Need for a powerFC on a stockish car?

[Guilty]

Hi everyone!

i just need some help as ive searched through some sites and through this site as well and havent really got a detailed answer to what im looking for, and i really some advice.

I just want to know the advantages of getting a power FC on a stockish R33 GTS-t..with only exhaust, pod and bov as the mods. I have been planning to get a power FC for my car and get it tuned, when i get more mods into my car...but due to the relative cheapness of them through the SAU group buy, i am thinking about getting one! If i do get one installed, will there be any immediate power gains?

If i do get them, what other mods should come after the power fC?

sorry for the newbish qnz...

thanks

GuiLty

[DezertEagle]

PowerFC is a good mod through any stage of the modification process (earlier the better)

Allows your car to run 'safer' as you power up, that is with a proper tune.

Also it 'should' give you better fuel economy due to your engine running more efficiently.

[performance-wise]

I just purchased a power fc and commander through nengun for about $1100 delivered around a week ago.

I am getting it installed and tuned tomorrow in Canberra at EVO.

I have similar mods to you like zorst, BOV and pod.

next mods will be FM intercooler, oil catch can, boost control, injectors, and finally turbo(also another tune), clutch, suspension and brakes/rotors.

From what I have read the power fc (if properly tuned) will aid in the fuel/air ratio which is being altered with the mods you have taken out so far and also the low octane fuel available in OZ.

It overrides the speed limiter and also gives you more visible readouts of your cars running performance and options and Gauges.

the standard ECU is not programmed for any mods to the car.

Since you have altered the cars breathing abilities then it makes sense to alter the management system to prolong the life of your motor and maintain the performance output by efficiently managing it.

I dont know a lot about the PFCs but from what I have read so far it makes sense.

The price offered in the group buy is very good - you wouldnt be able to find it cheaper anywhere.

check out - http://www.apexi-usa.com/electronics_fc.asp for more info.

[Gav]

A programmable ECU will enable you to tune to what YOU consider a priority and not what the manufacturor wants. For example, normally you are tuning for power and/or torque.

Tuning for fuel efficiency however, is another option. Unfortutely you need the Datalogit and a laptop to have multiple maps, but you could, in theory you could have an ultra conservative map (low boost, retarded ignition) to enable 95 octane fuel for a long drive or country trip, and an second for high boost and power applications where you only can run 98 fuel.

[Guilty]

I read from the apexi USA site about the powerFC having an optional boost controller?

Is that actually sold seperately or is that just another model of a power FC...?

If so which model has the optional boost controller n which doesnt?

Well if they powerfc comes with a built in boost controller, wouldnt that eliminate the need for a EBc?

[DezertEagle]

It's sold seperately.

Reports have it that the optional boost control kit doesnt work too well, and your better off getting another 'stand alone' EBC.

[2BNVS]

yer just get an avc-r from nengun, $600

ben...

[dojobi]

The Power FC uses the exact same solenoid as the AVC-R. I can't see how it could be bad. If you just want to set the boost you want, then I'd say that's the controller to get. If you want a bit more control of your boost with different boost for different gears (personally I can't see the need for it), then get the AVC-R.

They both hold boost equally well.

[fane]

profec-b for ebc...cant lose....my experience with avcrs is not good....boost creeps and boost falls...

[fresh]

wheres a good place in sydney to get a PFC installed and tuned, need it prolly in and out in 1 day

[Sydneykid]

It's sold seperately.

Reports have it that the optional boost control kit doesnt work too well, and your better off getting another 'stand alone' EBC.

Sorry gotta dissagree, the Boost Control Kit works perfectly on our cars, 4 of which now use them (2 X GTR's, 1 X GTT & 1 X GTST). It has exactly the same solenoid as the Apexi AVCR so that is hardly likely to be an issue. I have had a couple of people complain about the BCK, but both times it has been set up. And that happens to all electronic boost controllers.

[4door_Sleeper]

I had a PFC very early in my mods, and wouldnt do it any other way (unless you have the cash to do all mods at once)

The PFC makes the car a lot better to drive and removes the flat spot in the middle of the std EC. Ther car pulled strong all the way to the rev limit, and any other mods are easy to tune for.

[Guilty]

Hey SydneyKid, so where exactly can you buy this boost controller kit that comes with the powerFC?

Does it function exactly the same as the AVC-r, where u can set diferent boost levels, by adjusting the HC?

4door_sleeper...what mods did u get after the PFC?

hummmmm imreally undecided if i should buy one or not.....since i dont really know enough about this shyyyt to make an educated opinion! sooo need some good advice...

SydneyKid, your probally one of the most respected people on SAU and probally knows the most as well, with the mods i have (exhaust, pod, bov) what would be your next move?

Like i was planning to get the power fc anyway, but just not so quick.....

and as a uni student, money is hard to come by, so do you think investing in a PFC would be more value for money or say get an EBC.....and which one exactly has more power gains?

[Roy]

profec-b for ebc...cant lose....my experience with avcrs is not good....boost creeps and boost falls...

Yeh i hear about this, but i think it dpends on whether you have sat down and read the manual and understand how it works. It isnt hard to setup, just need to know what means what. With the std turbo it worked fine.

