Jump to content
SAU Community

Recommended Posts

Hey guys,

Need some advice, legal or not, about a fine I received today just near Armidale. I was pulled over by a highway patrol car about 5 minutes east of Armidale (on my way back to Coffs Harbour). After a breath test, the officer informed me that he was not satisfied with the cannon (HKS Super Dragger) which was installed on my car.

I proceded to inform him that I have an engineer's certificate for the exhaust and that it was under the 90db limit. He informed me that he was not interested in the certificate because the law that he was fining me under was an EPA noise regulation. I also offered to show him my last defect for my exhaust which states as a requirement for the defect to be cleared:

"All modifications and components to comply with EPA and RTA regulations"

This was signed by a Sergeant of the local highway patrol here in Coffs, and the defect was cleared.

Basically he informed me that (and he showed me the act that was in question, I wish I had taken note of it), a car must not be fitted with a noise control system that is different to the one that was fitted from the factory. He said that he would not defect me, but if he saw me again with an exhaust that is not factory, he would fine me again, and again, until I revert the exhaust back to standard.

Now I'm seriously thinking about taking this to court as the fine is $200 and I will no doubt lose some valuable points off my license. On top of that I seriously want answers as to why, after spending almost $800 getting my car engineered to ADR standards, I can still get fined!!

Any thoughts or suggestions from people who are in the know or have contested fines before would be greatly appreciated. Please keep replies as helpful as possible.

Thanks in advance. :)

  • Replies 45
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Another power tripping cop. If you have EPA/ADR/RTA reports then tell him to suck it as he stands no chance.

So if I took this to court, I would stand a chance?? I've never needed to do this before, so what happens after I send the appeal away?? Do I need a lawyer, or is that over the top??

:)

Here's the legislation:

Defective mufflers

Vehicle owners and operators should ensure that their vehicles are not fitted with defective mufflers (referred to as 'noise control equipment' in Clause 18 of the Regulation). Defective noise control equipment is defined as:

* equipment that allows the emission of more noise than the original noise control equipment fitted by the vehicle manufacturer, or

* equipment that has been modified in a way that makes it less effective than it would have been without the modification, or

* equipment that allows gas to escape from a place other than the intended exhaust outlet, or

* if the equipment concerned comprises a system of mufflers – the system contains fewer mufflers – than the original system fitted by the manufacturer.

So basically, even though I got an engineer's certificate, I can apparently get fined under the first point as my muffler allows the emission of more noise. What a crock.

I could prove that its not the muffler that allows the extra noise but the pipe size no??

Under that definition defective mufflers are anything non standard.

I'd be stumped if that happened to me, as there's no defect to clear. Can you show us the actual infringement or whatever that was issued? I'd be calling a traffic lawyer, I know that sounds over the top but if he's going to keep doing it and your first one gets cleared, then you'd have cause to complain that you're being harassed.

If you pay this one, and he keeps doing it, it's going to be a very very expensive ownership of your line.

Hmm what a ****wit. Just out of interest what legislation did you paste from? I'd be interested to know how it's defined that a police officer can enforce that one.

By the looks of it though if that's EPA legislation then technically, by the sounds of it any mod is illegal, but how the **** he came up with $200 is beyond me.. lawyer time.

I'd be in touch with the EPA also. If they say for example "our guideline is if it's ok by RTA then we're fine with it we interpret that as 90db or under" then you can get that and take it to court I guess.

Guest Mashrock
So if I took this to court, I would stand a chance?? I've never needed to do this before, so what happens after I send the appeal away?? Do I need a lawyer, or is that over the top??

:)

seriously save some money and don use a lawyer. walk up with all valid the paper work, and give it to the judge

dont say a word.

Well under NSW law it looks like you are screwed..

but under VIC and QLD law, aftermarket exhausts are perfectly legal, provided they comply with the legal noise limits (and emissions I guess too), both for EPA and whatever other stupid thing the cop is worrying about.

