Jump to content
SAU Community

Recommended Posts

Image Credits: Injector Online (www.injectorsonline.com) - go buy shit from them, good prices and fast delivery!

So yeah - I'm actually stuck and need everyone's thoughts and opinions!

Long story short, I know RB25DET NEO plenums like to take 3/4 height top feed injectors, which are approximately 52~55cm o-ring to o-ring in distance. Most will just get a set of 1000cc Bosch injectors OR modified Bosch 1250cc injectors that are of that length. I wanted more fuel supply, so opted for the non-modified Bosch 1550cc (1650cc often advertised) injectors.

image.png.afc7e8d8d818d62cd2dfdcf3f64f26d6.png

These injectors are 1/2 height, and are approximately 40mm o-ring to o-ring in distance, with the correct extension you can make these the same height as your typical 3/4 height Bosch 1000cc or XSpurt 1000cc injector. Below is the same injector now with the extension, giving you that 3/4 height.

image.png.d03d91ca84765d53ee216f5c640d6cf1.png

Theoretically they now should just bolt up and off you go right? Many sites from various countries tend to advertise 1/2 height injectors with extensions (making them 3/4 height injectors) as direct fit - however here's the fun part, you actually can't even get the injector to go all the way into the injector seat on the RB25DET NEO intake manifold.

They simply just don't work! Problem is, as they are so short before the hard plastic that keeps the o-ring captive doesn't even touch the injector seating area of the intake manifold because the injector plug ends up touching the intake manifold. Being the person that at times thinks outside the box, I went on and installed a bunch of 14mmx5.5mm injector buffers from a GT-R thinking that would solve the problem. 

image.png.ac26233e8caedc15428684b67f3e6c4c.png

Well - it kind of did, now there's a bit of space and the injectors are somewhat sealing well... but yes, now the connectors won't even go on! because there's simply not enough room. So I am really intrigued how these different suppliers are all listing these injectors as direct fit - when clearly they won't? (noting all the injectors are 1/2 height with either full height or 3/4 height extensions)

https://www.injectorsonline.com/au/1500cc-xspurt-injectors-x-6-neo.html

https://www.golebysparts.com.au/parts/view/2053/58/nissan-rb20-25-26/fuel-rails-and-fuel-rail-injector-kits/rb25-r34-neo-plazmaman-fuel-rail-kit-2000cc-injectors

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Nissan-1300cc-Fuel-injectors-RB25DET-NEO-R34-Skyline-Stagea-C34-Plug-Play/182639648111?epid=6004139375&hash=item2a862bdd6f:g:S~QAAOSw4DJYlreh

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Bosch-2200cc-Flow-Matched-Injector-Set-For-Nissan-Skyline-R33-I6-RB25-Neo/222702641007?hash=item33da1c9f6f:g:u9wAAOSw0exZ-oq3

So the question, how did you guys with 2000/2200cc Bosch CNG or ID1050/1300/1700 injectors get them on? considering they are all 1/2 height and all require to be extended? I would assume all the plugs would hit the same region and would disrupt how the injector would be seated. And FWIW, I'm using a Plazmaman rail (still, doesn't affect how the connects sit and/or hit the intake).

20171215_201744_HDR.thumb.jpg.ecaffeb5609bf87a195a07752d394333.jpg20171207_194828_HDR.thumb.jpg.cf8b6844a4b24fec97a901e41830e215.jpg

(yes I even changed extenders so they're identical to the Xspurt kit, I sourced my injectors elsewhere though) 

Also you can't really rotate the plugs upwards because the injectors no longer will seal properly.

My ultimate last option is to go install a R33 intake manifold on my R34 NEO motor (which I don't want to do).

Thanks all!

Funny you said that, I was tempted to grind a bit off the injector connectors so they can clear the top area of the intake manifold.

I more curious to hear/see how guys with NEO motors fit those old 2000/2200 gaysex injectors back in the days as they're all 1/2 height also and 100% would have the same issues.

Some digging around it seems guys with BRZ/86 FA20DI N/A motors actually have the same issue but ID have come up with a solution for them.

I am pretty sure it won't fit inside the RB25 NEO intake manifold 

5a3436681dd00_images(1).jpeg.dfe3b3279fc8ecc9fe73ce020fbfae29.jpeg

These are my photos, which shows an identical injector setup as per Injector Online.

So you can see that the connector hits the intake manifold, and yes it's possible to turn some of them to allow the injector to be seated in however that means some injectors won't be perpendicular to the manifold (big no no). To make things more fun you also won't be able to get the connectors on lol.

20171216_100935_HDR.thumb.jpg.d63b1bc1193360c4af7cf583346b3859.jpg20171216_101012_HDR.thumb.jpg.078aca223ead8c4b1af882cf8320dcb9.jpg20171216_101047_HDR.thumb.jpg.6ea13259a02d86a8de1dc47a933fee19.jpg20171216_101203_HDR.thumb.jpg.3d36afc049fc408dea01dee2c4cb2719.jpg20171216_100959_HDR.thumb.jpg.46544164172f81964ed70a01fc1c4768.jpg

The best and probably only option I have is some form of 14mm to 14mm (male to female) injector seat as such.

I've simulated this using the 1/2 to full length extension (hole is too small I know haha)

20171216_101422_HDR.thumb.jpg.6fdb8d741cb91aa8056d7b9483e95100.jpg

20171216_101440_HDR.thumb.jpg.e92ee0fce875ecb552f423a7588dd31c.jpg

15 minutes ago, NEO25T said:

Hmmm, this shows size difference on the xspurt webpage.

