Time For A Big Service, Here's What's Wrong...

[KrazyKong]

I've had bad tyre wear now for a few years. I've been putting things off and rotating tyres etc., but it's now finally time to get it all sorted. Here's the report I got back from one of the local tyre places that I trust.

Front brake pads are worn to pretty much nothing, so that's an obvious thing to get done asap.

Q: Does it matter what brand, if there is even a brand they put on? Was quoted $125 for the front.

The front radius bushes are shot. This was also contributing to bad tyre wear.

Q: Does brand matter here? Whiteline, Nolathane? What the type of rubber material/rubber used? Was quoted $171 for the pair.

The front shocks, especially the left one is totally knackered. So will get both front's replaced. The back ones are ok apparently and I think are still stock.

Q: I think they will use Pedders brand shocks. Don't know what model or variety. How do these rate? I don't track the car, but do go on a cruise one or twice a year. Plus I don't mind taking corners hard, flying down the motorway etc. Was quoted $420 for the pair.

The center bearing needs replacing. This is in the driveshaft apparently. They don't have a price yet and will get back to me on it.

And I need 4x new Tyres.

Fronts 235/45/17

Rears 255/40/17

Right now I have Nexen N3000's on the rears. The fronts are some junk brand called Gemstone, and I've already replaced the front left with a BF Goodrich Sport tyre to keep me on the road.

I don't think I want to go with the Nexen's N3000. They are suggesting I go with a Nexen N'Fera RU5 tyre for the fronts and rears. It looks too plain jane for me from the pics I've seen of it.

Quoted $418 for the rears and $290 for the fronts.

I do love the tread pattern of the Nexen N3000 tyres though. I've seen the Federal 595s which look good, but after reading more about them, I'm not too keen on the wet driving aspect of them. The only other tyre I know that has a very similar tread pattern is the Toyo T1R. I can't seem to find any info on the 255/40/17 size accept references from the U.S. I'm sure they will be more expensive then $418 for a pair. The Kuhmo KU31 look interesting.

The Toyo T1R's are probably out of my price range anyway, but I'm open to suggestions on tyres.

Toyo T1R

Toyo Proxes 4

Kuhmo KU31

Federal 595SS


Nexen N3000

All up including labour the whole lot accept the center bearing which they will get back to me on, comes to just under $1800.

I'm wondering if any of these things I can do myself to try and save on costs. I've put my own intercooler, fuel pump, heater core., radiator etc. But I havn't done anything major like shocks, radius bushes etc. Will these all need special tools, air tools (I only have regular socket tools)?

Thoughts & comments are most appreciated.

Edited April 5, 2014 by KrazyKong

[GTSBoy]

Brake pads. Original Nissan ones or Bendix Ultimate for a normal sort of pad. Only let someone talk you into other pads if you're going to start flogging the car. Do not allow them to fit no-name or ching-chong pads.

Castor bushes (radius rod bushes). Any urethane bush will be fine. Adjustable Whiteline ones are your best choice (or adjustables from the other brands).

Dampers are important. $400 ish per pair is cheap territory, but at least not crap. Although, I would never, ever, ever allow a Pedders shop to work on my car or fit any of their products to my car. I am fitting some custom valved Bilstein dampers to my car soon. Sourced from SydneyKid on here. ~$650 each end of the car. Wort every single $ above the cost of what you will get for $400 and then some.

You can fit all that stuff yourself, but disassembling the springs off of suspension units can be dangerous without spring clamps. You will likely need the old caster bushes pressed out and new ones pressed in, but you could remove and refit the rods themselves no issue. Just take them to a workshop to get the bushes changed. $10 or a couple bottles of beer. You will need a wheel alignment afterwards though.

Tyres. KU31 are very good value. A decent tyre, not massively sporty, not too expensive. For a much stickier tyre, KU36. Won't last as long, quite noisy, fine in the wet (much better than 595RS). Otherwise, I can recommend The Toyos you have shown - both are good. As you suspect the T1R is out of your range. Achilles make a couple of tyres you could look at. Cheap and cheerful but quite good. Falken FK452 is old tech but very good. Might be able to find someone selling them cheap. Dunlop Direzza similarly.

[KrazyKong]

Thanks for your reply GTSBoy.

