Po Po's And Their Power Trips...

[oweban]

Oh, and whilst I feel that there's "nothing wrong" with the morons taking themselves out, unfortunately if I remember correctly, it costs around $500 000 each time a single person kills themselves in a motor vehicle accident. (Emergency response, stress caused to those at the scene, to family and friends etc, as well as other things like if services are destroyed, roads need closing etc etc) Those who pay the fine, rather than killing themselves, are just helping to fill this little void...

True, it's unfortunate that everyone else has to wear that person's poor decision, especially their family and the officers involved for the stress and the nightmares that will keep coming back to them for years to come.

[NISMO]

My point was duty of care. If an officer sees an idiot like this and puts the lights on and the idiot tries to run, the outcome is obviously going to be deadly. If the police use their duty of care in every situation they would not be able to chase this idiot as it will obviously be extremely dangerous to the idiot and every other road user at the time. If they don't chase they don't run so yes police do have to wear some responsibility for the consequenses.

If they have no problem throwing their duty of care out the window every time they chase one of these idiots or a drunk driver etc then why use duty of care as a reason not to use a bit of discretion and compassion in a situation like soulblighter's. The duty of care excuse is hypocritical.

There are other ways to catch idiots other than police chases. If safety was the number 1 priority many of these measures would have been in place for years.

I'm not blaming police directly for this as its a joint problem caused by both government and police.

I can see your point, and def knew what you were trying to say.

Flip the coin and imagine how it would be where the crims know that the police won't chase. You think it would stop them from running?

Not a chance in hell, in fact every single one of them will know hit a bit of speed and the cops will back off.

In a bad situation, cool, steal a car hit some speed and cops will back off.

The fact that these farkwits (sorry idiots is too mild ) are running in the first place means they already ain't playing with a full deck. So you can bet that not a single one will be thinking, ok if i run, they will somehow catch up with me in a week or two. Shit better not run.

If the police backed off in chases, i bet the number of people resorting to high speeds to get away would treble.

If you're thinking when they see an unresgistered car, just let them be and get them at home, please explain how that helps me, when this same farkwit, hits me and writes off my rare pride and joy and he has no insurance??

[Gr333dy]

Highway patrol. Lol....

[rb26zed]

If you're thinking when they see an unresgistered car, just let them be and get them at home, please explain how that helps me, when this same farkwit, hits me and writes off my rare pride and joy and he has no insurance??

Its just the lesser of 2 evils. Option 1 cops chase, moron runs, very dangerous situation created. Option 2 cops don't chase, moron doesn't run but probably gets caught later on.

I wasn't suggesting to just let them go, I meant they should be using other means such as choppers and other technologies. Police chases are usually far more dangerous than the often petty crime they are trying to stop. Stolen cars, unregistered cars, defective cars, speeding cars etc are not serious enough to warrant a dangerous police chase.

Flip the coin and imagine how it would be where the crim sees a marked cop car that doesn't give chase but now knows he is being followed and watched by numerous other things including a chopper. He knows that running won't work as the cops have already strategically set up blocks on all his possible routes. No matter what the moron does he will only be doing it for a short while at best as opposed to long drawn out dangerous police chases. This senario is not 100% foolproof but it would both, catch more crims and be safer. Win win as far as I can see.

Unregistered, defective and speeding cars that pose a risk of developing into a chase could easily be dealt with by taking the details and sending another unit ahead to their home while the 1st unit just keeps tabs on them from a distance until an unmarked unit takes over the keeping tabs.

Point being there are many safer and more effective ways of enforcing the law without resorting to police chases. Problem is these things COST money not MAKE money. Safety is not the top priority.

[zebra]

Do you want to pay to keep 100 helicopters in the air 24/7 to cover sydney, plus kinda hard for a helicopter to land in a back alley in the city to arrest someone.

Being followed is just being chased isnt it, two differnt words, same meaning? how do you follow someone but not be chasing them, Not to mention the fact that police chases are called off all the time, and they they are in constant contact with a co-ordinator relaying info like traffic levels and pedestrians etc.

