Clutch Fan Vs Electric Cooling Fan

[Nimmo]

The other day my viscous couplings baring went, so it started making a lovely loud weering noise I sourced a second hand one and got it installed, drove out of the shop and a day later my car started over heating. The coupling was so doggy that I could literally stop the fan with my hand. So what i am wondering is what do you guys recommend, is it better for me to get another coupling or put an electric cooling fan in? how does an electric cooling fan compare to the original clutch fan?

If it makes any difference my car is an R33 GTST with a RB25DET engine.

Edited October 12, 2008 by Nimmo

[some_cs_student]

When I did research on this I found that the people who went down the electric fan switched back to clutch fans and found the clutch fans were better.

It's still debatable and personally I've never tried the electronic fan, what may be making a difference is the fan shroud, it makes quite a difference to the cooling.

Also, you can buy the clutch fan new, if you search my previous threads they advise which one I got for the RB26, I think its the same as the one you want....(think! ). Not cheap though, its a few hundred from memory.

[116.hks]

how ya going mate. as ol mate said it very debatable on what is reliable. most people when they fit a thermo fan just bolt the thing straight to the radiator. in my experience, if you spaced the fan out the same distance from the radiator, where the viscous fan sits and build a shroud, like the plastic original one and mount the fan to it, at least the fan can draw the cool air in alot better and cool it sufficently. thats the next thing i'll be doing to mine when i replace the standard radiator. hope this helps mate.

[Nimmo]

Thanks for the reply's guys, I have also done a little research and found that most recommend to use the standard clutch fan plus the cost involved to covert seems to be pretty high, it does seem to be a fairly debatable topic.

I don't know anyone who has put a thermo fan in any type of vehicle so I'm kinda I guess you'd say running blind on the topic and I don't want to pay all that money to get on installed and find out it makes my car run hot.

I have decided and ordered a new coupling so when it arrives I'll get that put in, not sure if this is a good price but it's going to cost me (part only [new]) $475, personally I don't really care about the cost involved at the moment I just want the damn thing fixed.

Edited October 13, 2008 by Nimmo

[mad082]

i personally prefer clutch fans to thermo. but as has been said, it is debatable.

[Nimmo]

Yeah I pretty much based my decision on the fact that I haven't heard of or seen a vehicle that has a thermo so I have no idea how and at what temperature they run at and also before my coupling crapped itself my car was running at a good temperature, so I figure a brand new one would be better.

[mad082]

as far as cars with thermos, most fwd cars have them, as do late model (i think au and ba/bf) falcons.

[Nimmo]

Actually after scanning the internet most of the posts I saw were related to FWD's nothing really mentioned about performance cars

[mad082]

and you somehow think that the power of a car somehow determines how well the cooling system works?

ok well how about this. gti-r pulsar runs them. porsche runs thermo fans. are they enough of a performance car? and i think the r35 gtr runs them as well

[Bliksem]

EL / AU Falcon's run them too. The shroud will also fit fairly closely to the Skyline radiators.

I agree with 116.HKS too. Isnt it obvious that mounting a thermo directly to a radiator will only cool the area in contact?

Space it off, and design a shroud so the fan draws air through the entire radiator.

[R31Nismoid]

as far as cars with thermos, most fwd cars have them, as do late model (i think au and ba/bf) falcons.

is that in conjunction with a clutch?

i know the new XR6 turbos, can be overheated. Friend did it to his on Friday night.

Had the dash warning lights on, car shutdown due to overtemp etc... was a 10 degree night too up in the hills.. so evidentally the dont work 'that' well

[djr81]

as far as cars with thermos, most fwd cars have them, as do late model (i think au and ba/bf) falcons.

Most front wheel drive cars run them simply becasue they have transverse engines.

There is nothing much wrong with a fun using a viscous clutch or the plastic bendy blades. Neither is there much wrong with thermo fans.

The key is to get the ducting right. Unducted fans are hopeless compared with a properly set up unit.

[mad082]

is that in conjunction with a clutch?

i know the new XR6 turbos, can be overheated. Friend did it to his on Friday night.

Had the dash warning lights on, car shutdown due to overtemp etc... was a 10 degree night too up in the hills.. so evidentally the dont work 'that' well

what caused it to overheat though? was it the fans not working or a stuffed thermostat? bit much to say that it was because of thermos.

[R31Nismoid]

It was simply being driven hard, and the car spat the towel.

The car is brand new... how can it be anything else other than poor design? The fans were working, obviously not to the level required however.

Once pulled over, allowed to cool all was good again.

Crappy fraud!

[SSHatch]

So your mate cooks one Falcon and suddenly thermo fans are crap and so are Fords....

Ha, what a joke.

Poor design?? I doubt it. More like it was sitting still, bouncing off the limiter cooking the tyres or similar.

Both sorts of fans have their pros and cons.

A lot of people don't install aftermarket thermos correctly and either have them on a switch that they inevitably forget to switch on until they suddenly realise with horror that the needle on their temp gauge is buried past the red zone or they simply wire them in so they work all the time the ignition is on, which simply means that they are cooling their engine from the second they start it and try to warm it up.

A properly set up thermo, with a shroud and a thermo switch is a very effective setup and also reduces the load on the engine which in fact gives you that little bit extra power and allows the engine to rev that little bit faster.

A fan with a viscous coupling is also a very efficient fan as well, once again, as long as they are set up correctly and not modified. They allow the coupling to free spin when the engine is cold, reducing the load on the engine and as the engine warms up they gradually engage more and more providing the cooling that's required by the engine.

They must be set correctly though with the coupling the correct distance from both the engine and the radiator and have the correct shroud to make them work efficiently. Simply changing the radiator for a bigger bigger thicker triple core job and removing the factory fan shroud can almost render a viscous fan useless.