The tyre place I went to is not Pedders. In fact I went to Pedders and paid for a car checkup a year ago, and then pretty much threw their report in the bin. They said my rear tie rod ends were totally shafted and needed immediate replacement. A year later they seem fine, and this place checked them and said they did not need replacing at this point in time.

I know of a friend who installed adjustable shocks himself. Seems they are easier to do than the regular ones? I have heard of people going to places to get the caster bushes pushed out and replaced. Actually taking out and refitting the rods does look doable to me. So the Whiteline brand makes a better bush than Nolathane?

I know I need a proper alignment afterwards. I had been holding off all year thinking I'd go ahead and get around to tackling all these things myself, but I never got around to it. If I only save myself $100 by doing the work myself vs paying a shop it's not worth it. But if I can bring that $1800 down to say $1000 and do the labour myself, I'm keen to try. I mean I can do brake pads ok too.

I can't afford to pay $1800 all in one go anyway, so I think first off, I'll do the brake pads myself, then get the front shocks and caster bushes sorted. It still might even be cheaper to go and get some $50 near new tyres on the car to buy me some time until everything is sorted for new proper tyres. The last thing I want to do is put new tyres on again and see them wear badly and scallop like they last 2 sets have.

[GTSBoy]

Your rotors are likely going to need to be skimmed at the very least. Depends on what state they are in. Get a wheel off and have a good look at them. if there is a noticeable lip, or if the surface is not damn near flat, then check the others as well. Get a pair of verniers onto them and see if they are going to have enough meat on them to machine them. If they require machining, you can get a mobile brake guy to come around and do them on the car while you have it up on stands when you're doing the pads. Do not put new pads onto discs that require machining. You will regret it. If you have to buy new rotors.....then do so.

Whiteline is not "better" than Nolathane. It's just that Nolathane is the oldest and best known brand for urethane bushes....at least best known amongst people who haven't heard of the various others. SuperPro being the main alternative, but there are others. It's all pretty inbred in that business these days anyway.

[niZmO_Man]

Brake pads = QFM HPX

Tyres = Falken FK452 (I haven't tried FK453 nor Nitto INVO but they seem to be good; source Falken from Tempe tyres, Nitto from Taleb). KU31 seem to have gone up in price, but if you can find them for ~$150 each, they are great value tyres. Tempe has Dunlop SP Sport Maxx for ~$150 each in your sizes.

[hardsteppa]

Brake pads, the lucas/ remsa pads have been great for me and only about 80 a set. Tyres, have had the toyo t1r's, very good, and proxes4, didn't like them. For the radius bushes, for 171, i would recommend just spend 14 more and get a set of hardrace adjustsble rods, 185 delivered off ebay

[hardsteppa]

Also what location are you? Might be someone that could help with a few things and save some $$

[KrazyKong]

Your rotors are likely going to need to be skimmed at the very least. Depends on what state they are in. Get a wheel off and have a good look at them. if there is a noticeable lip, or if the surface is not damn near flat, then check the others as well. Get a pair of verniers onto them and see if they are going to have enough meat on them to machine them. If they require machining, you can get a mobile brake guy to come around and do them on the car while you have it up on stands when you're doing the pads. Do not put new pads onto discs that require machining. You will regret it. If you have to buy new rotors.....then do so.

Whiteline is not "better" than Nolathane. It's just that Nolathane is the oldest and best known brand for urethane bushes....at least best known amongst people who haven't heard of the various others. SuperPro being the main alternative, but there are others. It's all pretty inbred in that business these days anyway.

My front rotors are smooth. I asked the guy doing the car check about them, and he said they were fine. He even let me in under the car whilst it was hoisted up and I felt them as well and did not feel any ripples or grooves or anything. So getting new pads on ASAP will save me getting the fronts machined. The rears ones have a few small grooves on them, but the pads are still at 1/2, so he said to just leave the rears for now.

Brake pads = QFM HPX

Tyres = Falken FK452 (I haven't tried FK453 nor Nitto INVO but they seem to be good; source Falken from Tempe tyres, Nitto from Taleb). KU31 seem to have gone up in price, but if you can find them for ~$150 each, they are great value tyres. Tempe has Dunlop SP Sport Maxx for ~$150 each in your sizes.

Thanks I'll add these names to the list and look into them a bit more.

