Jump to content
SAU Community

Bilsteins On A R34 Gtt With Stock Springs?

nuffsaid
 Share

Recommended Posts

nuffsaid Veteran

nuffsaid

Posted
Posted

Hi dudes

1) Does anyone know whether the SK Bilstein shocks are the same ones that are delivered from Bilstein Germany? I heard from people that they used to get revalved to SK specs when they arrived from Germany a couple of years back, but now Germany just sends all Bilsteins with SK specs by default to all Aussie suppliers?

2) What would be the difference in ride comfort (only concerned with comfort here) between the 2 options below:

- Bilstein shocks with stock springs lowered on the lowest circlip (so I think that makes 24mm lower)

- Bilstein shocks with Whiteline/King springs on the normal circlip

It seems like stock springs on lowest circlips may run out of travel perhaps and bottom out on big hits hence possibly resulting in a harsher bumpier ride especially since the springs and shocks arent matched. Is this true? or will the Bilsteins effectively control the stock springs?

Thanks for your help

Sydneykid Grand Master

Sydneykid

Posted
Posted
Hi dudes

1) Does anyone know whether the SK Bilstein shocks are the same ones that are delivered from Bilstein Germany? I heard from people that they used to get revalved to SK specs when they arrived from Germany a couple of years back, but now Germany just sends all Bilsteins with SK specs by default to all Aussie suppliers?

2) What would be the difference in ride comfort (only concerned with comfort here) between the 2 options below:

- Bilstein shocks with stock springs lowered on the lowest circlip (so I think that makes 24mm lower)

- Bilstein shocks with Whiteline/King springs on the normal circlip

It seems like stock springs on lowest circlips may run out of travel perhaps and bottom out on big hits hence possibly resulting in a harsher bumpier ride especially since the springs and shocks arent matched. Is this true? or will the Bilsteins effectively control the stock springs?

Thanks for your help

I ran the Stagea with the standard springs and the Bilsteins for several months and it was a nice handling/ride comfort balance. I ran it 3 circlip grooves (24 mm) lower than standard and it had no problems with travel after I trimmed the bump stops. That's 15 mm or so higher than with the Whiteline springs and the circlips in their "standard" position. To my feel it was more comfortable than it was with the standard 100,000 ks old shocks. On them it was floaty and bounced a couple of times after hitting a bump, very uncomfortable. Much more controlled and hence comfortable with the Bilsteins.

As I have mentioned previously the problem is not simply one of spring rates, the Whiteline spring rates are only a modest 20% to 25% higher than the standard rates. The issue is the complete suspension system design, R32/33/34 Skylines are designed to be "sporty", not harsh, but not limousine either.

Cheers

Gary

nuffsaid Veteran

nuffsaid

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thanks Gary

Does that mean that the whiteline springs lower the car 24+15mm = 39mm in total? but for a stagea which is different for a GTT? What would be the height difference between 24mm using the lowest circlip, or whiteline on the standard circlip on a R34 GTT?

To me, comfortable is the Toyota Camry type ride haha not necessarily one that bounces a couple of times after hitting a bump. It is more something that absorbs the bumps nicely, instead of hitting a small bump and having the car pushed around.

Unfortuantely comfort has a very personal interpretation and it seems that for you, comfortable = firm and not boaty. So comfortable to you = uncomfortable to others haha and vice versa of course. I think that just because something is floaty, doesnt mean its uncomfortable. It probably better takes the bad roads that a car that is not floaty, ie. has less shaking and rattling

** What I would ideally like to achieve is a lowered setup, with the same level of comfort as say 20,000km old stock shocks on stock springs. I dont mean for it to get any less "sportier" than the stock feel as I understand that the car is still a sports car, I dont intend to change this. However at the same time, do not want to go much "sportier" either.

Just trying to suss out what the options are and

whether the Bilsteins be better matched to the stock feel lowered with stock springs / or Whiteline springs? (both achieve a decent height change, but would of course drive very differently?)

Grunter Community Regular

Grunter

Posted
Posted

I have Bilsteins in my car with the std springs it is both good on the road and on the track

Poeple have driven my car and commented on how good it feels the shocks are alot better

than std nissan stuff but not over the top.Mate you would have no problem at all if you fitted

std springs with bilsteins shocks I think even later if you wanted to upgrade to whiteline

springs you would still have a comfy ride sporty but still smooth ride.I had jap coil overs in

my car and couldn't wait to get them out to hard and the car was dangerous to drive.Since I

fitted the bilsteins shocks I haven' looked back.I haven't lowered my car much from std

height only about 20mm so I can't give you any feed back on lowering any more than that.