Setup road blocks? Um what how can you setup road blocks along every exit on the M4 or Hume? while the guy running is doing 200km/h?

Last I checked we cant magically "beam me up scotty" teleport every police officer in NSW who can magically setup road blocks in 1.4secs

[Gr333dy]

Do you want to pay to keep 100 helicopters in the air 24/7 to cover sydney, plus kinda hard for a helicopter to land in a back alley in the city to arrest someone.

Being followed is just being chased isnt it, two differnt words, same meaning? how do you follow someone but not be chasing them, Not to mention the fact that police chases are called off all the time, and they they are in constant contact with a co-ordinator relaying info like traffic levels and pedestrians etc.

Setup road blocks? Um what how can you setup road blocks along every exit on the M4 or Hume? while the guy running is doing 200km/h?

Last I checked we cant magically "beam me up scotty" teleport every police officer in NSW who can magically setup road blocks in 1.4secs

Such hate. calm down . Try be constructive, we pay a crap load of fines and tax's i dont see why we cant afford to have an increased number of helicopters. Its all about the money. The government can use the extra initative buts its cheaper to just use a single cop car to flag down the car that may start a police chase.

[MBS206]

Such hate. calm down . Try be constructive, we pay a crap load of fines and tax's i dont see why we cant afford to have an increased number of helicopters. Its all about the money. The government can use the extra initative buts its cheaper to just use a single cop car to flag down the car that may start a police chase.

Do you know how much it costs to have a single chopper in the air? On average $3000 per minute from memory the figure is. To put it in the air 24/7 and with enough that they have a 3 minute response time, a j-walking ticket would cost $10 000

the revenue raised from fines is only subsidizing your taxes.

Increase spending, increase taxes... The government just got in trouble for trying to raise taxes off the public, yet they got criticized for not spending enough...

[rb26zed]

Do you want to pay to keep 100 helicopters in the air 24/7 to cover sydney, plus kinda hard for a helicopter to land in a back alley in the city to arrest someone.

Being followed is just being chased isnt it, two differnt words, same meaning? how do you follow someone but not be chasing them, Not to mention the fact that police chases are called off all the time, and they they are in constant contact with a co-ordinator relaying info like traffic levels and pedestrians etc.

Setup road blocks? Um what how can you setup road blocks along every exit on the M4 or Hume? while the guy running is doing 200km/h?

Last I checked we cant magically "beam me up scotty" teleport every police officer in NSW who can magically setup road blocks in 1.4secs

I shouldn't waste my time replying to such an ill constructed arguement, but I will this once as you have seemed to be a man of inteligence in past posts I've read of yours.

Choppers are obviously not the only thing police can use. They certainly don't need 100 of them and none of them would need to be in the air 24/7. A chopper never makes arrests, um, didn't really think that would actually need to be said.

Police already do set up road blocks but they would be far more effective with the aid of selectively used technologies. A chopper with heat vision etc would help immensely. Computer programs that could predict likely routes would help the road blocks be more efficient and effective by helping the police set them up in bottle necks and the like.

This technology exists along with a lot more. Of course it won't be 100% foolproof but it would obviously be more effective and safer than police chases.

If the crim doesn't know they are being followed they are not running therefore there is no chase. A chopper can spot and keep track from a long distance.

Yes this would cost more and require more police doing real police work and less revenue raising.

MBS206, we could start a very long thread if we started on how the government wastes our money. It's about priorities. Fact is our safety is not a priority to our government. If the government spent our money the way we want it spent and prioritised there spending to suit then changes like this would be possible. But then of course things like healthcare, education, law and order, roads and road safety would all have to be paid for before the pollies could get their payrises, exorbitant pensions, overseas trips and the rest of their gravy.

There are countries with much lower taxes than us that do have their priorities set more like this. It wouldn't take me long to save a few billion. For starters state governments should be abolished and we have far too many federal pollies. That would just be the tip of the iceberg, but that alone could fix the health system, education system and put plenty of choppers in the air plus a lot more.

