Calling On All Garrett Turbo Experts

[QRI05E]

Hey Guys,

Pretty soon ill be purchasing a GT series Garrett turbo for a conversion im doing. However when speaking to people in regards to turbo choice, some have referred to the GT28R as either a GT2860R or GT2560R. Now on the Garrett site, it shows them as different turbos

Which is the GT28R?

Also, what do the end numbers refer to in the part number?

GT2560R - 466541-1 <----

GT2560R - 466541-4 <----

GT2560R - 707160-9 <----

GT2860R - 707160-5 <----

GT2860R - 707160-7 <----

Regards,

Sarkis

[SLIPPERY]

those numbers are for the different versions of the same turbos meaning different A/R and trim sizes

For example the the -7 can be used as a direct replacement for GTR and each turbo supports around 300hp, whereas the -5 is slightly bigger and will support something like 350hp

does that make sense?

[QRI05E]

Yep cheers....

So is the GT28R a GT2860R or GT2560R?

[SLIPPERY]

are the 2560's sold each and the 2860's meant to be sold as a pair or am i making stuff up? haha

Or are the 2560s the old 2860s

not much help i know

[discopotato03]

The terminology stems from the pre ball bearing turbos like T2's and T25's and T28's .

It was sort of hard in the BB era because early on they were mostly called GT25XXR turbos ie GT2530R or GT2540R etc .

The small BB centre section is also commonly known as the GT25 BB centre section .

Most of Garretts turbo families are based on their turbine series (by name) , from what I've seen Garrett developed the T2 series which later grew slightly larger diametre turbines and compressors (T25) and larger pairs again for the T28's .

They went this way to make more compact/lighter turbos than the T3 series .

You could look at a T28 as a turbo with larger diameter wheels than a T25 and a good example of this is the GTiR's turbo .

When Garrett started making the BB version of the basic T2 centre section they used what looks like a BB shaft version of the basic 11 bladed T25 turbine and either 54 or 60mm diametre compressors on the other end .

They also developed the high performance 54mm NS111 turbine and used these with 60mm compressors in turbos like the GT2530 . As time went by Garrett decided to call this turbine and 60mm compressor combination "GT2860R" or "GT2860RS" in one case because the RS ment BB modified or altered spec in that case .

Really the names or descriptions are all over the place , you really need to know which turbine and compressor spec combinations you want to use and then hunt up the part number . This is not as hard as it may sound , aside from a TT engine like an RB26 that may need super responsive turbos I think the high performance NS111 turbine is way to go . It has less blades and is of a more open paddle bladed design with high inducer tips . Its what you get in GT2530/GT2860RS/GT2871R . HKS's GT-RS is just anothe name for a housing change on a GT2871R 52 comp trim cartridge .

All this aside you need to work out which flange size the turbine housing has because most are T2/25/28 (same) and a small number from HKS have the T3 mount flange size which you would need for an RB20/25 .

Off the shelf a GT2530 or a GT-RS (2871R 52T) are practical things on RB25's depending on what power/response you want .

Its a shame Garrett didn't make T3 flanged turbine housings for this series because it would make life a lot easier for those needing GT25/28 turbos for Skylines . HKS saw a market and catered for it .

Cheers A .

[datsqik]

The 25 used to have a smaller dia section that the turbine housing bolts to compared to the 28's but im not sure if this is still the case with the 2560 compared to the 2860.

[THENIG]

Slightly off topic but does anybody know who sells 'bolt on' garret ball bearing series turbo kits for rb20?? Or is it only GCG and Hp in a box?? I would prefer a melbourne distributor so at least if im paying top dollar i can have some after sale service.

There seems to be a big price descepency between aussie distributors and buying off ebay direct from the states. I don't trust ebay for stuff like that, has anybody bought a disco or 2871R that bolts straight on to a RB20 this way??

[QRI05E]

Thanks for the Info Discopotato...

Well maybe you can help me in selecting the best suited turbo. I am doing a turbo conversion on a Nissan Pulsar N16 with the QG18DE (1.8L) engine.

Im after a zippy turbo (ball bearing of coarse) that will give decent top end power without chocking.

