Gym And Supplement Discussion

[jangles]

What's to say they aren't just maintaining general fitness or recovering from an injury and doing physio, let alone doing it purely for enjoyment.

Being in the gym for any reason is better than someone putting strain on the public health care system due to poor health when it can be helped.

Easy for me to say though when these people aren't getting in my way.

I was doing both. Still am doing both.

Correct, being in the gym is better than not. But forever asking questions and never listening isn't.

The gym for most is for a better life, whats the point of bettering life if you're always in the gym and not enjoying it.

Edited April 2, 2013 by jangles

[Birds]

For me, what made me a fan of deads and squats wasn't the potential for size and strength. I had already achieved the size and strength I wanted by doing isolation movements and some compound (bench, lat pulldowns, curls, shoulder press etc). I didn't even think of exercises in terms of isolation and compound; all I thought of was exercises that worked the muscles I wanted to see get bigger. So I did whatever exercises I thought would achieve that, and it worked.

It wasn't until I saw how much weight people were able to lift with deads and squats, that I became a fan of them. I rationalised that, if I'm not doing these exercises and people can lift that much, there must be some serious muscle strength going to waste somewhere in my body and my body isn't as strong as I think it is. The nice surprises were these:

Deads - fixed my back issues and I'm forever grateful for that. Before deads I couldn't pick a 35kg gearbox off the ground without feeling sore for a while afterwards. Couldn't sit on my chair at work without pain during the day. I suspect it was from bad posture at work plus upper body lifting without a strong lower back to support it.

Squats - once I started getting leg muscle, well it's just a whole new area of muscle to look at (for the mirror glancers). Made my body much more proportionate looking and, in a practical strength sense, what good is having muscle up top if you have nothing to support it down low?

I think everybody should do these big strength compound exercises because everybody stands to benefit from them. You don't have to want to compete in powerlifting and push yourself to your limits...as long as you're doing the exercises to get stronger, you have everything to gain and nothing to lose.

You can read all this tl;dr and more in my book - Compounds & Me: Raising The Bar...

[skelton]

Of course, as we really need to work and exercise, which our body is actually able to bear and carry on with ease to get the desired result for our build. Otherwise it would be of no use to over try. And I would never go in favor of supplements, because these would always leave some side effects on our health sooner or later.

[Birds]

Of course, as we really need to work and exercise, which our body is actually able to bear and carry on with ease to get the desired result for our build. Otherwise it would be of no use to over try. And I would never go in favor of supplements, because these would always leave some side effects on our health sooner or later.

Stop posting you f**king idiot

[rev210]

Yeah shoulder and elbows.

My point is, I have/had a weak bench. so I benched more. this hurt my shoulder/scap.. So I started doing more chins and rows and scap stuff to strengthen the opposite side of chest, this gave me elbow issues (tennis and golfers elbow)... so I gave up on it.

Didn't bench, row or chin for 2 months.

Take a 6 month break on the bench stuff and get shoulders and back strong. You will destroy that 110kg within a very short space of time when you go back to it. In the mean time get some PB's on the overhead press.

[No Crust Racing]

Hmm, at what point do you stop gaining and start maintaining though? You cannot gain forever and eventually you will have to accept that you cannot lift what you used to, be that through age, time constraints, injury, etc. That point comes at different times for everyone. An 80yr old guy in the gym doing 5kg dumbell curls is still a champ in my books, better than being in a nursing home even if he is taking up valuable gym space and equipment, his fees are probably the same as yours. With the car analogy used before, A good cut and polish is not a full respray but it still costs time and money to make the car look half decent.

I don't see why lifting to maintain/recover is any less important than lifting to gain personally and I dislike the notion that if you are in the gym and not powerlifting/bodybuilding your effort or desires are less valid than those who are and it's part of the reason I avoid the gym despite being one of the guys who is looking for some gains.

​I think people focus far too much on what others are doing when they should be minding their own business and focusing on achieving whatever it is they came in to achieve. I much prefer exercising by myself in that respect, but I do see the benefit of exercising with experienced lifters and have needed to come on here/the net for advice/tips etc.

I do have sympathy for those who cannot get in a proper workout because there are guys curling in the squat rack or fielding questions from people who then ignore the advise and do it wrong anyway or complain about no results but keep asking questions etc. I think it's fair to be annoyed by that, I don't think it's fair to judge someone else's goals though.

Edit: Who or wtf is Skeleton? Bot?

