Women, 4WDs and carparks....... a recipe for disaster!

[racsov500]

r33 convert-

i can see why you are offended, but we arent aiming this at you. you are one of the few people who actually use their 4wd for work, such as myself. ( we are a dying breed ) what we are 'bitching' :wassup: about is the stupid mindless oblivious soccermums who buy 2.5 ton 4wds and never, ever take them off road. and are glad they have a 4wd when they go over the harsh terrain of the dirt carpark at the school. or so they can drive over traffic islands in the shopping centre carpark. so dont think this is aimed at you, its not.

thumbs up for the lpg conversion, prob uses less fuel than most!

[krawler]

Diesel is ultimate win for 4x4s, especially turbo'd.

[racsov500]

might not be 'we', but i sure arent.

just to add to this, today i saw a brand new patrol TI diesel. had brand new bullbar, lights, tyres, sidesteps ect BUT NOT A SCRATCH. it is possible that it could be that the owner just bought it and is yet to venture out of the suburbs, but i think it is unlikely cause a mid 40s woman was driving it with kids in the back... now i dont mean to be sexist/'ageist' but i think thats just another 4wd thatl never be used as it is so equipped. thats what i though when i saw it...

[strutto]

What upsets me most is how bloody capable Crusiers and Patrols ARE off road... Such a waste...

[The_Paladin]

it's not a minority........it's a lot more than that. and the problem isnt that most people think most 4WD owners are ignorant and selfish. the problem is that most people DONT think 4WD owners are these things............

the people that take them offroad are the minority. anyone who owns a 4WD for reasons other than using it for its intended puropse is selfish because they are sacrificing other peoples safty for their own means.

[BelGarion]

after spending a month tearing round a farm in a old 80s series landcruiser and the furthest i had to drive it in town was to the shop and back, it bemuses me why anyone would want to drive these things as a daily driver. they are heavy, they understeer, they have so much body roll its insane!

Tried parking the damn thing in parallel parking, gave up and went and parked it down the road in a empty building space, unless you got a straight runup it was pointless. the steering on them is pathetic, the turning circle even more so.

Want to stop? Better start thinking about it at least 50m before the corner and make sure you dont rely only on the brakes cause they arnt gonna stop you unless you got 100m of stopping distance.

No I agree with the sentiments expressed by the majority of the people in this thread. 4wds are an evil that can be done without in the city. Sure its different in places out west where half the roads start off sealed for the first 50m then end up dirt. But on the m1 and the city.... not where they belong. In my usual line of work i drive a 4wd van, it too is a heap of shit when it comes to handling, braking ability and the ability to actually move when the accelerator is pressed. They should be used for what they are originally intended for, workhorses nt family movers. I will happily wait for someone to show me WHY a minivan is not a better alternative to a prado, ect in regards to use as a family vehicle. If your so worried about loosing traction on a paved road, buy a holden crosstrack station wagon or crewman ute (yes surprisingly you can fit the same amount of people in a station wagon as you can a prado)

In regards to camping, unless your intending to go to some pretty wild and inaccessable country you are hardly going to need a prado with full lift kit, oversize tyres, 600 spotlights and a dirty big spair tyre stuck on your back door blocking your view of cars behind you.

I have had personal experiences with 4wd owners and their egos and inconsideration for other road users.

/end rant

/go back to bed

[pentae]

Belgarion: I agree. I personally think the new Honda Odyssey is the ultimate people mover! And how awesome would it be if they where everywhere? They are not as high, you can see past them/through them easily, not petrol guzzling big bastards, they are sleek and they belong in the city.

They look a lot classier than some shitty prado imho, too.

Why isnt there more cars like this on the road for moving around kids and families? They are a lot safer.

Probably drive a lot less like a boat as well

[The_Paladin]

these cars arnt as popular cause the drivers arse is too close to the ground...........it's still an arrogance thing. i dont think any manufacturers could make a good substitute unless it had the same ride hight with would defeat the point of it.........

only the government can crack down on this.

[Del Sol]

only the government can crack down on this.

Exactly, fix the tax break situation and the 4WD will no longer be such an attractive alternative to a real people mover.