[FrangaR33]

Do you know how much it costs to have a single chopper in the air? On average $3000 per minute from memory the figure is. To put it in the air 24/7 and with enough that they have a 3 minute response time, a j-walking ticket would cost $10 000

the revenue raised from fines is only subsidizing your taxes.

Increase spending, increase taxes... The government just got in trouble for trying to raise taxes off the public, yet they got criticized for not spending enough...

+1

People really dont realise that the government doesnt have piles and piles of money just sitting around waiting to be spent. Right now the state governments dont have enough money to even cover current policy and infrastructure projects and they use the money gained from fines to prop up their bottom line so it at least looks half way respectable. Its hardly the right thing to do but when a politician is faced with raising taxes and thereby alienating the entire population vs fineing drivers who make a much smaller percentage of the population it comes down to simple mathematics as to which one will cost the party the least amount of votes in the next election. The states are currently in $159.1 billion of debt, so its only a matter of time before the fines go up even further its been happening every year now just expect them to go up a lot faster.

Also rb26zed you are literally spouting off some of the most retarded claptrap I have ever heard, police need to chase criminals otherwise they get away to commit more crimes perhaps on people you care about. Police have limited resources and do wonders with what they have what your suggesting is ming bogling, say we have 1000 drug dealers getting busted every day, now to catch them in your suggested way you need at least 1 chopper and probably 50+ cars in order to block off every possible escape route per drug dealer, so say they do 2 busts a day which is not unreasonable considering the set up time. So that means we need 500 helicopters and 25000+ police cars just to bust the drug dealers, let alone the rapists, murderers and all of the types of violent criminals.

Nismo is right, you let these f**kers go once they will all learn their lesson like any animal with more than 2 brain cells and realise "oh yeah if I drive away fast I always get away because the cops wont chase me", also your beloved car would get stolen every other day because they are hardly going to do a runner from the coppers in their own car that would be stupid they would steal other peoples.

Edited October 11, 2010 by FrangaR33

[rb26zed]

+1

People really dont realise that the government doesnt have piles and piles of money just sitting around waiting to be spent. Right now the state governments dont have enough money to even cover current policy and infrastructure projects and they use the money gained from fines to prop up their bottom line so it at least looks half way respectable. Its hardly the right thing to do but when a politician is faced with raising taxes and thereby alienating the entire population vs fineing drivers who make a much smaller percentage of the population it comes down to simple mathematics as to which one will cost the party the least amount of votes in the next election. The states are currently in $159.1 billion of debt, so its only a matter of time before the fines go up even further its been happening every year now just expect them to go up a lot faster.

Also rb26zed you are literally spouting off some of the most retarded claptrap I have ever heard, police need to chase criminals otherwise they get away to commit more crimes perhaps on people you care about. Police have limited resources and do wonders with what they have what your suggesting is ming bogling, say we have 1000 drug dealers getting busted every day, now to catch them in your suggested way you need at least 1 chopper and probably 50+ cars in order to block off every possible escape route, so say they do 2 busts a day which is not unreasonable considering the set up time. So that means we need 500 helicopters and 2500 police cars just to bust the drug dealers, let alone the rapists, murderers and all of the types of violent criminals.

Nismo is right, you let these f**kers go once they will all learn their lesson like any animal with more than 2 brain cells and realise "oh yeah if I drive away fast I always get away because the cops wont chase me", also your beloved car would get stolen every other day because they are hardly going to do a runner from the coppers in their own car that would be stupid they would steal other peoples.

I just can't be bothered responding to this rubbish except to point out this ridiculous contradiction.

[FrangaR33]

I just can't be bothered responding to this rubbish except to point out this ridiculous contradiction.

Also rb26zed you are literally spouting off some of the most retarded claptrap I have ever heard, police need to chase criminals otherwise they get away to commit more crimes perhaps on people you care about. Police have limited resources and do wonders with what they have what your suggesting is ming bogling, say we have 1000 drug dealers getting busted every day, now to catch them in your suggested way you need at least 1 chopper and probably 50+ cars in order to block off every possible escape route per drug dealer, so say they do 2 busts a day which is not unreasonable considering the set up time. So that means we need 500 helicopters and 25000+ police cars just to bust the drug dealers, let alone the rapists, murderers and all of the types of violent criminals.

