Replace Current Car With...

[badhairdave]

How much do you want to spend?

how fast do you want to go?

From a cost/speed point of view including purchase, maintenance, consumables and mods an S1 S14 is probably the way to go over even an s13 these days if you want to stay in the sub 20k bracket and be reasonably quick. Reason being that it's cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain, cheaper to mod and uses less brake and tyre than a heavier car. It also has better suspension geometry than the s13/r32 so is a better base to start with too. The s15 is really just a facelift that you can't get as much tyre under.

Dig out info on Jacky Yicks S15 and see how basic it is as a package, still full interior to run in club sprint at superlap, 1:05's at wakefield on RSR's. Take the professional driver out of the equation and chuck another couple of seconds onto the times, it's still blisteringly quick for what is essentially a stock s15 engine running e85 and some suspension and aero mods.

[evil_weevil]

S13deviat and myself have similar driving experince out on the track, his S13 with 200rwkw managed a 1.20 at OP GP

my 250rwkw R33 could only manage a 1.28

(my 75rwkw mazda managed 1.27.2)

My r33 must have been a pig.

[No Crust Racing]

How much do you want to spend?

how fast do you want to go?

From a cost/speed point of view including purchase, maintenance, consumables and mods an S1 S14 is probably the way to go over even an s13 these days if you want to stay in the sub 20k bracket and be reasonably quick. Reason being that it's cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain, cheaper to mod and uses less brake and tyre than a heavier car. It also has better suspension geometry than the s13/r32 so is a better base to start with too. The s15 is really just a facelift that you can't get as much tyre under.

Dig out info on Jacky Yicks S15 and see how basic it is as a package, still full interior to run in club sprint at superlap, 1:05's at wakefield on RSR's. Take the professional driver out of the equation and chuck another couple of seconds onto the times, it's still blisteringly quick for what is essentially a stock s15 engine running e85 and some suspension and aero mods.

Yeah I heard about his S15.

Well as with most of us I don't want to spend a fortune and I'd like to go as quick as possible, stupid I know. It's not just about cost as I realise a GT-R is a more expsnive paltform, but is it a BETTER and FASTER platform, if it is then of course it's worth more and that makes sense but if it's more expensive for the SAME performance as a S14/15 then it's not quite ok.

I'm more concerned with whether the GT-R's extra cost translates in extra performance or not.

S13deviat and myself have similar driving experince out on the track, his S13 with 200rwkw managed a 1.20 at OP GP

my 250rwkw R33 could only manage a 1.28

(my 75rwkw mazda managed 1.27.2)

My r33 must have been a pig.

I'd be thinking there were some critical differences in the cars then? alignment, tyres, etc?

For the record, my time at winton is set on VERY second hand bridgestone semi's they cost me like $260 for the set just to learn on. I imagine the car would be a touch quicker again with new rubber.

[phunky_monkey]

How much do you want to spend?

how fast do you want to go?

From a cost/speed point of view including purchase, maintenance, consumables and mods an S1 S14 is probably the way to go over even an s13 these days if you want to stay in the sub 20k bracket and be reasonably quick. Reason being that it's cheaper to buy, cheaper to maintain, cheaper to mod and uses less brake and tyre than a heavier car. It also has better suspension geometry than the s13/r32 so is a better base to start with too. The s15 is really just a facelift that you can't get as much tyre under.

Dig out info on Jacky Yicks S15 and see how basic it is as a package, still full interior to run in club sprint at superlap, 1:05's at wakefield on RSR's. Take the professional driver out of the equation and chuck another couple of seconds onto the times, it's still blisteringly quick for what is essentially a stock s15 engine running e85 and some suspension and aero mods.

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

S14 is the pick of the bunch for a cost vs performance equation. Cheap, reliable, 5 speed instead of the S15 6, good engine setups stock, plenty of room for rubber and not too old. You'll be able to happily punch out 200rwkw's all day at the track and the thing will be basically stock. Add some suspension, good pads, rotors, oil cooler, tyres and you'll be laughing. No reason as to why you wouldn't be punching well under 1:40 at Winton.

They also look good, have a heap of aftermarket support and are common enough to be easy to find.

[No Crust Racing]

I'll be honest... I didn't expect there to be so much support for S chassis on SAU

Well maybe from you Dane

[evil_weevil]

LOL I was thinking the same Dan!

However after driving S13deviats s13 around the track - I can see why they are good things when set up nicely!

[No Crust Racing]

OK it's time someone besides Sav waved the GT-R flag.

Why is the GT-R a better platform, if it's going to cost much more for the same performance why would anyone build a GT-R, or are you all saying that the S chassis is a lot of the performance for far less of the price?

[phunky_monkey]

Well we know they can be comptetive with the GT-R's, though I think the GT-R ultimately has the more potential but at a higher cost and at an end of the scale which we're not discussing here.

Not saying a relatively reasonably priced GT-R isn't bloody quick. Chris Thomson was doing 21's or 22's at Sandown with his stock turbo 33 GT-R, though he's a great driver, with stock Brembo's and the usual mods. Nothing special so excellent bang for buck there. If you really prefer a GT-R then go for it, but I would think it would be more costly to maintain in the long term.