I pulled through the full EPA test in melb, with a Super Dragger II system on my old r33 no probs.

morning all,

I have a mate that just got done for the same thing. the cop said that he was gettin fined $200 because the aftermarket exhaust wouldnt work aswell as the stock one (emissions wise)....and that was it. he is also taking it to court and said he shouldnt have too much trouble gettin off it. i'll keep you updated on what happens.

Under that definition defective mufflers are anything non standard.

Yep exactly what the cop told me. But under that definition, how did the cop know the muffler was less effective than the standard one in noise emission without a db meter??

Can you show us the actual infringement or whatever that was issued?

The short title of the offence is (if I've read it right, christ its messy): less effective noise control equipment

That's it. Not much help.

Just out of interest what legislation did you paste from? I'd be interested to know how it's defined that a police officer can enforce that one.

The legislation is the Protection of the Environment Operations (Noise Control) Regulation 2000. Funny thing is, its downloadable as a brochure from the EPA website. The same brochure also states that an exhaust system is not allowed over 90db. Mines not so WTF??

but how the **** he came up with $200 is beyond me..

It sets it out in the EPA brochure.

I'd be in touch with the EPA also.

I've rung my engineer and basically been told not to bother going to the EPA for answers, as its the EPA that have started this bullsh!t.

Funny thing is, its not emission related, its noise related. So even though my exhaust is under the 90db limit (76db @ idle, 86.7 @ 4500 rpm) and has been engineered as suitable for my car etc, I can still get fined. F**k that for a joke. Heads will roll!!!!!!!! :(

Well under NSW law it looks like you are screwed..  

but under VIC and QLD law, aftermarket exhausts are perfectly legal, provided they comply with the legal noise limits (and emissions I guess too), both for EPA and whatever other stupid thing the cop is worrying about.  

I pulled through the full EPA test in melb, with a Super Dragger II system on my old r33 no probs.

Its Federal legislation, not state. No one's safe.

DAMN! what a pr1ck of a cop. I've spoken to a few cops now, 1 owned a modded car. they all said they don't defect unless the person is making an arse of themselves.

I think you've been treated unfairly here mate, Something happened to a friend last year similar. he has a 180sx with huge cannon and really loud exhaust.

We got pulled into an RBT station, We'd both been drinking, did the RBT and got sent on our way after a chat with a young office about the car, he loved it.

200m down the road HWP passed in the opposite direction, ripped a burnout over double whites to stop us. then ripped my mate out of the car and started picking on it. he said qoute" If I ever see you driving this car in ________ again, I'll defect you"

he was old, grumpy and pretty much in a bad mood I'd say. his car maybe a little rough but its not unroadworthy

let us know how you go, I'd be interested in seeing it in court. did you get his details??

mark

Hey guys,

Need some advice, legal or not, about a fine I received today just near Armidale. I was pulled over by a highway patrol car about 5 minutes east of Armidale (on my way back to Coffs Harbour). After a breath test, the officer informed me that he was not satisfied with the cannon (HKS Super Dragger) which was installed on my car.

I proceded to inform him that I have an engineer's certificate for the exhaust and that it was under the 90db limit. He informed me that he was not interested in the certificate because the law that he was fining me under was an EPA noise regulation. I also offered to show him my last defect for my exhaust which states as a requirement for the defect to be cleared:

"All modifications and components to comply with EPA and RTA regulations"

This was signed by a Sergeant of the local highway patrol here in Coffs, and the defect was cleared.

Basically he informed me that (and he showed me the act that was in question, I wish I had taken note of it), a car must not be fitted with a noise control system that is different to the one that was fitted from the factory. He said that he would not defect me, but if he saw me again with an exhaust that is not factory, he would fine me again, and again, until I revert the exhaust back to standard.

Now I'm seriously thinking about taking this to court as the fine is $200 and I will no doubt lose some valuable points off my license. On top of that I seriously want answers as to why, after spending almost $800 getting my car engineered to ADR standards, I can still get fined!!

Any thoughts or suggestions from people who are in the know or have contested fines before would be greatly appreciated. Please keep replies as helpful as possible.