Engine Specs

Engine name : QG18DE

Valves per Cylinder : 4

Cam Configuration : DOHC

Displacement (cc) : 1769

Compression Ratio : 9.5:1

Bore / Stroke (mm) : 80 / 88

Number of Cylinders : 4

Cylinder Configuration : Inline

cast iron engine block

Aluminum Heads

Variable Valve Timing

MPI fuel injection

# Power - 126 hp (94 kW) @ 6000 rpm

# Torque - 129 lbf.ft (174 nm) @ 2400 rpm

# Redline - 6500 rpm

Power Goal: 160 - 170atw/kw

Boost: 10psi max

Full boost: 3000 - 3500RPM

I am considering either the GT2860R (GT28R) or GT28RS both with the .64 Ex housing for faster spool on a 1.8

Thanks guys

[FOOLBOOST]

next

Edited January 16, 2008 by FOOLBOOST

[FOOLBOOST]

Ok for a 1.8L, 4 cylinder around 180-200rwkw id go for an HKSgt2510, dont think you could do better...

Specs here:

HKS GT2510 - 300 PS Output

COMPRESSOR:

-Wheel- 63 Trim - 47.7 Inducer / 60.1 Major

-Housing- 60 Inlet / 50 Outlet - 0.60 A/R

TURBINE:

-Wheel- 62 Trim - 53.0 Major / 41.7 Exducer

-Housing- GT25 inlet / Internal GT25 oulet - 0.64 A/R

Edited January 16, 2008 by FOOLBOOST

[RS500]

The terminology stems from the pre ball bearing turbos like T2's and T25's and T28's .

It was sort of hard in the BB era because early on they were mostly called GT25XXR turbos ie GT2530R or GT2540R etc .

The small BB centre section is also commonly known as the GT25 BB centre section .

Most of Garretts turbo families are based on their turbine series (by name) , from what I've seen Garrett developed the T2 series which later grew slightly larger diametre turbines and compressors (T25) and larger pairs again for the T28's .

They went this way to make more compact/lighter turbos than the T3 series .

You could look at a T28 as a turbo with larger diameter wheels than a T25 and a good example of this is the GTiR's turbo .

When Garrett started making the BB version of the basic T2 centre section they used what looks like a BB shaft version of the basic 11 bladed T25 turbine and either 54 or 60mm diametre compressors on the other end .

They also developed the high performance 54mm NS111 turbine and used these with 60mm compressors in turbos like the GT2530 . As time went by Garrett decided to call this turbine and 60mm compressor combination "GT2860R" or "GT2860RS" in one case because the RS ment BB modified or altered spec in that case .

Really the names or descriptions are all over the place , you really need to know which turbine and compressor spec combinations you want to use and then hunt up the part number . This is not as hard as it may sound , aside from a TT engine like an RB26 that may need super responsive turbos I think the high performance NS111 turbine is way to go . It has less blades and is of a more open paddle bladed design with high inducer tips . Its what you get in GT2530/GT2860RS/GT2871R . HKS's GT-RS is just anothe name for a housing change on a GT2871R 52 comp trim cartridge .

All this aside you need to work out which flange size the turbine housing has because most are T2/25/28 (same) and a small number from HKS have the T3 mount flange size which you would need for an RB20/25 .

Off the shelf a GT2530 or a GT-RS (2871R 52T) are practical things on RB25's depending on what power/response you want .

Its a shame Garrett didn't make T3 flanged turbine housings for this series because it would make life a lot easier for those needing GT25/28 turbos for Skylines . HKS saw a market and catered for it .

Cheers A .

Disco,

very informative as always.

i have a question, to overcome the T3 flange issue with the Garrett GT25xx BB turbos, what are your thoughts of using the RB25 turbine housing with cartridges such as the GT2860R or GT2871R (48-52T)??

do u think this is a worthwhile option to look at for a street car?

cheers,

GT

[discopotato03]

First things first , I'm not sure if Nissan had a turbo version of that engine actually I think not .

If it were me I'd think strongly about the GT2860RS or DP turbo for the following reasons .

Firstly its a high compression NA engine so it it should make reasonable torque at very low revs and not need boost right down low . Secondly IF you want to have a fighting chance of beating detonation you NEED low exhaust restriction at the bottom end of the usable rev range where you would expect to have a high CR turbo converted engine knock .

Thirdly Id only use the larger 0.86 A/R turbine housing which this turbo was expressly designed to work properly with .

Since you will probably have to have an exhaust manifold fabricated you get to choose which turbo mount flange it has .