Brake pads, the lucas/ remsa pads have been great for me and only about 80 a set. Tyres, have had the toyo t1r's, very good, and proxes4, didn't like them. For the radius bushes, for 171, i would recommend just spend 14 more and get a set of hardrace adjustsble rods, 185 delivered off ebay

Once it's setup and aligned etc., how will adjustable rods benefit me? I don't track the car or anything like that.

Also what location are you? Might be someone that could help with a few things and save some $$

I'm on the Gold Coast in QLD

Are any of the brake pad brand names available from Super Cheap/Autobarn/Global Auto etc., stores? I could research all these parts for weeks before making a decision, but I need to get some pads on the car within days, so even if it's a cheapie set that won't last for years, at least I have something on the car.

I've had a quick look also on eBay and see:

Remsa $88

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/REMSA-FRONT-BRAKE-PADS-DB1170-NISSAN-SKYLINE-R32-R33-R34-BRAKE-PADS-4-PISTON-TRW-/310907358908?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item486385cebc

QFM HPX $79

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/QFM-HPX-High-Performance-Brake-Pads-Suit-Front-Nissan-Skyline-R33-GTST-/371030325608?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5663217968

QFM A1RM $119

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/QFM-A1RM-Street-Track-Brake-Pads-Suit-Front-Nissan-Skyline-R33-GTST-/370761844251

Not knowing anything about pads, what are the pros and cons for these options? I can't find any Lucas ones with my initial searches. I also have stock rotors too.

If price isn't an issue I'd probably get the A1RM, then Remsa, then HPX ones. Is that an accurate guestimate of their ranking?

Edited April 6, 2014 by KrazyKong

[gtr jet]

The A1RM is more of a track orientated pad but will still work on the street. In your case I would go with the HPX. They'll be more than enough for what you need and last longer than the A1RM's.

For tyres, I've used the federal 595 SS's and they've been fine in the wet. At $100ea I couldn't really fault them.

Bushes, I prefer Super Pro over Nolathane, just found them to be a bit quiter and last a bit longer.

The only reason I wouldn't put adjustable Hardrace items in a street car is legality.

Shocks are going to be one of your biggest choices and how much you want to spend. Personally after running Pedders, Monore and a couple of other brands. I'd spend the extra and get some Koni's or Bilstiens for better quality and comfort.

[zoomzoom]

My front rotors are smooth. I asked the guy doing the car check about them, and he said they were fine. He even let me in under the car whilst it was hoisted up and I felt them as well and did not feel any ripples or grooves or anything. So getting new pads on ASAP will save me getting the fronts machined. The rears ones have a few small grooves on them, but the pads are still at 1/2, so he said to just leave the rears for now.

Its not just the surface quality, ideally you'll want to check to see if the rotor has warped slightly.

[hardsteppa]

have pm'ed you re parts and your budget.

Lucas pads are likely to be listed as TRW, who also make Remsa, pretty much the same pad apparently. Plenty of good reviews on here about them and I believe the best value pad for their price range, my set has lasted for years now, no noise, fair bit of dust though but so what, just shows it's working .

Any urethane bush will be fine. Adjustable Whiteline ones are your best choice (or adjustables from the other brands).

agreed, urethane bushes pretty much all the same. Adjustable is better but they're expensive for what they are. The non-adjustable is about half the price and still firms up the front nicely.

[niZmO_Man]

A1RM is a heavy street/light track pad. If you don't drive your car often then use them, they work fine when cold but get better once they're warm. I've used HPX on my GT-R as a daily pad and it's great. Less dusty than the A1RM as well. In saying that, I wouldn't use less than A1RM in my GT-R, need that fade resistance on downhill roads.

Resma is apparently a bit better than HPX so that should be the go if you daily your car.

You're in QLD so buy one off GSL Rally/Brakes direct (located in Brisbane), should come next day

[GTSBoy]

The only reason I wouldn't put adjustable Hardrace items in a street car is legality.

The only problem with that statement is that it isn't the adjustable length arms that are illegal per se. It is more the rose joints that the road authorities don't like. The Hardrace ones have harder rubber bushes, so they won't actually be illegal. The only risk is getting that through the thick head of a street side copper who just wants to defect you. He may or may not know why adjustable suspension arms are unroadworthy and just assume that all such arms are unroadworthy.