Thanks in advance. :(

i dont think u loose points for a defect do u just a fine.agree with carlo

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • My dream is also to have a proper hoist, but I don't think it will ever happen. My quickjack is probably as close as I'll ever get, it really is very good though. 
    • Yeah we keep on in the dailies, it is pretty poor how many animals get hit and the driver leaves without checking....have saved a couple of little ones over the years. Bit of a gruesome job though, pouches generally need to be cut open because they are so tight and often the joey doesn't realise mum is gone so they are still locked onto the teat. I checked the modules in front of the DS wheel where an oil cooler should go.... There is the radar unit - that can go for race use) One of the 2 HX water pumps, the silver cylinder. That needs to be kept but might be able to be relocated But the bad news, the big computer mounted vertically in front of the wheel (blocking any potential air exit) is the electric steering computer. That is required until/unless i do a hydraulic steering conversion, and in CAD based modern car design it is not like I can just pop a big unit like that somewhere else (plus the loom would be too short anywhere else too). So, the passenger side is OK to clear out (just use a smaller washer reservoir, potentially elsewhere), but the DS no beuno
    • Well, all the best with the new camry It was interesting to hear about the UK process, it is generally a lot more streamlined here with a shipping agent looking after all the import side (noting the exact final price can still be a surprise.....) and I've used a few different brokers on the japan (or US) side, and never had any trouble with any of them....luck of the draw I guess. You mentioned you didn't get the auction sheet (understandable since you bought it from a dealer, not auction), but I always try and get hold of that because they are pretty thorough. I've imported 2x R grade vehicles over the years and both were fine, repairs in Japan are pretty thorough compared to here in Oz.
    • BTW I measured the jack I have, it is 70mm at the saddle but you only have about 700 until it returns to 150mm high at the cylinder so it is good but no magic bullet.
    • My experience with Rising Sun Exports Before agreeing to the sale I tried to do as much research as I could (obviously), his Facebook reviews are 98% and he goes Live at least once or twice a week. I contacted 2 people in the UK who had used him for their imports, both had positive feedback. His explanation and talk through of the import process was thorough, answering any query no matter how stupid it was. It felt as soon as the money was sent, communication dropped off. I asked for shipping updates every 2 weeks or so, not wanting to pester him, he never had any updates. I wasn't informed the car had been dropped off at the port, I only found out by his Facebook story. I asked for the photos taken at the port, knowing he would need some for insurance purposes. I received a few 5 second clips and that's it. When asked again, he said his staff had them. Weeks later I asked again, he tells me he doesn't have any, but does have 50 photos from the original advert. I never received them. I eventually got the documents sent via WhatsApp after I mentioned the port was requesting them. I purchased a CarVX report, to find out the vehicle is a Grade R with recorded accident damage, first recorded in 2017 when it was first auctioned. He never told me the grade, then again I didn't ask. His response was "Grade R means nothing, it wasn't chassis damage". Still, I would have liked to have been informed about it. Jon prides himself on being open and honest when it comes to inspecting cars, it's his main job doing so at the auctions for customers. When the vehicle arrived in the UK I noticed a few little cosmetic issues. It's a 21 year old car so it wasn't going to be mint condition. The side skirts are cracked on each corner and the sealant is failing. The front grill on the bonnet/hood isn't secured very well, mounting studs are missing. Both minor things, but again, it would have been nice to be told. During a Facebook Live walk around video of the vehicle, he mentioned it has a front Whiteline anti roll bar/sway bar. While on the inspection ramp, I noticed the stock item has been installed. When first questioned, his response was "the ARB? Switched? Since when, it never had them". Since sending video and photo evidence I've not received a response. I'm probably being over critical of the overall condition of an old car, but all I wanted was honesty (which he claims to have). I'm aware I wasn't his only customer, he's busy doing XYZ but other reviews praise him for great communication with regular updates and photos, I felt I didn't receive the same treatment. 
×
×
  • Create New...