[Silver'sR33]

I think they have to go further than fixing a tax break....a council in sydney recently decided that because 4wds use more of the road's features - more parking, more wear to the road, more pollution, cause more traffic - they should pay commensurately more for local parking permits. I think this is the right approach - it should be extended across rates and regos. If they want the privelige of having an oversized, unsafe, unnecessary vehicle then why shouldn't they pay for it at least?

[R33S2]

On my journeys around australia in a 323 (50,000ks $500 rwd) I came across a fair few 4wds and in my veiw the dirtier, scrachted and dented, the more better a road user more considerate etc while shiny new ones would be up the clacker and grazing the mirrors to get by. they are a useful tool for the man/woman on the land but should stay there

Tax em back out there.

Recent scaremongering on news shows say fuel will be $2/ltr in 2006 maybe that will reduce them.

[Del Sol]

Recent scaremongering on news shows say fuel will be $2/ltr in 2006 maybe that will reduce them.

I doubt thats going to happen.... But it certainly does fix the problem! Just check out the UK, where everyone drives 4cyl. You almost never even see a 4WD on the road over there. And the people that need people movers drive actual people movers (with nice little turbodieslels in them)

[The_Paladin]

nah, i'm going to have to argue that.............

the UK is not as bad as australia by no means, but you still get a hell of a lot of 4WD's about, which simply arn't needed. most are of the north sydney varity too (X5's, XC90's, Range Rover) They're very popular and unlike australia there is pretty much no anti-4wd movement here. there isnt enough of them to be a problem. but due to parking and fuel costs here you have to be very rich to own one, they're real status symbols...........

unfortunatly they cant just tax 4WD's off the roads........the farmers would go crazy and both sides of politics needs the rual vote. What they could do is not only offer tax breaks, but also subsidies on 4WD's to people who's primary place of residence is in a rural area (i know, that's tricky to define) which would actually make them cheaper than they are now. and they could pay for this buy taxing the nuts off the rest of the 4WD market.

[Silver'sR33]

Yeah in recent years I've heard 4WDs are becoming more and more of a problem in the UK and europe too. The majority of non-4wd users drive small cars that are good in the city, but 4wds are still and issue - the mayors of London and Paris have specifically said they will look at measures to ban them from the metropolitan area in the future.

[Del Sol]

So they're catching on over there too now?

[The_Paladin]

yeah apparently paris has banned them from the city centre.........not sure. i might have thought that was aginst EU law.

i visited some of the highlands today, rural area.........there's a lot more up there. but yeah they are catching on. the only cars which are not 4cyc manuals are merc's, bmw's, jag's and that's about it............small cars are huge over here. that sounds like a contradiction but it's true!

[Silver'sR33]

EU can't make law on such things...France is still an independant state, EU makes some agreed laws across the EU with regard to stuff like work permits blah blah but as far as day to day running of cities etc there is no way in hell any state in the EU would hand over its autonomy to run things as it sees fit.

[krawler]

I was at a servo today doing a job and was having a yap to the owner about 4x4s. Shes very anti-4x4 and we were having a "sucks to you!" type conversation about how 4x4 owners are paying over $100 a tank atm due to current petrol prices.

One thing she mentioned was a lady who is the "typical soccer mum" 4x4 owner (her words too ) came in complaining about how inconsiderate small car owners are. The servo chiq was like "Uhm, whys that?" and the 4x4 owner said "Because they never think to leave enough room for people like me! Why should I have to do a 5 point turn to get into a carpark because small car owners arent considerate enough to leave more room?"

There are no words strong enough to express the immense amounts of disdain I feel for people like that.

[racsov500]

complaining about how inconsiderate small car owners are. The servo chiq was like "Uhm' date=' whys that?" and the 4x4 owner said "Because they never think to leave enough room for people like me! Why should I have to do a 5 point turn to get into a carpark because small car owners arent considerate enough to leave more room?"QUOTE']

that pisses me off so much, it is indescibable how much that pisses me off. just shows how selfish some people are. wonder what the bitch would say if everyone drove 4wds and then she had to do a 10 point turn. look around you you oblivious arrogant fool. guess you were in a hurry to get to the coffee club and read those magazines that stalk celebrtities and read about how some actor will definately be getting married after looking at some other famous person. dont worry im a mum i can do what the f**k i want and no one can stop me

[The_Paladin]

that's the attitude plain and simple............they are above the rest.