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Roll Cages - Myths And Fallacies

Roy

By Roy,
in Victoria

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Roy Grand Master

Roy

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hahaha @ the speed stuff you do - how is that more dangerous that coming into a corner with a 170 km/h entry sideways and keeping your foot into it while banging the steering on full lock :cheers:

I have a 4 point rollcage, the top bar is a seperate peice so there is no bends, only two where it bends to the contour of the rear window. It is the approved thickness and has been padded. Made by KSP engineering in Japan.

I said PC licence...not L2S. PC licence is a National Licence which most events dictate you need a CAMS approved cage and log books. To me thats what competition is.

What the rest of us do is club stuff and doesnt require CAMS cages. I would say track guys are more at risk from rolling and side impact. Whilst you drift guys are more worried about side impact Side impact is my main concern.

What diameter is the main roll hoop and weight of the car?

Its good that you have a cage that complies...but many dont. Liek the HKS chrome moly, cusco etc

LOL...again this is all my 2c, Dont listen to me as i could be wrong. Come and get it from the horses mouth. David is on the advisory committee to CAMS and Vic Roads. He knows the facts! :D

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JAGR33 Grand Master

JAGR33

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hahaha @ the speed stuff you do - how is that more dangerous that coming into a corner with a 170 km/h entry sideways and keeping your foot into it while banging the steering on full lock :D

Pfffttt, 170km/h on a race track, sif that's fast??

How about going through a corner at 200km/h and holding on for dear life!!! :)

You might be going into the corner at 170 but what speed are you coming out at?? :)

When it comes to high speed stuff, there's no comparison, drifting is definetly not the quickest way around a track... :)

Roy Grand Master

Roy

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From a safety perspective...Yeh i would rather be doing 200km/h through a corner with the car in control. 170km/h punted sideways and moving all over the shop! I would like a cagethanks:)

Hell your trying to control a car that is out of shape/control. I think you see more drift cars clipping walls/tyres then you do track cars. Its just the nature of the beast.

Starionturbo Mentor

Starionturbo

Posted
Posted
Pfffttt, 170km/h on a race track, sif that's fast??

How about going through a corner at 200km/h and holding on for dear life!!! :D

You might be going into the corner at 170 but what speed are you coming out at?? :closedeyes:

When it comes to high speed stuff, there's no comparison, drifting is definetly not the quickest way around a track... :)

eah

170? And your claiming 30 km/h is sooo much faster - I do that in a near stock SUB 10 grand Car.

Have you ever watched professional drifters drive? There entry speeds are sometimes higher than 210 on certain tracks. Your going into the corner at 200 knowing that your suspension, tyres, 4WD should keep you on track , with drifting, there usually doing it in a snappy RWD vehicle with shit tyres that are already f**ked from previous laps. I know what would keep me on the edge more.....

Al Grand Master

Al

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Kym just thought i'll offer some advise.

Do you have your harness attached to your half cage or is it anchored to the rear of the car?

If it is attached to the cage; i highly stress, for your safety, to change the anchor points. I have seen (while working at Calder) a car hit the wall backwards, this then pushed the half cage forward which loosened the harness , thus un-restraining the driver. After rolling, the car ended on the roof with the driver facing the seat in a very messy way, he had to be air lifted to hospital.

If i was to have a cage in my car, it would definately be a full cage that meets CAMS regs.

ferni Grand Master

ferni

Posted
Posted
eah

170? And your claiming 30 km/h is sooo much faster - I do that in a near stock SUB 10 grand Car.

Have you ever watched professional drifters drive? There entry speeds are sometimes higher than 210 on certain tracks. Your going into the corner at 200 knowing that your suspension, tyres, 4WD should keep you on track , with drifting, there usually doing it in a snappy RWD vehicle with shit tyres that are already f**ked from previous laps. I know what would keep me on the edge more.....

What are we talking about here again? which one is more dangerous? they are both motorsport so both bloody dangerous :thumbsup:

I guess since Circuit is faster, it means when you do hit, its going to be harder, but i guess Drifting is easier to lose control so probably more chance of hitting something, just not as hard as you would if you were doing circuit. So guess it depends how you define dangerous? More chance of hitting or more chance of hitting something hardest?