Edited April 2, 2013 by ActionDan

[eightsixboy]

Of course, as we really need to work and exercise, which our body is actually able to bear and carry on with ease to get the desired result for our build. Otherwise it would be of no use to over try. And I would never go in favor of supplements, because these would always leave some side effects on our health sooner or later.

Lol.

Its an interesting board for a school kid to troll.

[eightsixboy]

Hmm, at what point do you stop gaining and start maintaining though? You cannot gain forever and eventually you will have to accept that you cannot lift what you used to, be that through age, time constraints, injury, etc. That point comes at different times for everyone. An 80yr old guy in the gym doing 5kg dumbell curls is still a champ in my books, better than being in a nursing home even if he is taking up valuable gym space and equipment, his fees are probably the same as yours. With the car analogy used before, A good cut and polish is not a full respray but it still costs time and money to make the car look half decent.

I don't see why lifting to maintain/recover is any less important than lifting to gain personally and I dislike the notion that if you are in the gym and not powerlifting/bodybuilding your effort or desires are less valid than those who are and it's part of the reason I avoid the gym despite being one of the guys who is looking for some gains.

​I think people focus far too much on what others are doing when they should be minding their own business and focusing on achieving whatever it is they came in to achieve. I much prefer exercising by myself in that respect, but I do see the benefit of exercising with experienced lifters and have needed to come on here/the net for advice/tips etc.

I do have sympathy for those who cannot get in a proper workout because there are guys curling in the squat rack or fielding questions from people who then ignore the advise and do it wrong anyway or complain about no results but keep asking questions etc. I think it's fair to be annoyed by that, I don't think it's fair to judge someone else's goals though.

Edit: Who or wtf is Skeleton? Bot?

I think if you reach your natural potential and gains start coming harder to get then really all you can do is maintain. Im only doing maintance workouts at the moment and I definently think its just as important to do those as it is doing heavier workouts.

I know the type your talking about, I was one of them lol. I used to wonder why I wasn't gaining alot but then decided to listen to other and started eating alot more food. They will learn sooner or later, especially if there lifting wrong and they pull something.

[NickR33]

Hmm, at what point do you stop gaining and start maintaining though? You cannot gain forever and eventually you will have to accept that you cannot lift what you used to, be that through age, time constraints, injury, etc. That point comes at different times for everyone. An 80yr old guy in the gym doing 5kg dumbell curls is still a champ in my books, better than being in a nursing home even if he is taking up valuable gym space and equipment, his fees are probably the same as yours. With the car analogy used before, A good cut and polish is not a full respray but it still costs time and money to make the car look half decent.

I don't see why lifting to maintain/recover is any less important than lifting to gain personally and I dislike the notion that if you are in the gym and not powerlifting/bodybuilding your effort or desires are less valid than those who are and it's part of the reason I avoid the gym despite being one of the guys who is looking for some gains.

​I think people focus far too much on what others are doing when they should be minding their own business and focusing on achieving whatever it is they came in to achieve. I much prefer exercising by myself in that respect, but I do see the benefit of exercising with experienced lifters and have needed to come on here/the net for advice/tips etc.

I do have sympathy for those who cannot get in a proper workout because there are guys curling in the squat rack or fielding questions from people who then ignore the advise and do it wrong anyway or complain about no results but keep asking questions etc. I think it's fair to be annoyed by that, I don't think it's fair to judge someone else's goals though.

when I say making progress, it's not just in the narrow sense of 'making gainz bro'

I just want to see some progression... whether it's stronger (more weight, more reps, or more sets)... faster... bigger... better endurance... lose fat... or just to move better

people I used to see a lot where the guys in there doing bodybuilding routines who never got any bigger or stronger... you don't do 12 different arm exercises to 'maintain and recover, or rehab etc'

we have such a narrow view of resistance training in Australia... to lift weights you must be a bodybuilder or weightlifter... it's garbage... in the US they start weight training at school for a variety of different sports but they approach it from a performance aspect... forget the mirrors, fake tan and abs, lifting is MUCH more useful than simple vanity... provided you do the right movements and follow the rule of linear progression

[NickR33]

my Nan just turned 97... she weight trains once a week with a bunch of other oldies... it's brilliant to watch... they are just training to maintain as much mobility as possible

but if you aren't a pensioner and think you can't make any more progress... that's pretty sad

[No Crust Racing]

I'm coming around to that way of thinking myself Nick.