Now using it to run an external gate, i have an 0.65bar spring and even with such a soft spring it holds 1.3 bar like a champion, no spikes, no boost dropp off. Then i have setting B at 1.0bar and again stable boost control. So with it off it only runs 0.65 bar... so 3 settings with a scramble feature im yet to wire up and try.

Not saying its the best... just i dont buy the whole unstable boost etc, they work really well, just like many other EBCs on the market. From what i have read many EBCs would need a std wastegate spring aorund 1.0bar to hold stable 1.3bar?!?!?!?!?!?!

[Sydneykid]

Hey SydneyKid, so where exactly can you buy this boost controller kit that comes with the powerFC?

Does it function exactly the same as the AVC-r, where u can set diferent boost levels, by adjusting the HC?

4door_sleeper...what mods did u get after the PFC?

hummmmm imreally undecided if i should buy one or not.....since i dont really know enough about this shyyyt to make an educated opinion! sooo need some good advice...

SydneyKid, your probally one of the most respected people on SAU and probally knows the most as well, with the mods i have (exhaust, pod, bov) what would be your next move?

Like i was planning to get the power fc anyway, but just not so quick.....

and as a uni student, money is hard to come by, so do you think investing in a PFC would be more value for money or say get an EBC.....and which one exactly has more power gains?

Hi Guilty, personally my next move would be to a tunable ECU. You get rid of the speed limiter, the boost cut, rich and retard engine protection, the fuel economy improves noticeably and you get more power at the same time. There isn't anything else I know of that can do that much at the current prices. Power FC's used to cost twice what they do now, then it was a harder decision. Now I always do it very early in the upgrade path.

I buy new Power FC Boost Control Kits from Nengun. They do come up used on the forum occasionally, guys who set them up wrong sell them. Maybe I should let the rumours continue about them being crap, that way I will get lots of cheap ones from people who believe the rumours. The WRX boys are a good source, they always wire them up using the standard wiring, and then wonder why they don't work properly. They hear the rumours, believe the rumours and sell them believing the crap flying around that they don't work on WRX's.

One day I will learn to keep quiet about this sort of stuff, I used to be able to get RB20 wastegate actuators easily and cheaply. Now everyone knows, I can't find them anymore.

I adjust the power levels with my right foot, if I don't want to go fast I don't push it down so far. Adjustable boost levels are a waste of oxygen for me, but if you must, you can easily do it on the Commander. I just can't stand the thought of "can we run that race again please, I forgot to turn the boost up". Yeh right.

Hope that helps:cheers:

[4door_Sleeper]

If you have a exhaust, pod & bov the next mods could include :

PFC, an intercooler should be on your list as a needed upgrade, and a boost controller (bleed valves are cheap, but electronic boost controllers (EBC)are a better option)

To get the most bang for your buck I would add the PFC and a bleed valve for now (set to 12psi), then look at getting an intercooler next and upgrading to an EBC later. (You know that getting a SAFC is only a stop gap measure and that if you want to go further you will have to get a PFC or simillar in the end, so dont waste the cash, and get the PFC first)

Your next lot of upgrades could include a fuel pump, perhaps injectors (or a fuel regulator) and un upgraded turbo.

These upgrades are all for the motor, but dont forget to ensure the WHOLE car is up to spec, you may need to upgrade/check the brakes tyres and suspension to get the best out of your car.

[Roy]

... Adjustable boost levels are a waste of oxygen for me, but if you must, you can easily do it on the Commander.  I just can't stand the thought of "can we run that race again please, I forgot to turn the boost up".  Yeh right.

I hear you, but....

Two times where i think they can be handy is where you set them up to boost at different levels in different gears, and you have a scramble button...So can easily run lower boost in 1st and 2nd, with healthier hits in 3rd adn 4th...i suppose the Boost Control kit can do this, but im pretty sure it cant be wired with a button for scramble.

And when you are driving at the track in the wet, id have buckley of handling my car in the wet with 1.3bar, in the dry its fine, but in a 20 min session the track conditions can change and its nice to be able in 3 sec down the straight just hit a button and wind 30-40 kws out of it...makes it much easier coming onto boost.

But that said i spend 95% of my time at the one boost setting

[ECR033]

I'm pretty much in the same position as Guilty except that I also have a Mines ECU (which I've been told is unprogramable), so this thread is pretty much exactly the advice I've been looking for. I'm in the process of also looking for a FMIC at the moment, so I'm pretty much convinced that I'm taking the right path by going for the PFC now as well. I'll probably get a bleed valve for the time being and then get it dyno tuned and see how we go. What type of power would I be looking at with these mods? Would around 200rwkw be realistic?

Thanks for the help

[4door_Sleeper]

MASON - a PFC, 3 inch exhaust (from turbo to tip), intercooler and a bit more boost (13psi) should get you around 200rwkw (or just a bit short) depending upon how agressive the tuner is. Some cars seem to come up better than others, but you may also have to factor in a fuel pump to get there (depends on the condition of your pump, but it is also good insurance)

[Guilty]

hhmmmmmmmm

hey SK how much did the boost controller kit cost u??

and guys approx how much does a dyno tune + PFC install cost in sydney?

I'm assuming the best places to go to would be UAS or CRD?

Hmmmm very tempting..i think i will go for the PFC now n get a cheap Bleed valve now, get it tuned, and when i save enough money during the summer, get the FMIC as well...

sounds like the rright thing to do...