Lithium

Awesome! Looks sweet, looking forward to seeing how that sits and does it's thing in an engine bay

Just in case anyone forgot, dyno tomorrow

I semi agree with this too - I'm going to be cautious on calling what I think both will do, but one thing we clearly agree on is that the GTX3076 (and I believe the HTA3076) will go comfortably into the 400kw range on Chequered's dyno with good setups on E85, and yeah - the GTX (and also the HTA) need more than the .63 housings to shine. In my opinion the best of the flow potential of the GTX3076R compressor actually needs the GT35 turbine, I'm not sure it's flow potential is going to show itself much or at all will a GT30 so without proof that it will - it's all academic, one way or another. As I mentioned above, HTAs have so far made no less on equivalent setups (ie, same housings and engine setups) than GTX3076R - power wise a HTA3076 is definitely much more comparable to a GTX3076R than a GTX3071R, if it doesn't match it. The fact that the HTA3076 provides is something which will make power more or less comparable to the GTX3076R with response more or less comparable to a GTX3071R I think is pretty cool.

Agreed with much of what you say - including here really, though comparing turbo to turbo regardless of the platform will paint a bit of a picture of an equivalent HTA and GTX - just the final numbers are obviously going to be a bit different depending on a few things. That thread had Subaru, Mitsubishi and GTR people weighing in - Audi, BMW etc people have also tried some of these combinations and the conclusion is pretty consistent. Again, we have our own 34GeeTeeTee who has laid down numbers beyond what GT and GTX3076s have managed on the same dyno with the same engine - let alone with the power delivery

No worries, there are too many throw away comments on this kind of thing and instead of "nah, no difference" or "I reckon this is better" I figured it easier to just explain why you go for an HTA, though I'm sure most of that is covered in this thread already. Ask Mat, he picked my brain for weeks when he was pondering the decision. It's well known the GTX3076R is slightly laggier (or at BEST comparable) with a normal GT3076R for spool, and the HTA has clearly made his car a different beast in terms of spool or response - without even taking the solid hike in power he got out of it. When had asked me about it, he was looking to improve response and hoping it might possibly nudge 370kw - and if you think about it... managing the same power with substantially better response is an impressive feat, so picking up 30kw and doing arguably at least similar for spool than going to a GT3071R (if you compare GT3076R and GT3071R dyno plots, there isn't much in it) they really are bloody good. Agreed. GTX3071R is one of the best/most worth while of the GTX range - and I'd be really curious about how the GTX3071R and HTA3076 would compare in spool and response, it wouldn't surprise me if the GTX3071R had an edge (the same as it wouldn't surprise me if the GTX3076R made slightly more power) but at the end of the day that when the HTA3076 could conceiveably be compared with the GTX3071R for response, and with the GTX3076R for power.... to me it makes having to decide between any of those three turbos very easy Also, I am sure FP would do a 3073 if you asked them to.

I don't know of anyone who has done a back to back - it's not really the kind of change you'd expect to see someone go out of their way to make and no workshops have, or are likely to do a shoot out with them unfortunately. Trawling around the internet however, and talking to people who have driven both or even one and comparing results, and just looking at the specs on paper the evidence has been overwhelmingly in favour of the HTA in terms of overall performance. The only potential performance advantage I know of the GTX3076R is that it has a 64lb/min rated wheel, however given it's commonly accepted that it's too much compressor for the turbine (especially on an engine which has a decent bit of flow itself) and is better suited to a GT35 that difference over the ~59lb/min of the HTA is probably negligable, or at least all but negligable in terms of real world advantage in this comparison. For what it's worth, so far the highest power figures I've seen for GT30 framed turbos so far have been HTA3076s - I'd not say for a moment that it's because the GTX can't match or outflow it.... but if anything, it's got to be an indicator that on the GT30 hotside the GTX isn't looking like it's holding anything tangible over it - and in a lot of circles (EVO and R35 GTR, who have used these turbos more than anyone else) it seems the overall opinion is the HTA actually is capable of at least as much power. In terms of spool and response, the HTA3076 is well proven to be a very responsive beast - that is an area I am really confident that if someone did a back to back that they are two different beasts, all subjective info (talking to people who have driven them), dyno info, and again looking at the basic specs on paper it becomes pretty clear that the HTA is physically a substantially smaller compressor and it'd be hard to imagine the GTX being an equivalent in terms of response. For what it's worth the GTX3076R has about 6% larger compressor inducer diameter than the HTA3076, which is right in the middle territory of how much of a step up in inducer size you should expect to see when going up to "next size up" compressors when selecting for power versus response. The GTX3076R may as well be a larger turbo, but so far there are no results I have seen to indicate that the trade-offs you make going to one are justified. Here's a thread from the GTR world with people from Subaru and Mitsi backgrounds who have had experience with all options weighing in on the same topic: http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/topic/79848-gtx3076-vs-hta3076both-has-63-ar/ And another GTR thread with a bit (for those who follow TX2K) a low key road car that showed up to TX2K14 and dealt to a lot of much more serious setups with a twin HTA3076 setup: http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/topic/97897-precision-51mm-vs-sir-usm-vs-boost-logic-hta3076/ No direct comparison (well, perhaps aside from trap speeds and side-by-side races ), but clearly the perception is like the HTA does the business

