Spark Plug Electrodes Gone Through Engine.. Repairable?

[jarrod83]

The other week when i sent my car to get tuned on the dyno, (when the oil pump died), the tuner didnt agree with the new v notch spark plugs i was trying out that one of my friends that drifts uses (BKR5E11's gapped down to 0.8), since i had my old plugs with me that had done 4000 kms (BCPR7ES) the tuner said he could just give them a quick clean up with a oxy and theyd be good as new.. i had asked if it was safe and he assured me that he had done it many times.. so i pulled out my new BKR5E11's and replaced them with the BCPR7ES at his workshop..

after which the car died on the dyno and the oil pump went.

Im guessing due to the circumstances where i installed the spark plugs at his workshop that albeit bad advice on his behalf.. he is no way liable for the damages to the engine??

I took photos of the worse piston and the head.. is this sort of damage repairable? expensive? or am i pretty much looking at scrapping the engine and starting again?

[The Mafia]

those marks on the bore - is that just oil residue?

The head will need to be surfaced. Requires a full pull down of the head.

The pistons - I wouldn't. If the bores are ok I would get new pistons, hone, and new rings.

Bottom end should be ok.

You installed the plugs... so its a bit blurry whos at fault here.

Also, most NGK plugs have the V notch, and they are fine. If the guy said they are shit, then he obviously is pretty shit himself.

[The Mafia]

also, are you running an RB30?

I can see the block ground down, and non oem head studs. That gives it away

[rob82]

The other week when i sent my car to get tuned on the dyno, (when the oil pump died), the tuner didnt agree with the new v notch spark plugs i was trying out that one of my friends that drifts uses (BKR5E11's gapped down to 0.8), since i had my old plugs with me that had done 4000 kms (BCPR7ES) the tuner said he could just give them a quick clean up with a oxy and theyd be good as new.. i had asked if it was safe and he assured me that he had done it many times.. so i pulled out my new BKR5E11's and replaced them with the BCPR7ES at his workshop..

after which the car died on the dyno and the oil pump went.

Im guessing due to the circumstances where i installed the spark plugs at his workshop that albeit bad advice on his behalf.. he is no way liable for the damages to the engine??

I took photos of the worse piston and the head.. is this sort of damage repairable? expensive? or am i pretty much looking at scrapping the engine and starting again?

He cleaned them with an Oxy?? Thats the most f**ked idea I've heard in a while, talk about thermal shock to the insulator. Oxy acetylene is over 2500deg C, combustion chamber temp only get to around 1000degC. Your lucky you didn't bend a valve.

[James_03]

Over torqued the plugs possibly?

Otherwise you will have to prove that the oxy process damaged them.

Those bores make baby jesus cry.

Edited August 15, 2010 by James_03

[jarrod83]

Rob82:Yeh it wasnt a very bright idea, he still claims it wouldnt of caused the spark plugs to break apart like they have, with the luck im having i wouldnt be surpised if a valve is bent, they dont appear to be so far tho

The Mafia: Unfortunately they are marks on the bore, i was optimistic about the block being salvageable and maybe the pistons as most the scratches you cant even feel, but ive just found one really deep one on one of the bores :S it was more the heat range of the spark plug rather than the v notch design he was disagreeing about, and yeh it was a rb30 , since its unlikely to get much worse i might just slap it back together with a rb30e oil pump and do some burnouts.. its not like much more can break =/

Edited August 15, 2010 by jarrod83

[Adriano]

Why does the cylinder next to it look the same?

[jarrod83]

Because 5 out of 6 spark plugs broke :S see attatched photo

[Adriano]

Well if 5 out of 6 broke, the plugs were overheated, either by the oxy, or the tune, either way its the tuners fault. When he oxy'd them, did he just wave the oxy over them or did he heat them up?

[jarrod83]

he heated them up a fair bit

[3LGODZILA]

ive heard of sand blasting plugs (obviously very fine beads) but not oxying them :S

but spark plugs are cheap as f**k these days, especially coppers...

[tm_r33]

ummm wtf cleaning the plugs with oxyacetaline is bizzar.

Im not surprised that they broke. They would of been extreamly brittle after being punished with an oxy..

I use butane or lpg when needing to heat things and mapp gas if i do need some extra heat. Oxy is far too hot unless u litrally want to weld/melt shit. And just how exactly did he think that blasting something with well over 2000 degrees was the propper way to 'clean' it.

[Duncan]

agreed. 1 is an unfortunate occurrance.

5 is a mistake that needs some responsibility.

re the block...the scoring doesn't look good, but you will need a machine shop to check out whether it just needs a hone or a bore out. either way its not really a problem to reuse up to about 87mm.

[DVS JEZ]

expensive and very unfortunate.

i would be putting the hard word on the tuner.

[jarrod83]

will the pistons probably be reuseable with some light sanding to remove the sharp edges aslong as the bores are recoverable?

[DVS JEZ]

if the damage is only on top then yep they will be fine for burnouts

[tm_r33]

so what is the tuner saying caused the plug failure??? I would be telling him to cough up for a rebuild. Is this guy well established or just a backyard bob? Im assuming if he has a dyno he must have a farely established workshop? Is he a qualified mechanic? I still cant get my head around why anyone would try to clean used plugs with an oxy. Copper plugs are so so cheap. He should be putting new plugs in cars and not attempting to clean used one? To me it sounds about as silly as putting the hose in your throtle body to wash out your engine. Or putting detergent in your radiator to clean up the cooling system.

[tm_r33]

and if i was for some reason trying to clean up old plugs i would probably go for a nice soft copper wire brush or a clean rag even. Perhaps and ever so small amount of spray on degreaser on the rag???

[tm_r33]

and if i was for some reason trying to clean up old plugs i would probably go for a nice soft copper wire brush or a clean rag even. Perhaps and ever so small amount of spray on degreaser on the rag???

[The Mafia]

Now that I think about it, 5 out of 6 plugs is clearly the stupid idea of cleaning then with the oxy.

I'd make the tuner pay for the rebuild, and if he doesn't, then I'd be going to small claims.

$20 in plugs has cost you an entire engine rebuild. Scratched bores, f**ked pistons, f**ked head, possible bent valves, etc.

You're looking at $4k plus.

What a major f**kup, and if the tuner says that you were the one that put the plugs in, come back at saying that you were following his orders.

Edited August 15, 2010 by The Mafia