"scret" Gold Gtr Owner Murdered!

[bombtrack]

R.I.P.

My condolences to his family and friends.

I find the article a little ironic though when it says "Police remain fearful for the safety of Mrs Carruthers and have asked that her image and location not be revealed by the media." and blatantly has a photo of his wife at the top..

I have emailed the Brisbane times regarding what I hope to be an oversight regarding Mrs Curruthers pic at the top of the article. I agree it is very distasteful. I hope some others have done the same.

[32line]

R.I.P

Condolences to his family

[Yidz]

Not nice news at all. Condolences to all friends and family..

[eMsta]

damn..... RIP

[nzm033]

sad story, i live and work in castle hill and always thought it was a safe place

Edited July 3, 2007 by skyline17

[nzm033]

sorry double post

Edited July 3, 2007 by skyline17

[heslo]

Wow, that's a terrible story. My heart goes out to the victim and his family

[negativecamber]

absolutely shocking, nothing else for it.

condolences to the family.

[dnbutts]

RIP, thats crap. The way some wanker can end someones life just like that. If he was to fight back and turn the tables and kill the intruder...he would be in prison!!!

A mate of mine caught a bloke breaking into his car in the middle of the night and broke his jaw and nose in one hit...the intruder sued him....AND WON!

/rage

[sewid]

I was very shocked to hear of this and condolences to friends and family.

[swanny180]

RIP

Condolences to his family and friends...

[Spunky Munky]

This is so sad - R.I.P.

May God bless his soul and that of his loved ones.

Was he a SAU member - if he was, perhaps we can organise something in his memory?

Edited July 3, 2007 by Spunky Munky

[Nismo Racer]

R.I.P.

Condolences to his family and friends.

[Gts-t]

I'm going to try being as civil as I possibly can in response to this, but I seriously cannot believe people outside the US are that stupid.

If you can get guns to keep in the house, you can get guns to carry outside the house. Its not like they're chained to your front verandah. Unless you plan on wearing a holster all the time, an armed assailant breaking in is going to have the advantage, since they'll have the gun with them. And if he knows that there's a good chance you'll pull out a gun on him, he's less likely to go easy on you and more likely to shoot you accidentally because he thought you were going for a gun.

If I was desperate enough to break into someone's house and there was a good probability they were armed, the first thing I'd do is neutralise them before robbing the place (tie them up or knock them out, rather than just skulk around without them noticing, or take family members hostage to ensure their co-operation). I'd have my own firearm as well, and if I saw someone moving around, I'd shoot first.

At least if you don't live in an "armed" culture, the thief knows they have a good probability of outrunning or overwhelming you.

Secondly, the guy was stabbed in his sleep. What good is a gun in a drawer going to do you if you wake up already wounded, with your assailant on top of you? It doesn't sound like a robbery from the description, so if your hitman thinks you may be able to shoot him, he's more likely to shoot you first (or just torch your house and ambush you as you try fleeing out the front door, what's the likelihood that you'll grab your gun if you're trying to exit a burning building?). And it also increases the chance of your loved ones getting injured in the crossfire, either by you or your assailant.

Scathing,

all im saying is i dont think the current situation is ideal. If someone broke into your house what would you do? How do u think the laws should be changed or do u think they are ideal?

I mean look at dnbutts post above, perfect example of how screwed the legal system is.

Having purchased a house recently and living alone i really do think the current laws suck. I know i will be doing my best to ko anyone who breaks into my place...

Edited July 3, 2007 by 2630GTS

[sleepy180]

RIP, thats crap. The way some wanker can end someones life just like that. If he was to fight back and turn the tables and kill the intruder...he would be in prison!!!

A mate of mine caught a bloke breaking into his car in the middle of the night and broke his jaw and nose in one hit...the intruder sued him....AND WON!

/rage

Inregards to home invasions the following law applies :

Self-defence at common law: The Home Invasion (Occupants Protection) Bill 1995 raised

the question of whether the common law provides adequately at present for the defence of

self-defence where the use of deadly force by a home occupant is at issue. Amended

versions of the Bill in 1997 and 1998 have also raised important questions relating to the law

of self-defence. The main findings concerning self-defence at common law can be

summarised as follows:

* self-defence operates to excuse from liability a person who has been proven to have

committed an assault or murder.12 In other words, where the doctrine of self-defence

is found to apply, it results in the acquittal of the defendant;

at present the common law recognises the rights of victims of home invasions (to

take one example) to use ‘reasonable force’ in self-defence where the occupant

believed on reasonable grounds that it was necessary to do what he or she did;

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Basically, if you feel you are in immediate danger then you are able to use reasonable force (this can include lethal force) that is will be classified as self defence and you will be acquitted on the charges. (but lets say they find the person who has broken in is unarmed and you pull out a sword and slice him up then you will probably get in trouble as that is not reasonable force).