I am sure if Mick had a massive exhaust leak his would sound like that too

The HTA30 and 35s in the Garrett housings don't have epic antisurge whistle - there may be an ever slight background noise (maybe a bit like some GTX do) but nothing like the GT3076R. The HTA3794s sound pretty awesome, and I get the impression the Super94/99 may too - but that's a bit different hahaha. Can't wait to see what the 6466TZ performs and sounds like when someone finally posts results. Interestingly, the FP 3.25" intake housing seem to whistle like hell - Mick_O's 73HTA sounds awesome!

Haven't done too much on it lately - I have been so busy it's not funny with other projects which are both more much more epic and urgent, but it's not off the radar... just got a lot on my plate and I want a bit of all of it haha.

I would totally go the HTA3582 on an RB30, I think it would be a weapon for a fun fast street car. HTA3076 is an awesome turbo and definitely flows more than a GT3076R, but bare in mind these also respond a fair bit better size for size.... the spool of an HTA3582 on a 30 would be awesome, even if you kept it under 400kw it would be a good balance but the headroom to hit or go over 400kw with ease will leave you in a good place imho. Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

I would love to have a go at that if I had the skills/funds/time - have had plenty of theories on the matter, using either twin turbos or super/turbocharging. A guy I know is doing a sequential setup with his Supra which should be running in a few weeks, unfortunately either it's design is flawed or I have more to learn. I hope it's more than I need to learn, as I'll end up wiser and he'll have successfully built a very responsive 1000hp Supra Much reading here: http://www.supraforums.com/forum/showthread.php?720625-Kevin-s-Compound-Sequential-Twin-Turbo-Design

Crikey, nice work! More details on the engine setup? What cams/bottom end/turbo?

That's pretty important progress, glad it's getting there- hopefully smooth sailing and just a bit of a wait until you have it now Good luck!

I keep forgetting about how nasty the law is over there In NZ it's a bit more of a no-brainer, but yeah in Oz things are a bit different. Need more hitech turbos, make up for the lack of displacement with building lots of boost at earlier rpm

Glad you mentioned that. I have for ages discussed, theorised and observed certain affects from different cars which would have different rod angles with some other aspects pretty similar and while a lot of people would (and do) convincingly argue that the r/s ratio doesn't have that much of an effect and certain things (ie, dwell time at TDC and peak acceleration) *seem* trivial I am seeing patterns that suggest these little bits have definite tangible effects on a lot of things. The funny thing though is on the other hand, most of the time people can't really tell the difference and if you hadn't seen the bore damage or any of the other pro's and con's that people debate about weren't spotted under analytical eyess - would they have really mattered? I personally so far am sold as on the old proven RB30DET, a lot cheaper than going a stroker - have an awesome R/S ratio, sound awesome, strong as, and generally have more positives versus negatives than the other options.... at least in my opinion.

Any joy, or news?

I assume he is talking about the 8374 on a 3litre, as that is where Sub-boy's seems to hit full boost at

I think EJ25s don't spool much or any different to RB25s from the results I've seen, though RB25s may flow better - neither motor are great at spooling turbos for their displacement.

Depending on what you want to spend, there are definitely ways of doing it imho. If you wanted to get fancy you could probably do a custom small tube (~28mm ID?) exhaust manifold with a turbo in the 40lb/min range etc then things should be able to get exciting. If you are worried about down low torque/response I'd probably be wary of manifolds which replace or go aggressive on the inlet manifold runner size too, RB20s don't need much of an excuse to get weak down low so try not to give it any.

I'd have thought a Garrett GTX2860R with an internally gated .63a/r T3 turbine housing (for GT28 wheel - I have in my head those are available now?!) on stock manifolds and a hearty dose of boost would do it on good fuel etc. If you have the money to upgrade manifold(s) and maybe do cams then I'd have thought with modern turbos it would be pretty easily achieveable, depending on what you call responsive.

Bummer, but as others have said - I'd normally have expected a phone call if there was an issue so I am guessing they are still behind schedule. Hopefully there is some progress today

Awesome, good luck for today - look forward to hearing how it goes

Yeah, hence "if you are serious" I make do with a G4 Knock Block

Have a look into these if you are serious, too.... http://www.plex-tuning.com/products/plex-knock-monitor Best I've come across so far

Awesome