I meant to write per drug dealer where it it is now written my previous post has now been edited, also missed a zero at the end of the number of police cars. Despite my lack of grammar it doesnt invalidate my point that your suggestion is logistically impossible and would be the greatest drain of the budgets of the state governments much greater than even healthcare or education.

[rb26zed]

*sigh* Your grammar was not the contradiction. The fact you say that I'm "literally spouting off some of the most retarded claptrap I have ever heard" and then you follow it up with what you said is the contradiction.

[FrangaR33]

*sigh* Your grammar was not the contradiction. The fact you say that I'm "literally spouting off some of the most retarded claptrap I have ever heard" and then you follow it up with what you said is the contradiction.

How is pointing out the logistics required in your plan to safely apprehend criminals a contradiction? I have read the budget data for NSW and know what horrible state its in, even a token increase to the capabilites of the police force would require taking that money from what 90% of the time amounts to funding for a badly needed project.

[NISMO]

Such hate. calm down . Try be constructive, we pay a crap load of fines and tax's i dont see why we cant afford to have an increased number of helicopters. Its all about the money. The government can use the extra initative buts its cheaper to just use a single cop car to flag down the car that may start a police chase.

Hi jawrgy

A suspension means a suspension mate.

Start a new user name again, and you will be banned from the site permanantly.

[oweban]

Hi jawrgy

A suspension means a suspension mate.

Start a new user name again, and you will be banned from the site permanantly.

s-s-s-snap

[Prue]

This arguement is just getting stupid.

- It's not the cops fault you're breaking the law

- It's not their fault that the person decides to try & get away

[zebra]

Hi jawrgy

A suspension means a suspension mate.

Start a new user name again, and you will be banned from the site permanantly.

Glad I wasnt the only one to pick up on that

[rb26zed]

This arguement is just getting stupid.

- It's not the cops fault you're breaking the law

- It's not their fault that the person decides to try & get away

I can't see where anybody has said that.

[Fantm1]

Sometimes the punishment, that is the fine, just doesn't fit the crime. Giving a defect for the sake of it. $600 dollar fines for an oversight. Giving good people a hard time for nothing. They have meter maids on the gold coast, maybe we could also have registration maids.

Sure our society needs to raise money to operate, but if the govenments didn't waste so much they wouldn't have to raise so much even though they keep bleating that it's not revenue raising. How much of yours and my money pays for wasteful government projects.

Hopefully soon they'll have a way of tracking cars without dangerously chasing them, maybe by having a form of firearm mounted under the traffic cameras that fire a tracking device or paint ball type tracking substance on to the badguys car.

Interesting thing they say here everytime a person gets killed in a car chase is "We called it off as soon as it got dangerous". As soon as you start a pursuit it is dangerous, the fact that a chase has already started means the stage is already set for a bad outcome. Even my dad used to say they have to chase them they can't let them get away. I wonder how he'd feel if it was me that was killed, just because they were chasing somone who broke the speed limit. It's just human instict to not want to get caught. It's always easy to stand back and comment either way in these discussions, but wait 'til it's on your door step. Would you want the police to chase a car if it meant the life of a pregnant woman and her baby (which has happened) or the many other innocent people killed as a result of car/motorbike chases. I think most of us would say no. A lot of times the consequences don't fit the crime.

Everything we do in our society is done at the back end. If measures were put into place at the front end maybe some of the problems wouldn't exist. How many people in Australia commit suicide every year - thousands, let alone cigarette and alcohol related deaths. We don't focus as much on the cause as we do trying to repair the damage. And this costs the country a fortune.

Our police are trained to use guns tazers capsicum spray and brute force. I've watched many a documentary where tranquilisers bring down rhinos and lions, etc, makes them a lot easier to handle. Do this in the right situations and you might remove a lot of the ugliness.

[zebra]

tl:dr