And I shouldn't be supporting the S chassis... it's not supporting me!

[No Crust Racing]

Yeah I thought of Chris when thinking about this question, and Ryan also havign seen impressive performance from both and witnessing CT's GT-R first hand at DECA.

In terms of which car is a better multi purpose vehicle, that is, swap off the track rims/tyres for some street friendly ones and go for a cruise the Silvia doesn't seem that appealing in that way.

The cost differential appears to be quite large though =\

"And I shouldn't be supporting the S chassis... it's not supporting me!" <--- gold

Edited July 27, 2010 by ActionDan

[FineLine]

Yes a gtr will have more street creds than a silvia. And, as phunk said. ultimately will have more potential around a track. It depends on how deep your pockets are. Bang for buck lies with the silvia but if you have the coin to throw at it the gtr will own it.

[No Crust Racing]

Sorry that sounded wanky, I mean comfort and space etc for cruising and weekend trips not street cred, I'm too old to care about cred plus that mentality almost cost me license a few times... lol

[juggernaut1]

+ 1 for s14.

This is Ashley Barnetts IPRA s14 and wins its fair share of races even against the IPRA V8 and 4wd mob at Barbagello....here's a link to an example of its most recent performance.

I posted the link because all turbo cars in IPRA run restrictors and the drivers are experienced....so this provides some sort of parity engine mod wise and driver wise. It runs on E85, wears 255 semi's all round. Engine hp isn't huge obviously because of the restrictor.

Average speed was 134klm/h in that above race and top speed is around 225 klms for the car.

Edited July 27, 2010 by juggernaut1

[No Crust Racing]

While the clip is great, there aren't any GT-R's in it and the S14 driver is either way better or has more grip, he's getting out of the corners so much quicker that he looks to have a straight line speed advantage but if the cars are supposed to eb equal performance wise I'm not sure what's going on there.

That's also a pure track only car, noweekend cruises in that baby lol

[juggernaut1]

I don't think there are any GTR's in our local IPRA comp....so can't show you comparo's sorry.....but scanning natsoft might reveal GTR's lap times in other classes.

Possibly more straight line speed due to 1. faster corner exit speed, 2. less mechanical losses as not 4wd.....also 3. maybe more aerodynamic/slip streaming?

Much time has been invested in the suspension setup. I think Ashley once said 3 hrs spent on the rear wheel alignment alone by the wheel aligner.

He's previously mentioned to me that he doesn't run a rear sway bar either.

Sure its a pure track car but there's a fine line between track cars and "street" cars these days.

I guess the point I'm making is that its nothing over the top but is a great overall package.

Edited July 27, 2010 by juggernaut1

[No Crust Racing]

It would be interesting to get full specs on that car and known build costs etc.

With the restrictors, what psi does that limit cars too and are they free to choose what turbo?

[juggernaut1]

This is what I can find on the car....(taken from below link)

Engine has forged Pistons, Eagle Rods, ARP stuff, Cams, 6 boost, Garret Turbo, Ext Gate, straight through exhaust, Haltech ECU, OS Clutch and so on. The only thing we have to slow us down is the 36mm restrictor on the intake of the turbo. limits HP to 300rwhp and 6000rpm

I believe the turbo is a modified 2871R highmounted on a 6boost with external gate. Running an Arizon Z (Wilwood) brake package.

Not sure on the boost...I guess the restriction on the intake would render boost past a certain level useless.....I mean it probably doesn't develop boost past a certain level because of the restrictor.

I guess you could PM him via this link:

http://www.silviawa.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=57105

and website:

http://www.barnettmotorsport.com.au/

Edited July 27, 2010 by juggernaut1

[No Crust Racing]

Those are the critical details, That's a reasonable mods list then and would add up to a few bucks on either car. As to whether a GT-R with the same mods and suspension/brakes would be any quicker for the extra it would cost well that's another story..

Edited July 27, 2010 by ActionDan

[R32gts-t]

my 2 cents...

i think the beauty of an s13-s14 is the cost of replacement parts (entire body included), along with ongoing consumables.

when you put those facts up against the fact they can be bloody quick in fairly basic trim (200-250rwkw), aswell as being challenging and rewarding and FUN to drive it's a great combination.

i'm not saying gtr's aren't great track cars, i'm just not sure i could justify the extra expense, especially if your main reason/purpose for a track car is to have fun in it, if it's for competition then it's a different story, but if it's simply for having fun, i'm not sure the guy who is running around a few seconds quicker in his gtr is having any more "fun" than the guy running around a few seconds slower in his s chassis...

not saying that gtr's win everything either, i've watched plenty of gtr's get overtaken by less powerful rwd cars at track days in vic.

this car with some aero, a decent cage, a set of wider wheels and a different turbo setup would be incredible!

http://www.my105.com.au/classified.asp?id=16244&latest=1

[evil_weevil]

http://www.my105.com.au/classified.asp?id=15666

is this too cheap to be real?

[No Crust Racing]

I don't think so, it's on car sales for the same sort of money. A thorough inspection would be in order...