we’ll be hearing that the increased tax I pay now is actually less, than the Howard government years…

Back on topic, and as mentioned, there are a lot of influencing factors that affects the price we pay for cars here, but like some have already mentioned, the price of a new GTR is more than what a purchaser should pay.

[fatz]

some valid point

doesnt take into account nissan make the bulk of their money from a existing stealership network that have existing overheads that turn a profit sellig heaps of utes and dualis's ect.

the car already are RHD and they have already translated the dash sticker to english for existing markets

i supose you need to train 2 staff per state to work out how to unbolt the gearbag which would cost 40k per state

cost of ADR compliance is a one off and is bugger all annualised over multiple years of 400-500 cars. and putting child restrians in at the factory costs about 20 bux

i would be driving one if it was 90-110 k to get into one new and i dare say a large proportion of people on this site would as well

lets forget america, even if they price matched japan they would sell a couple of thousand a year.

[JZP]

^ What he said