*disclaimer : any of the above should not be taken as a legal defence if you decide to put a golf club through a home invaders head (or do anything to anyone)

Edited July 4, 2007 by sleepy180

[Beer Baron]

Scathing,

all im saying is i dont think the current situation is ideal. If someone broke into your house what would you do? How do u think the laws should be changed or do u think they are ideal?

I mean look at dnbutts post above, perfect example of how screwed the legal system is.

Having purchased a house recently and living alone i really do think the current laws suck. I know i will be doing my best to ko anyone who breaks into my place...

i don't agree at all mate. I would say this instance was a murder, not a burglary turned killing. so it's not like someone randomly broke into his house and decided to kill the poor guy. either way owning a gun would not have helped one bit.

most people breaking into houses tend to do it when no-one is home, and if you are home, they are not going to stab you to death while you sleep.

and if someone did break into your house and threaten your safety of course you are entitled to protect yourself.

[Gts-t]

yeah i agree, i dont think it was a break in etc i dont wanna be implying to much about the dead though.

i meant the above just in regard to 99% of burglaries.

I have studied a bit of law and know u can use equal force etc but im only 70kg, 180cms so i would be going for the ko hit with my mag light or something handy . Sometimes all it takes is one hit to kill someone, i would hate to end up in jail as a result of simply doing ur best in a heated momment .

All in all i just think our laws are a bit soft, i mean if people were getting 20 years in jail for child abuse it wouldnt have gotten to the extent is has today. And im not talking about the aboriginals. An even better example would be places like saudi arabi where the islamic law is upheld close to its full extent. That is if u steal something u will lose a hand or ateast a finger.

The end result is their crime rates are much much lower than australia because people especailly those 13-25, know if they steal there are real consequences.

end slight rant

[scathing]

all im saying is i dont think the current situation is ideal. If someone broke into your house what would you do? How do u think the laws should be changed or do u think they are ideal?

It would depend on the reason.

If they came in to rob me and we ran into each other, I'd realise that everything was insured and I'd comply.

If they came in to kill me and I was awake at the time, I'd do whatever I could to stop them from succeeding. Unlike dnbutts' mate's situation, I could more easily plead self defence. The guy's coming after me, not just my property.

If, like in this situation, they came in to kill me and I was asleep I'd probably die.

I mean look at dnbutts post above, perfect example of how screwed the legal system is.

Your original assertion was that we should have guns, so that's what my response was aimed at. I'd agree that the laws in dnbutts' mate's situation is f**ked, but your "guns are the answer" wouldn't have done much good.

If the car thief doesn't have a firearm and kill you, then on top of the assault and bodily harm charges dnbutt's mate was up for, he would also have increased the probability of being up for manslaughter if not murder.

The last time I checked, potentially dying or having more charges against you wasn't an improvement to a situation.

Then again, the whole story isn't provided either. There's a reasonable amount of force you can use. As an extreme example, If I caught you stealing my chips at Maccas no-one would consider it reasonable that I break both your legs. dnbutts' mate broke a guy's face for attempting to steal his car. Was it necessary? For just a potential car theft, non car enthusiasts wouldn't say it was a "reasonable" response. If the thief tried to assault dnbutts' mate when they got caught, or it was a carjacking where the driver was physically threatened, it would be self defence. In my mind, he shouldn't be liable in that situation.

A solution would be a more logical change to the relevant laws, with greater protection towards the victims of crime. I'm referring to how people can break into your house, trip over, and sue you for it. You had nothing to do with their illegal activity that resulted in their injury, yet somehow you're liable.

[scathing]

The end result is their crime rates are much much lower than australia because people especailly those 13-25, know if they steal there are real consequences.

Don't they also get a higher conviction rate? I know that not very many countries have a presumption of innocence. For example in France, there isn't. If the police / prosecutor has enough evidence to actually go to court, they assume you're guilty and you have to prove your innocence. Presumption of innocence is a relatively new development for legal systems.

Islamic law, given the....erm....quaint nature of some of their punishments, don't strike me as being up with those kind of concepts. That and they're more likely to allow a consider that a fictitious deity will spare the innocent, rather than cognitive conclusions based on rules of evidence and due process.

As such, its also a deterrent. If you get caught you're less likely to get off. There's no "innocent until proven guilty" or "beyond reasonable doubt" for the prosecutor. So you get caught under dubious circumstances and, innocent or not, you can't expect the balance of probability to let you off.

However, the whole "I'd rather let a guilty man go free than punish an innocent man" is something I'm OK with. People make mistakes all the time, and sometimes people are law enforcement. If you're going to err on one side, I'd rather be living in a society that errs on the side of freedom.

[kelumzi]

RIP. Richard Carruthers

condolences to the family and wife

very tragic as to how he was murded during the night and for the wife to have witnessed the savage stabbing