Roy Grand Master

Roy

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Starion, i love ya...but must everything be an argument? :thumbsup:

Jags point is the corner speeds required to do the lap times some of the clubs cars are doing is scary, like quicker then most race cars running in the State Series. On the same corner a drift car would not be close, but the nutter would be 30deg sideways which introduces its own risks.

Your point, there are drift guys doing crazy corner entry speeds hooked up sideways. granted, They are loons if they are entering corners half way through 5th gear. Though i dont know of a track in Aus that would allow that.

Point is, there are so many different styles of cars doing different things. Some with cages, some that should have cages...and there is lots of misinformation around. So to set the record straight we are going to hear how difficult it is to make a car legal with a cage and what a good cage should offer

Starionturbo Mentor

Starionturbo

Posted
Posted
Kym just thought i'll offer some advise.

Do you have your harness attached to your half cage or is it anchored to the rear of the car?

If it is attached to the cage; i highly stress, for your safety, to change the anchor points. I have seen (while working at Calder) a car hit the wall backwards, this then pushed the half cage forward which loosened the harness , thus un-restraining the driver. After rolling, the car ended on the roof with the driver facing the seat in a very messy way, he had to be air lifted to hospital.

If i was to have a cage in my car, it would definately be a full cage that meets CAMS regs.

Starion, i love ya...but must everything be an argument? :thumbsup:

Jags point is the corner speeds required to do the lap times some of the clubs cars are doing is scary, like quicker then most race cars running in the State Series. On the same corner a drift car would not be close, but the butter would be 30deg sideways which introduces its own risks.

Your point, there are drift guys doing crazy corner entry speeds hooked up sideways. granted, They are loons if they are entering corners half way through 5th gear. Though i dont know of a track in Aus that would allow that.

Point is, there are so many different styles of cars doing different things. Some with cages, some that should have cages...and there is lots of misinformation around. So to set the record straight we are going to hear how difficult it is to make a car legal with a cage and what a good cage should offer

Troy - just keeping it a bit lively, not such an argument, Just rather give my point of view!!!

Al - I dont have Harnesses in my car or even a Race Seat, Im not going to put em in either, its a daily driver car so I dont see the point. As you mentioned, If I got into circuit or Drifting on a competition level, I would definetly get a CAMS approved harness/cage setup.

Ey check out some of the speed the drifters are getting these days - this is From the last DA event - Car is a 300 kw Rb25 R32 and the Driver is Adam Trehwalla (aka Borneo)- Poor quality vid, but after watching quite a few track days and even competing at one at the Barbegallo Circuit in WA - that is Damn Quick!!!

JAGR33 Grand Master

JAGR33

Posted
Posted
eah

170? And your claiming 30 km/h is sooo much faster - I do that in a near stock SUB 10 grand Car.

Have you ever watched professional drifters drive? There entry speeds are sometimes higher than 210 on certain tracks. Your going into the corner at 200 knowing that your suspension, tyres, 4WD should keep you on track , with drifting, there usually doing it in a snappy RWD vehicle with shit tyres that are already f**ked from previous laps. I know what would keep me on the edge more.....

Any more info on this 'sub ten grand car' that does 200km/h through a corner??? I'LL TAKE TWO OF THEM!!!! :bunny:

We're obviously on a different wavelength, we are talking about OUR cars in which WE drive at the track, and you comparing that to professional drifters. How about we compare it to YOUR drifting experience...

And how many people have been seriously injured or killed in circuit racing in the last 5 years compared to drifting???? :P

Let's get back to the original discussion, as this one has has definetly run its course....

Looking forward to what the guest speaker has to say....

Al Grand Master

Al

Posted
Posted
Yes that is my experience.

Yep Its a Nissan Cefiro - Tanabe Sustec Pro suspension, sway bar, Tie rods........ RB20DET turbo manual - Performance and fun for under 10k.

But not entering corners at 200km/h :P

To enter a corner at 200km/h and hold a drift, you need massive torque and power. Not to mention the biggest set of balls and a truck load of money.

I am yet to see a professional drifter enter a corner at 200km/h, let alone yourself.

Nice pic by the way :bunny:

But it really doen't prove that it is capable of what you are claiming.

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