Project 12sec R33 GTST Daily Driver

[rev210]

It softens the rubber on the tyres, overnight. The ozrace website has it (same guys that do OzNos kits ). There are a few different componds availible, this one is reputed not to eat the tyres as much.

[GTS-t VSPEC]

Yeah, I've heard of the stuff before, but don't know of anyones who's tried it, might give it a go on a spare set of tyres.

See'ya:burnout:

[b2barker]

This Autospeed article that says that tyre width is not main determining factor in tyre grip. It said car weight and tyre pressure determine contact patch on the road. eg. a 205 has the same area on the ground as a 235, but it is longer and narrower, for the same weight, same pressure. Food for thought.

[GTS-t VSPEC]

b2barker,

The article raises some important questions about tyre selections etc, but as we all tend to run lower pressures at the drags then the area of contact with the surface will be larger for the wider tyre.

Yes it is the frictional coefficient which determines the grip, but the amount of power that can be applied is related to this and the surface area, therefore more area and a good tyre are better.

I think tread pattern and block size have roles to play in tyre choice, it is a complicated area to actually analyse, with tyre companies spending many millions of dollars in research, but I think that lower pressures, good gripping rubber and increased tyre width will be the way to go for the drags.

See'ya:burnout:

[rev210]

Wider is better if you talk the same brand (compound) and same inflation. So its kind of old news put a different way.

people ought not to go out and buy 205 simex tyres in the belief that their old 265's have less traction.

[SHUTO-BOY]

I saw this guy bring a portable tyre inflater at the plex once(i think),does anyone know how much they cost? Rev,i agree with turbo mad, a front mount is what you need,anyway your car is amazingly fast for stock turbo,intercooler.

[rev210]

Most of the portable tyre inflators suck. They take a million years to inflate a tyre, thats fine if you have the luxury of time but, when the staff at the plex are kicking you out it isn't helpfull. I just drove home on 20psi. If you do get one get the mother of all 4wd tyre inflators so it takes less time.

My friend a frount mount will only hold me back, it will dull the response of the stock turbo in the mid range. It is not something I'd even consider doing till I had a replacement turbo fitted and a few other things. As such it does not even appear on my list.

[GTS-t VSPEC]

SHUTO-BOY,

rev's right about the tyre inflators, I have two in my boot, the cheap one from Auto 1 is totally crap, have a spare 30mins to do one tyre, the other one is a bit better. The 4WD ones are more expensive, but at least they do a decent job.

I don't agree with the FMIC thing, but he is still quicker than me, and he is using the stocker and I have a FMIC, so go figure.

See'ya:burnout:

[Merli]

12s with stock turbo and stock intercooler is extremely unchartered territory.

I guess most people accept what others say about the limits of the standard components, and jump straight into upgrading the two aforementioned parts when aiming for decent times...

Good to see more people challenging the "accepted limits"...

Good luck mate!

[GTS-t VSPEC]

The guys at HPI pushed the limits of there Sin City Soarer with the factory turbo's, I don't think anyone would have expected 250rwKW from the thing.

It's good to know the fundamental limit of things, plus if you can do 12s on a budget then alot more people would start modding there cars.

See'ya:burnout:

[rev210]

Merli,

Cheers mate. I hope to get there on the 205's too which will make the claim (if I ever get there) more reliable for others to follow should they have the same thing in mind (ie: they can expect a time similar or better if they run wider tyres than me).

GTS-t Vspec,

I am faster dispite you having the full engine management, EBC, Trust plenum, fuel regulator and all that other stuff I would love to steal off your car. Oh well I won't be faster for long if you get the GT30 turbo on there.

[Merli]

Magazines are inherent liars. It comes with the territory, and all articles should be taken with a grain of salt.

I'm sure I could get Jim or Con to play with the ramp rates and environment factors and eclipse 325rwkw from my car's current boost level (1.1bar), but we all know it's a bullsh1t figure

They do some good work at HPI and Zoom, and I had a great time with Ben Ellis in Japan (he's a VERY funny drunk), but I'm not convinced all their dyno figures are kosher.

[GTS-t VSPEC]

rev,

I don't think that the plenum and fuel reg. are playing much of a part in my times, but it is all setup in anticipation of the bigger turbo. I'm sure I could knock some more time off my PB but it isn't worth it at the moment.

Merli,

I always read articles with an eye of scepticism, and your right, dyno figures mean squat, but pushing the limits of the turbos and the boost which it supports are all very interesting.

See'ya:burnout:

[rev210]

I take your point's :

Magazines tend to fabricate things a little , HPI's R34GTT does 200rwkw with factory turbo? I don't think so.

On the other hand there is alot to said for trying to squeeze out the last bit of performance from stock parts. At least doing this often costs nothing to very little.

[Martin Donnon]

Originally posted by Merli

They do some good work at HPI and Zoom, and I had a great time with Ben Ellis in Japan (he's a VERY funny drunk), but I'm not convinced all their dyno figures are kosher.

Interesting concept. To back the claims my Soarer, stock turbos, no cams etc. also posted 248rwkw @ Adelaide Auto Salon, in front of around 150 people, on a different dyno, no shootout mode, no corrections, no airtemp in the airbox, at a cell temp of 28 degrees.

It also posted 281rwkw right on the absolute limit of (and probably beyond) the stock turbos output at an LS1/Skyline dyno day in front of thirty something people, no factors, no shootout mode. Whatisname figured my turbos were modified and reckoned the figures were wrong. Once I removed them I made the effort to ring him and get him around for a look. After inspecting them he concluded they were stock....as they were.

As for the black Skyline? I do believe Bens R34GTt made 200rwkw on Croydon Autosports Dyno, after being tuned by Jimmy Souvas. I am quite sure that Jim was not being a liar, regardless of what Merli thinks, nor does he work for a magazine. Hes just a good tuner, working on a car equipped with good product.

My advice for the non-believers is, and always will be, spend the energy put into snied name calling and innuendo into setup and tuning then watch the numbers come.

[GTS-t VSPEC]

Martin,

I enjoy reading the articles on the Project cars you guys have been doing, and am constantly impressed by what power you are able to squeeze out of them.

Keep up the good work.

See'ya:burnout:

[turbomad]

I have also seen 200rwkw with the stock turbo using a PowerFC, with my SAFC I'm managing 188rwkw@12psi, the A/F ratio is only 11.8 too so a possible 190+ may be achievable.

[rev210]

Sorry I shouldn't have used the word 'fabricate' in that sentence, I don't doubt that the dyno did read 200rwkw, you could see that on the video. I am sure the 'real' flywheel kw would tell a different story however. There is simply not enough 'flow' in the standard turbo for an accurate figure of over 200rwkw, on pump gas at 1 bar. The tune however looked sucessfull because there was at least before and after sessions. I agree about the soarer, there is plenty of evidence to suggest that the standard turbos are worth a bit of a go.

[Martin Donnon]

Originally posted by rev210

There is simply not enough 'flow' in the standard turbo for an accurate figure of over 200rwkw, on pump gas at 1 bar.

I dont have a compressor map for an R34 GTt turbocharger so I cant argue with that. To make that assumption you need to do the sums on the factory turbo. Remember its different to the R33 GTS-T unit

[rev210]

Good point.

The Neo engine's are rated at 208kw flywheel from factory as opposed to the 187kw of the R33. Possibly there is a slight flow improement at the compressor, assuming other factors are not responsible.

I think since I am not privy to the compressor map either, I will reisign my position.