(Yes I am a mechanic and yes I do work for a Ford Dealership before anybody starts flaming me.

and yes I have built and modified many cars in my time as well)

[R31Nismoid]

So your mate cooks one Falcon and suddenly thermo fans are crap and so are Fords....

Ha, what a joke.

Poor design?? I doubt it. More like it was sitting still, bouncing off the limiter cooking the tyres or similar.

(Yes I am a mechanic and yes I do work for a Ford Dealership before anybody starts flaming me.

and yes I have built and modified many cars in my time as well)

The only joke is your ill informed assumptions, typical dealership mechanic.

The car was not stationary, not doing any static burnouts or anything. How about less assumptions, i dont care where you work. You didnt design the car, and obviously you haven't pushed one and found its very sub-standard limit.

The fact it overheated while on a long, consistent drive (we'd been going for about 40mins or so), and then required pulling over to sort it out... typical ford rubbish. My temps, 70 degree's the entire time, with the odd appearance of 72.

Maybe its just co-incidence, maybe we need to get the x-files out?

But then he's had his fair share of lemons as have the rest of australia... i need not go into the 3 other cars with various problems from rod's shooting out of the block, dash lights turning off randomly for periods of time and diffs just not working.

[SSHatch]

So if the themo fan setup on a Ford is such a poorly designed thing then why do so many people use them as upgrades when they want something better for their recently modded car??

I find your crack about being a typical dealership mechanic highly amusing...

Only been in a dealership environment for about twelve months. Been building and working with cars for about 16 years prior to that.

So now who is assuming shit??

Back to the topic at hand...

Last time I looked I did not see a Viscous Coupling on a V8 Supercar, or a Formula 1, or the V8 Utes that support the Supercars...

They all run thermo fans. So do most modern performance cars.

So whats your theory on why the XR6 Turbos thermo fan set up caused it to overheat?? Is it an auto? Was it simply that a temp sensor malfunctioned? Had the vehicle recently been worked on and maybe had repairs carried out to the cooling system and not been checked thoroughly for air in the system or maybe somebody simply did not plug the fans back in correctly? Did the PCM fail to switch the fans on for long enough? Did some rubbish get flicked up in the grill and obstruct air flow??

Its all to easy to say its a crap design or thermos dont work properly but there are so many other variables that could have caused the issue.

Edited October 15, 2008 by SSHatch

[SysLink67]

2 cents worth....

Jesus a new carish with that many things that can go wrong or can foul up the cooling system so easy..... mate the ford cooling system must crap.

You said it could be :

temp sensor malfunctioned?

Had the vehicle recently been worked on and maybe had repairs carried out to the cooling system and not been checked thoroughly for air in the system

or maybe somebody simply did not plug the fans back in correctly?

Did the PCM fail to switch the fans on for long enough?

Did some rubbish get flicked up in the grill and obstruct air flow?? OMG FORD MUST BE F&^KING WEAK.........

Sounds like you need to do a full NASA systems check before you bloody drive the car..... I would say aviation check but in recent light of Qantas f*&kups I won't.

So if the themo fan setup on a Ford is such a poorly designed thing then why do so many people use them as upgrades when they want something better for their recently modded car??

I find your crack about being a typical dealership mechanic highly amusing...

Only been in a dealership environment for about twelve months. Been building and working with cars for about 16 years prior to that.

So now who is assuming shit??

Back to the topic at hand...

Last time I looked I did not see a Viscous Coupling on a V8 Supercar, or a Formula 1, or the V8 Utes that support the Supercars...

They all run thermo fans. So do most modern performance cars.

So whats your theory on why the XR6 Turbos thermo fan set up caused it to overheat?? Is it an auto? Was it simply that a temp sensor malfunctioned? Had the vehicle recently been worked on and maybe had repairs carried out to the cooling system and not been checked thoroughly for air in the system or maybe somebody simply did not plug the fans back in correctly? Did the PCM fail to switch the fans on for long enough? Did some rubbish get flicked up in the grill and obstruct air flow??

Its all to easy to say its a crap design or thermos dont work properly but there are so many other variables that could have caused the issue.

[babyskyline]

2 cents worth....

Jesus a new carish with that many things that can go wrong or can foul up the cooling system so easy..... mate the ford cooling system must crap.

You said it could be :

temp sensor malfunctioned?

Had the vehicle recently been worked on and maybe had repairs carried out to the cooling system and not been checked thoroughly for air in the system

or maybe somebody simply did not plug the fans back in correctly?

Did the PCM fail to switch the fans on for long enough?

Did some rubbish get flicked up in the grill and obstruct air flow?? OMG FORD MUST BE F&^KING WEAK.........

Sounds like you need to do a full NASA systems check before you bloody drive the car..... I would say aviation check but in recent light of Qantas f*&kups I won't.

Was thinking the same thing. A new car and that many things can go wrong with it when your just out on a nice long drive.

Sounds like typical ford crap to me

[SSHatch]

Typical tunnel vision forum views.

Only see and read what you want...

Do I give a crap if you bag out Fords?? Nope. They keep me in full time employment fixing them.

But then the same goes for Holden employees... and Honda... and Subaru... and Mitsubishi... etc etc

Somebody asks a simple question and it turns into a bag out somebody affair yet again, with an Admin/Moderator in the middle of it all. How typical...

To Nimmo, obviously because "one" XR6 Turbo overheated for unknown reasons its the opinion of those that matter on this forum, who is obviously part of a nice little clicky club cause he got all his mates to come on and back him up, that you should stick with the standard Nissan Viscous Coupling type fan on your car as it cant be bettered.

I will now humbly back away from this thread and vow to never voice an opinion again unless I am given it from somebody on here as unless you are one of the chosen few, you are obviously wrong and better off to be like the three wise monkeys...