Its been quite a while since I've been there but you should find lots of info at American sites like SE/R Forums - Sentra SE/R's being their equivalent of our Nissan Pulsar SSS's . They were playing with hotted up and turbo versions of the QR25DE (I think its called QR25 ?) which is the 2.4L four they get in the I think N16 Sentra/Pulsar . I think we got that engine in the Nissan softonroader 4WD thing - name escapes me ATM .

I probably shouldn't ask but whats the plan with engine management ? Had the car been an N15 I would have suggested a CA18DET or GA16DE turbo conversion which I think the Americans do .

Also should probably do a search on Jim Wolf Technology (JWT) as they do cams and computer mods for some of those front drive Nissans .

Lastly the bit you won't want to hear .

I would not go down this road with an N16 Pulsar because of what they cost and how much money needs to be spent to do it properly . Front wheel drive turbo cars are an abonimation IMO because when the torque rises rapidly they wheelspin and torque steer when you least need it - like entering a bend with a B Double truck going the other way . In the wet they are lethal because you have no way of knowing if its going to go where you "aim" it . I think if the all mighty intended front wheel drive cars to have turbo torque he would have backed it up with rear wheel drive - AWD .

Even then a huge amount of development has been undertaken since cars like the Jenson FF 4WD and the all conquering (in its day on the dirt) Audi Quatro first turned a wheel .

I think your going to find that Pulsars have fairly basic suspension and brakes and they won't cope too well . If you really want a turbo performance car I think you need to start with something a bit more appropriate .

Sorry if I'm bursting you bubble but on the flip side I may be saving you a lot of money .

Your money your call , cheers Adrian .

[QRI05E]

I appreciate all your advice Adrian, and by all means i do agree with you. However i was a proud owner of a Series II R33 GTST with sufficient mods and now since owning my N16 i have LOVED the car however all it lacks is some power. Thats the main reason of the turbo conversion. Im not trying to build the fastest FWD, just wanting to have some nice pull from car thats all. many N16 owners from PGA have built low - mid 13sec daily drivers with standard internals.

I will be using a Haltech Interceptor Piggy Back or might even result to an Apexi AFC Neo.

I have sourced a practically brand new reco. T25G for $350 i may even end up buying and using that which will provide plenty of power to get my car going. I just thought that its probably better to invest into a BB turbo and have a faster spool.

Cheers

[tacker]

Mate you would be better off checking out some tail pipe turbos which are a low pressure turbo. google search for them

[_Ryan_]

Slightly off topic but does anybody know who sells 'bolt on' garret ball bearing series turbo kits for rb20?? Or is it only GCG and Hp in a box?? I would prefer a melbourne distributor so at least if im paying top dollar i can have some after sale service.

There seems to be a big price descepency between aussie distributors and buying off ebay direct from the states. I don't trust ebay for stuff like that, has anybody bought a disco or 2871R that bolts straight on to a RB20 this way??

call Eastern Turbochargers, they can sort it out...

[Mr Illuminator]

I have a GT2560R aka GT2860R on my Sr20det n15 pulsar. It is very responsive and will net you 200+ kwatw. most guys on pga use these, GT2871R, GT2860RS or hks 2540.

They may have alot of wheelspin but they are dam fun to drive.

[Swiper the Fox]

I appreciate all your advice Adrian, and by all means i do agree with you. However i was a proud owner of a Series II R33 GTST with sufficient mods and now since owning my N16 i have LOVED the car however all it lacks is some power. Thats the main reason of the turbo conversion. Im not trying to build the fastest FWD, just wanting to have some nice pull from car thats all. many N16 owners from PGA have built low - mid 13sec daily drivers with standard internals.

I will be using a Haltech Interceptor Piggy Back or might even result to an Apexi AFC Neo.

I have sourced a practically brand new reco. T25G for $350 i may even end up buying and using that which will provide plenty of power to get my car going. I just thought that its probably better to invest into a BB turbo and have a faster spool.

Cheers

a small belt driven supercharger may be a better option than turbocharging

[QRI05E]

a small belt driven supercharger may be a better option than turbocharging

What are the benefits of a supercharger vs a turbo on a 1.8l?

Cheers

[Adriano]

What are the benefits of a supercharger vs a turbo on a 1.8l?

Never off boost, even at 1000rpm, and heaps less underbonnet heat.

[QRI05E]

However isnt a turbo setup much cheaper than a supercharge setup? Im sure Value Vs Cost the turbo wins