Out of every mod I have done to my car, suspension is by far the most important and most

under looked by a lot of people and it doesn't has to be stiff to perform well like a lot of

people may think!

Sydneykid Grand Master

Sydneykid

Posted
Posted
Thanks Gary

Does that mean that the whiteline springs lower the car 24+15mm = 39mm in total? but for a stagea which is different for a GTT? What would be the height difference between 24mm using the lowest circlip, or whiteline on the standard circlip on a R34 GTT?

To me, comfortable is the Toyota Camry type ride haha not necessarily one that bounces a couple of times after hitting a bump. It is more something that absorbs the bumps nicely, instead of hitting a small bump and having the car pushed around.

Unfortuantely comfort has a very personal interpretation and it seems that for you, comfortable = firm and not boaty. So comfortable to you = uncomfortable to others haha and vice versa of course. I think that just because something is floaty, doesnt mean its uncomfortable. It probably better takes the bad roads that a car that is not floaty, ie. has less shaking and rattling

** What I would ideally like to achieve is a lowered setup, with the same level of comfort as say 20,000km old stock shocks on stock springs. I dont mean for it to get any less "sportier" than the stock feel as I understand that the car is still a sports car, I dont intend to change this. However at the same time, do not want to go much "sportier" either.

Just trying to suss out what the options are and

whether the Bilsteins be better matched to the stock feel lowered with stock springs / or Whiteline springs? (both achieve a decent height change, but would of course drive very differently?)

I hate talking about lowering amounts, because lowering from what? Not all R34GTT were the same height when new, not all have settled the same amount, some have even sagged, many are up to 10 mm lower on the RHS than the LHS. So I prefer to talk about absolutes, centre of wheel to guard, which you will find most suspension engineers do also.

Standard (new) height is 380 mm front and 370 mm rear (that's no limited editions, anniversary specials or others that can have different heights up to 10 mm)

Around 50,000 k's they are often at 375 mm front and 365 mm rear, with the RHS rear 360 and the LHS rear 370.

If the shocks haven't been changed and they have done 100,000 ks or so, they are usually 370 mm front and 360 mm rear, with the RHS rear 355 and the LHS rear 360.

The Whiteline springs will result in ~350/340, that's with the spring seats in their standard position. That's 30 mm lower from standard new, but might only be 20 mm lower in a car with stuffed shocks and sagged springs.

The Group Buy Bilsteins for the R34GTT have 7 circlip grooves, all 8 mm appart, 2 standard plus 3 lower + 2 higher.

So with the standard springs you can use the 1st, 2nd or 3rd of the lower grooves to get 8mm, 16mm or 24 mm lower than what the car is with the standard shocks in place.

But there is a problem, with the standard springs you can really only go down to 356 mm (380-24)/346 mm(370 -24) because the standard spring rate isn't able to absorb bumps with any less travel than that height allows.

So if you have a sagged car that is already 370/360 you can only lower it 16 mm (2 grooves) to 354/344.

The Whiteline springs have a slightly higher spring rate, that's why they can handle 350/340 (using the standard height groove).

So you could lower it using the 3 lower grooves available (ie; 326/316), but it is not something I would recommend, ever.

Simple isn't it?

Cheers

Gary

nuffsaid Veteran

nuffsaid

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Yeap that all makes sense.

When lowering the car on stock springs and circlips and possibly achieving a height of 346/336mm (assuming the springs sit at 370/350mm already)...does that mean that the car will be hitting the bump stops very often even if trimmed due to the low spring rates?

And back to the original question...

Are the Bilsteins be better matched to the stock OEM feel lowered with

- stock springs

- or Whiteline springs? (both achieve a decent height change, but would of course drive very differently?)

  • 3 months later...
ANG32 Apprentice

ANG32

Posted
Posted
haha, u and ur quest for a comfortable sporty ride! :blink:

What would you recommend for best suspension settings for R34 GTT?

For fast cornering street drive.

I am thinking Bilstein + Kings/whiteline springs + whitelin sway bars rear.

Is it one model for Bilstein to fit R34 GTT?

Regards,

Alder

Grunter Community Regular

Grunter

Posted
Posted
What would you recommend for best suspension settings for R34 GTT?

For fast cornering street drive.

I am thinking Bilstein + Kings/whiteline springs + whitelin sway bars rear.

Is it one model for Bilstein to fit R34 GTT?

Regards,

Alder

Mate with that set up and add adjustable sway bars you would be very

happy

jeffboyracer Community Regular

jeffboyracer

Posted
Posted
What would you recommend for best suspension settings for R34 GTT?

