Turbo(s) Upgrade

[Rodent GTR]

A Question much asked i guess.

Would like some feedback on which way to go when upgrading my turbo's

Car is 1995 GTR V-spec with 80k in good mech order,

I am looking at replacing turbo's very soon (nothing wrong with old ones just need more hp)

thinking that 500hp should be a reasonable figure to aim for,

The problem is i don't want to have change (buy) new ones again a year later on my quest for more power, so is it possible to get the correct maybe larger turbo(s) from the start??

something that would be good for around 800-850hp? eventualy of course, i am well aware it's not just a case of bolting a new one on and away you go, thoughts on injectors etc and other neccessay mods, pro's and cons of having too big a turbo without using its full capacity untill other parts in place,

I Have read many threads with interest but looking for some personal feedback,

I am not even sure whether to stick with twins or go large single, always thought twins would be more driveable with big hp, but have been advised to go single for better driveability.

Thanks in advance.

[R33GOD]

just looked at the dyno thread in FI section mate

[Rodent GTR]

[Thanks for the point in right direction.

[R31Nismoid]

The con of having a big turbo and not using its full power is simple... a shit car to drive

It'll be laggy, unresponsive and lazy. A car with correct sized turbos for the power aim will be fun and no doubt much faster as a result...

You can't bolt on a turbo capable of 500rwkw+ and expect to be happy with it only making ~370rwkw.

I honestly dont see your point/logic at all. The lowmounts are are $1300ea for the -5's ...

Considering that fact your building a 500rwkw+ setup at a cost in excess of 30k...

Why are you worried about blowing 2.6k on turbos? You could sell off and total out of pocket for interim upgrade is 1.5k... 1.5k in a build that will cost you 30k is nothing.

You'll blow more than 1.5k on things you didnt expect to spend money on when you chase 500rwkw+, so i wouldnt be too worried about that.

[The Dan]

Single is definitely the way to go. Twins will be way too laggy at those power levels.

You will need at least a GT51R to make the 800hp. It's not just a simple task where you can bolt it on and it will just work.

It will be quite expensive to just do the single conversion to start with, then you have the risk of breaking your engine if it has not been built accordingly. The turbo will still be lots of fun but unusable power under 4500rpm. You will also need injectors, aftermarket ECU, Fuel system etc etc. This brings you to a whole other level. Where do you stop? If you are going to go that far with it, you might as well just do the whole lot and be done with it. It's only going to cost you around $30k for a ground up build like that.

[JAGR33]

One important question, what do you want to use the car for??

Dyno queen? Drag?

800HP will be useless on the street..

If you want to use it on the street then stick to the original plan of 500hp.

Ugrade to larger twins (-7's or -5's) and keep it simple...

My 2c...

[Rodent GTR]

I honestly dont see your point/logic at all.

Thanks for your reply,

I understand you don't see my point/logic, this is probably because you have a far better understanding of engine modifications than me, I have a good knowledge of cars but suffer badly in technical /correct mechanics, however still get the point you are making about the spend,

I Hope to learn much more here reading and occasionally asking questions,

think it would be to long winded to list what i don't know, but if you don't ask you don't get a response..

[Mr. Keets]

Go the 2860R-5 and get 430-450 RWHP on a stockish 2.6. Keep them and go a 2.8 kit later and get 520RWHP. Matthew, as others have said you need to realistic about your goals...drags, dyno comp, circuit, carpark rallies. I've been getting my 32R ready for the next step (2.8) this year and its quite a commitment plus 800hp on the street will be a pain in the arse. See if you can get a ride in a 2.8 low mount combo. They are pretty quick.

[im late]

Hi Matthew,

Basically if you intend to use your car for everyday/street duties then go the twin low mounts. It would be undetectable to the boys in blue. You want to keep your engine bay "stock" looking to avoid getting picked on by them!!

I suggest the following for an excellent street application:

Below are the IMPORTANT upgrades to ensure reliability at increased power levels:

- Upgraded ECU (i.e. Apexi Power FC, Haltech e11v2 :- this allows proper air/fuel ratios to support the extra power you will be making )

- Bosch 044 Fuel pump mounted in the tank (or a nismo, tomei drop in option)

- 750 or 800cc Injectors (Brands - Nismo, HKS, Sard come to mind)

- Full 3" exhaust upgrade from the turbos to the back of the car + hi flow 3" ADR compliant metal CAT (must be all mandrel bent, stainless grade 304 is not necessary)

- Pair of Garrett 2860R-7 Turbos (These turbos will give you boost response VERY similar to your factory turbos with ALOT more power).

- Panel filter upgrade for your standard airbox (i.e. K&N. etc...)

The following factory standard parts DO NOT need to be upgraded (the cost versus the power gain is not worth it):

- Manifolds

- Cam gears

- Camshafts

- Intercooler

- Oil pump

- Water pump

- Fuel pressure regulator

- Blow off valves

- Plenum (i.e. GReddy, etc..)

What power will all these mods give you at the wheels???

Well if installed and tuned properly (i.e. buy a workshop that has a good rep for building GTRS :- search the forum for more info on workshops) you can expect around the 300 - 340 AWKW mark.