Myself, I just use proper rose jointed adjustable caster arms because they are so much better than any bushed arm, and the risk of them getting seen is not very high.

[gtr jet]

I didn't think the Hardrace arms came in rubber, that's the only reason I said for legality reasons. My mistake.

I run Hardrace rose jointed arms throughout and love them.

[niZmO_Man]

Paint the arms black

[GH05T]

why would you go for rosejointed over a rubber bushed option for a street car?

shortened life span and noisier.

[GTSBoy]

why would you go for rosejointed over a rubber bushed option for a street car?

shortened life span and noisier.

Simply because any bush at the front end of the caster arm allows much more fore-aft movement of the lower control arm than I like to see (and experience) on the car. Even on the street.

I have had rooted stock bushes, polyurethane and rose joints on the caster arms on my car, and I could clearly feel the difference in how much better the location of the front suspension was controlled at each step in that replacement/upgrade chain.

Shorter lifespan.....maybe. But you can replace the joints when they wear out.

Noisier......maybe, but in my experience, driving around the streets at normal speeds, they do not make noise that I can hear over everything else going on in the car. The only time I notice that there's more road noise associates with them is when flogging through the hills on ripply bitumen or similar high speed + bumpy situations.

Edited April 7, 2014 by GTSBoy

[GH05T]

fair comment

[KrazyKong]

Wow alot of great info here guys.

I've narrowed down the brake pads to Remsa or QFM HPX. I'd like the one that creates the least dust. I've been told Remsa are quite dusty. The QFM A1RM sound good, but looking at them more, and readings some comments here, for a daily drive car that I maybe do one cruise a year in, and just drive to work etc., they don't seem to be the right option for me.

Still trying to understand more about going with adjustable rods and getting new bushes into my stock ones. Not even sure on the price of the bushes, and where to go, to get the old bushes punched out, and the new ones pushed in.

Tyres... tyres. Ahh. Iv'e had such a bad run with tyre wear, I'm almost thinking of just getting some 75% tread ones from the second hand tyre place I've gone to before. I got a brand new BF Goodwrich Sport tyre a year ago for $50 from them, but only because they had one. But I've gotten Pirelli's and other really good brands and makes of tyres for my previous cars, some near new, and all for $50 each fitted. The reason for this, is I want to be sure, really sure that this time my tyres will wear properly. So to me it's kind of worth putting on a near new set to see how they wear, before forking out serious $$ on a good set. Maybe the 595SS are a cheap enough option to just go with and see how they wear. I do like the tread pattern, seeing as how I currently have the Nexen N3000. Anyway, it's something I still can't decide what direction to go in just yet. I just can't go through another drama of paying for several wheel alignments (4 wheel variety), only to see my tyres wearing all crap and weird. Some of the places I've been to missed the fact my front tie rod ends (left side) was moving over an inch. But they all took my money to do alignments without ever noticing or telling me there was issues.

My main questions right now that I am trying to understand are this.

Adjustable castor rods vs stock or fixed caster rods... I'm happy with my camber, not sure I need any more caster than stock. Pros/Cons?

Coil overs vs shocks... I want the ride to feel the same as stock, but maybe a smidge firmer. But not bouncy hard as nails lowrider feel. Will coil overs give me a close or slightly better feel than stock or equivalent shocks? I don't the ride being a bit firmer, a more sportier feel, but I've got to be honest and say I'm happy with my stock shocks in terms of firmness. Cornering in the front end is probably a bit not so good, but my shocks are worn, leaking and had it, so that's understandable. My car isn't lowered either and other than a few mms, I don't ever plan to lower it.

[GTSBoy]

Coilovers you can afford are CRAP compared to real dampers.

Caster. You can never have too much caster. Almost. In reality, at the minimum I would use adjustable poly bushes because the extra little bit of caster they give you is worth it. You will not use all the caster adjustment available in fully adjustable rods because it loads up the suspension too much, placing a lot of unnecessary preload into the upper and lower suspension arm bushes (although it is not as bad on an R33 as it is on an R32). But as I have already said, it's not about the adjustment on these, it's about getting rid of the bushes altogether and having metal on metal joints at the front. Pure bliss bu comparison to squidgy bushes. And the extra caster you can wind in over and above what adjustable bushes give you is still useful. You can add in an extra degree which definitely improves dynamic camber and grip.