I see myself, down the track probably being leaner, maybe stronger maybe weaker, but most likely all round fitter and in better general condition.

That's prob just the squat dodger talking though...

[TTT]

Rev - June 15 is the last comp for the year.

then it's 6 months of shoulder work.

Between now and then I don't plan on benching more than twice really. don't expect to get stronger. just need to bench to get a bench number for the last comp.

Dan and others.

Your main focus should ALWAYS to be stronger.

Doesn't have to be "I'm a power lifter and need to compete" Stronger.

But since you are going on about long term goals to look good etc, Strength, especially in the back is what you should be focusing on.

As you get older, you will get saggy, ugly, grey, bald, weak, brittle.

no other way around it.

it WILL happen.

but if you want to be in your 60s and 70s and still able to move around, you need a strong back.

Markos doesn't wander in to this thread much so he won't post this so I will..

here is James Thompson.

61 years old.

he also squats 150kg

Sure he doesn't have 6 pack abs, or guns with good peak and ripped chest, but he is over 60 years old and is strong as an ox and will no doubt have many MANY more pains and aches then all of this forum combined.

Focus on getting strong.

Nothing else really matters.

Edited April 2, 2013 by TTT

[jangles]

Hmm, at what point do you stop gaining and start maintaining though? You cannot gain forever and eventually you will have to accept that you cannot lift what you used to, be that through age, time constraints, injury, etc. That point comes at different times for everyone. An 80yr old guy in the gym doing 5kg dumbell curls is still a champ in my books, better than being in a nursing home even if he is taking up valuable gym space and equipment, his fees are probably the same as yours. With the car analogy used before, A good cut and polish is not a full respray but it still costs time and money to make the car look half decent.

I don't see why lifting to maintain/recover is any less important than lifting to gain personally and I dislike the notion that if you are in the gym and not powerlifting/bodybuilding your effort or desires are less valid than those who are and it's part of the reason I avoid the gym despite being one of the guys who is looking for some gains.

​I think people focus far too much on what others are doing when they should be minding their own business and focusing on achieving whatever it is they came in to achieve. I much prefer exercising by myself in that respect, but I do see the benefit of exercising with experienced lifters and have needed to come on here/the net for advice/tips etc.

I do have sympathy for those who cannot get in a proper workout because there are guys curling in the squat rack or fielding questions from people who then ignore the advise and do it wrong anyway or complain about no results but keep asking questions etc. I think it's fair to be annoyed by that, I don't think it's fair to judge someone else's goals though.

Edit: Who or wtf is Skeleton? Bot?

We are not disagreeing with older people lifting 5kg....

I sometimes train with a 78yr old that can out lift most people my age. Which gets me thinking again, why is he so strong? Because he was strong when he was younger, now he is strong still.

Reps of 80kg bench is no issue for him. Plug that into the gloss calculator. < oh damn, referenced to powerlifting.

Edited April 3, 2013 by jangles

[No Crust Racing]

He's probably a prime example, I doubt he's looking to gain much or get bigger stronger, just looking to maintain, but his work in the gym is just as valid as anyone else looking to get bigger or stronger, thats all my point was really.

I take beef with people who look down on other peoples goals because they want different things.

I do not take beef with others who get pissed when guys pester them in the gym for advice and ignore it or take up equipment then use it incorrectly when others may have a more "legitimate" claim to it.

Just my random thougths

[jangles]

I'm not even sure what is being talked about anymore. Wasn't this about you not wanting to get stronger yet wanting to get stronger?

[TTT]

Exactly

[No Crust Racing]

Umm, shit, how did we get onto this? I think it was Nick talking about annoying people in the gym and went from there.

Not sure where you got stronger but not stronger?

As Captain Brannigan said, you're obviously confused and aroused...

TTT, took your advice about setup/muscle tightness tonight, short version is I liked it, longer version in build thread.

[TM7GTR]

Of course, as we really need to work and exercise, which our body is actually able to bear and carry on with ease to get the desired result for our build. Otherwise it would be of no use to over try. And I would never go in favor of supplements, because these would always leave some side effects on our health sooner or later.

Thank you brother fox. Your kind and humbling words shower me with knowledge and wisdom. I promise you, from here on I shall push.. NAY, STRIVE to uphold your blessed oath of life's natural nectar!!

[UNR33L]

Hodge twins take on mixing strength and hypertrophy training, guess they're talking about similar stuff to what we do Birds

[TM7GTR]

Please tell me you take what they say with a grain of salt