That would make your car a SERIOUS weapon on the street and it will have the reliability and power you could ever want for the roads!

Keep in mind that if you are making your motor produce almost twice of what it was intended to do so then you can expect a shorter life span of the motor than if it was on stock power levels. Not to mention that if your motor is the original one that came with the car then it is quite old now (15 years +) which means it has had a hard long life producing turbo power............

Now...............

If you want 500HP ATW and above then you will need an engine rebuild (i.e. forged pistons, conrods, upgraded oil and water pumps, sump extention, etc...) otherwise your stock motor won't last too long with those power levels!!!

That’s when you are talking serious dollars. With the Jap Yen the way it is expect to spend at least $20 - $30k (and above!!!) on your rebuild!!!!

Garrett GT2860R-7's will get you that sort of power figure with only marginal increased lag over standard.

If there is anything you can take away from reading this, ALWAYS DO IT PROPERLY THE FIRST TIME!!!!

Take the advice of people on SAU who have been through the trials and tribulations of GTR enhancements!!!

I hope I have enlightened you a bit......

All the best and Good luck..

[Rodent GTR]

All the best and Good luck..

Thanks Adam,

Thanks for keeping it simple for me,

The car is and will be used mainly on the street, however once bigger hp is achieved and as i have more time i aim to get some time on the track,

This is my 2nd R33 GTR, and have spent the last 2 years or so making sure everything is in good running order, have added full cat back exhaust, k+n's, bov's and haltech e11 v2, car is looked after regular by a company called APC in Brisbane, last dyno made 250kw on safe 1bar.

So i am going to need, fuel pump, injectors and the turbo's (to start)

Garrett 2860R-7's would be the choice then?

Fmic + cams to follow i guess,

The second list of mods was this to get towards 500kw not 500hp?

only ask because list 1 takes up to estimated of course 340kw which is getting close to 460hp

I am now aiming towards the 500 mark, and will study brake and clutch upgrades, i guess the gearbox changes when i break the old one?

-7 and -5 is it just a size difference? obviously 1 produces more hp

Best place to source them, or should i get the garage to?

I Live on Sunshine coast and always have to travel to get car done, is there any trusted GTR mechanics closer to home you know of??

Thanks for your help

[Rodent GTR]

Go the 2860R-5 and get 430-450 RWHP on a stockish 2.6. Keep them and go a 2.8 kit later and get 520RWHP. Matthew, as others have said you need to realistic about your goals...drags, dyno comp, circuit, carpark rallies. I've been getting my 32R ready for the next step (2.8) this year and its quite a commitment plus 800hp on the street will be a pain in the arse. See if you can get a ride in a 2.8 low mount combo. They are pretty quick.

Point taken,

Obviously no point putting huge hp turbo's on stockish motor and tunning gradualy

Just needed to be told..

May i ask what you feel the main drawbacks of having 800hp in street form, is it power range, low rev driveability, clutch / drive,

torque lack from 2.6ltr.

[Rodent GTR]

One important question, what do you want to use the car for??

Dyno queen? Drag?

800HP will be useless on the street..

If you want to use it on the street then stick to the original plan of 500hp.

Ugrade to larger twins (-7's or -5's) and keep it simple...

My 2c...

Thank you,

-7 or -5's whats 7 & 5 stand for size of some sort, any disadvantage going for which ever one is largest, lol!

And yes mainly street, untill i get regular time to visit a track, looking forward to going not just for me but to see some great cars! untill then its work work work....

Thanks for the 2c i am now concentrating on my quest to get to 500.. not 800

[R31Nismoid]

If 500hp is your choice, -9 is the way.

-5's (larger) are more for around, 650hp. So if you stick to the 500hp, you should get the turbos best suited too it.

There is a massive thread on the whole -7/-9/-5 (just ignore the part about not being able to make 330rwkw, you can )

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/7-...ts-t254450.html

[R.3.2.G.T.R]

get the -5 since you may be looking at getting more power than -7 can support down the line.. buy it off one the forum business traders

[donkey]

what about an RB30?, check out the 'RIPS' website in NZ

robbie

[R31Nismoid]

get the -5 since you may be looking at getting more power than -7 can support down the line.. buy it off one the forum business traders

The -5's wont support what he wants either.

So in the interim he is better off taking the choice that is best responsive for his initial aim which is 500hp.

And -5's are not a 500hp turbo choice. They are aimed at 650hp not 500hp like the -9's

[NickR33]

Hey Ash how do the -5's compare to the Trust T517Z 8cms? I know ball bearing is the way to go but wondering if the difference is worth the cash outlay? The -5's would probably come on earlier and make more power hey?

[R31Nismoid]

Jack had the 517's ages ago, he said the difference was noticeable

Tad less power with the -5s, but more response and so on... maybe have a chat to him next time ya see him?

Or he might come back and post again

[Swiper the Fox]

cannot believe this thread has lasted this long...this has all been heard before.

[NickR33]

Jack had the 517's ages ago, he said the difference was noticeable

Tad less power with the -5s, but more response and so on... maybe have a chat to him next time ya see him?

Or he might come back and post again

cheers will speak to Jack... I could just ask Ben as well but you seem to know your stuff and I was bored lol

very true Dirt, but still better than sitting here doing work... surely