For fast cornering street drive.

I am thinking Bilstein + Kings/whiteline springs + whitelin sway bars rear.

Is it one model for Bilstein to fit R34 GTT?

Regards,

Alder

hey dude,

yeah, ive got whiteleine springs on bilstein springs as well as whiteline sway bars....

handles real awesome compared to stock set up...sucks up corners and round abouts real easy

yeah i think there is only one model shocks for r34 gtt, have a look on their website...

Wacky Dee Veteran

Wacky Dee

Posted
Posted

I wouldn't order from the Bilstein GB .. people have been waiting for 4-5 months and more. I waited more than 3 months and got lucky by pestering them regularly..

Just goto Heasman's if you want Bilsteins, they're the australian importers anyway.

ANG32 Apprentice

ANG32

Posted
Posted
hey dude,

yeah, ive got whiteleine springs on bilstein springs as well as whiteline sway bars....

handles real awesome compared to stock set up...sucks up corners and round abouts real easy

yeah i think there is only one model shocks for r34 gtt, have a look on their website...

How's Nismo compare with Whileline sway bars? Would Nismo perform a lot better? OR not worth to spend more for little better?

ANG32 Apprentice

ANG32

Posted
Posted
I wouldn't order from the Bilstein GB .. people have been waiting for 4-5 months and more. I waited more than 3 months and got lucky by pestering them regularly..

Just goto Heasman's if you want Bilsteins, they're the australian importers anyway.

Have you got Heasman's contact or web address?

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing


  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • Kapr
      RB20DE NEO smallbox clutch.

      By Kapr · Posted

      For once a good news  It needed to be adjusted by that one nut and it is ok  At least something was easy But thank you very much for help. But a small issue is now(gearbox) that when the car is stationary you can hear "clinking" from gearbox so some of the bearing is 100% not that happy... It goes away once you push clutch so it is 100% gearbox. Just if you know...what that bearing could be? It sounding like "spun bearing" but it is louder.
    • GTSBoy
      Mistakes were made, my R34 Story

      By GTSBoy · Posted

      Yeah, that's fine**. But the numbers you came up with are just wrong. Try it for yourself. Put in any voltage from the possible range and see what result you get. You get nonsense. ** When I say "fine", I mean, it's still shit. The very simple linear formula (slope & intercept) is shit for a sensor with a non-linear response. This is the curve, from your data above. Look at the CURVE! It's only really linear between about 30 and 90 °C. And if you used only that range to define a curve, it would be great. But you would go more and more wrong as you went to higher temps. And that is why the slope & intercept found when you use 50 and 150 as the end points is so bad halfway between those points. The real curve is a long way below the linear curve which just zips straight between the end points, like this one. You could probably use the same slope and a lower intercept, to move that straight line down, and spread the error out. But you would 5-10°C off in a lot of places. You'd need to say what temperature range you really wanted to be most right - say, 100 to 130, and plop the line closest to teh real curve in that region, which would make it quite wrong down at the lower temperatures. Let me just say that HPTuners are not being realistic in only allowing for a simple linear curve. 
    • Kinkstaah
      Mistakes were made, my R34 Story

      By Kinkstaah · Posted

      I feel I should re-iterate. The above picture is the only option available in the software and the blurb from HP Tuners I quoted earlier is the only way to add data to it and that's the description they offer as to how to figure it out. The only fields available is the blank box after (Input/ ) and the box right before = Output. Those are the only numbers that can be entered.
    • GTSBoy
      Mistakes were made, my R34 Story

      By GTSBoy · Posted

      No, your formula is arse backwards. Mine is totally different to yours, and is the one I said was bang on at 50 and 150. I'll put your data into Excel (actually it already is, chart it and fit a linear fit to it, aiming to make it evenly wrong across the whole span. But not now. Other things to do first.
    • Kinkstaah
      Mistakes were made, my R34 Story

      By Kinkstaah · Posted

      God damnit. The only option I actually have in the software is the one that is screenshotted. I am glad that I at least got it right... for those two points. Would it actually change anything if I chose/used 80C and 120C as the two points instead? My brain wants to imagine the formula put into HPtuners would be the same equation, otherwise none of this makes sense to me, unless: 1) The formula you put into VCM Scanner/HPTuners is always linear 2) The two points/input pairs are only arbitrary to choose (as the documentation implies) IF the actual scaling of the sensor is linear. then 3) If the scaling is not linear, the two points you choose matter a great deal, because the formula will draw a line between those two points only.
×
×
  • Create New...