 

I asked Scotty about this so hopefully he has some info that will help out

Unfortunately you can't get high capacity unmodified injectors in 3/4 height. If you look closely at those tips of the Xspurt 3/4 height they have been milled off.

I've spent decent coin on these unmodified Bosch 1550cc injectors and I do want to run them.

I'm still super curious how people with ID1050/1300/1700X injectors are getting them to fit on NEO motors and also how people with the Bosch 2000/2200 CNG injectors got them to fit. There seems to be zero guides or images for these setups.

My very last options are to either go back to a R33 intake manifold (gay) or buy a Hypertune (over priced) or equivalent plenum such as Otaku Garage/Madcat (China dim sim sui mai spec). 

It would be good to know how much meat is on the manifold before it breaks through to the coolant gallery. You might be able to make enough clearance for the plug by removing aluminum.

1 hour ago, Dobz said:

It would be good to know how much meat is on the manifold before it breaks through to the coolant gallery. You might be able to make enough clearance for the plug by removing aluminum.

 

12 hours ago, GTSBoy said:

Die grinder?

 

I would just go full retard with a die grinder       Grind everything. The manifold. The plug. The injector. Grindr.  make it fit in the hole.  

2 hours ago, Ben C34 said:

I would just go full retard with a die grinder       Grind everything. The manifold. The plug. The injector. Grindr.  make it fit in the hole.  

Ben!  Look at your PMs, goddammnit.

I had a close look at a Neo turbo and R33 lower inlet manifold sections and they are quite different in the injector mount area particularly at the manifold face . The Neo puts the injector tip closer to the head than the R33s and doesn't have the recess around the injector tip area at the top of the manifold ports .

Also the ribbed water log is further outwards from the manifold face on the Neo manifold . I'd say this is why the injectors sit deeper into the manifold on the Neo .

I think the sad truth is that unless you can fettle enough out of the manifold without finding air or water to get clearance those short EV14 injectors may not be usable .

Next question may be will the full length injectors work and are they available in a suitable size unmodified ? 

Bad news - after a few e-mails back and forth with Injector Online they too agree that what they have listed is incorrect and they are removing it soon.

TL;DR Do no try and fit 1/2 Height Injectors to a R34 GT-t NEO Intake Manifold, they WILL NOT WORK!

There are plenty of INCORRECT listings all over the web.

image.thumb.png.527c1e69b079e9fe160ca308663dd322.png

  • Haha 1
2 hours ago, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

Bad news - after a few e-mails back and forth with Injector Online they too agree that what they have listed is incorrect and they are removing it soon.

TL;DR Do no try and fit 1/2 Height Injectors to a R34 GT-t NEO Intake Manifold, they WILL NOT WORK!

There are plenty of INCORRECT listings all over the web.

Whats your plan now Johnny?

Might slap on the R33 RB25 intake manifold onto the motor OR hope someone knocks on my door takes the car/motor/spare parts and gives me a stock 335i F30 BMW.

There may be a slight fix depending on how much material you can mill off the manifold face of the Neo lower section .

I had a look at the face and a problem is the lack of material around the front water inlet . This would limit how much you can machine off without enlarging this water passage .

If you are prepared to work around this and reset the injector height in the mounting hole it may just be enough to clear everything for your short EV14s .

A .

  • Like 1

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Latest Posts

    • Had I known the diff between R32 and R33 suspension I would have R33 suspension. That ship has sailed so I'm doing my best to replicate a drop spindle without spending $4k on a Billet one.
    • OEM suspension starts to bind as soon as the car gets away from stock height. I locked in the caster and camber before cutting off the kingpin. I then let the upright down in a natural (unbound) state before re-attaching it. Now it moves freely in bump and droop relative to the new ride height. My plan is to add GKTech arms before the car is finished so I can dial camber and caster further. It will be fine. This isn't rocket science. Caster looks good, camber is good, upper arm doesn't cause crazy gain and it is now closer to the stock angle and bump steer checks out. Send it.
    • Pay careful attention to the kinematics of that upper arm. The bloody things don't work properly even on a normal stock height R32. Nissan really screwed the pooch on that one. The fixes have included changing the hole locations on the bracket to change the angle of the inner pivot (which was fairly successful but usually makes it impossible to install or remove the arm without unbolting the bracket from the tower, which sucks) and various swivelling upper arm designs. ALL the swivelling upper arm designs that look like a capital I (with serifs) suck. All of them. Some of them are in fact terribly unsafe. Even the best one of them (the old UAS design) shat itself in short order on my car. The only upper arm that works as advertised and is pretty safe is the GKTech one. But it is high maintenance on a street car. I'm guessing that a 600HP car as (stupidly, IMO) low as you are going is not going to be a regular driver. So the maintenance issues on suspension parts are probably not going to be a problem. But you really must make sure that however your fairly drastically modded suspension ends up, that the upper arms swing through an arc that wants to keep the inner and outer bolts parallel. If the outer end travels through an arc that makes that end's bolt want to skew away from parallel with the inner bolt, you will build up enormous binding and compressing forces in the bushes, chew them out and hate life. The suspension compliance can actually be dominated by the bush binding, not the spring rate! It may be the case that even something like the GKTech arm won't work if your suspension kinematics become too weird, courtesy of all the cut and shut going on. Although you at least say there's no binding now, so maybe you're OK. Seeing as you're in the build phase, you could consider using R33/4 type upper arms (either that actual arm, OEM or aftermarket) or any similar wishbone designed to suit your available space, so alleviate the silliness of the R32 design. Then you can locate your inner pivots to provide the correct kinematics (camber gain on compression, etc).
    • The frontend wouldn't go low enough because the coilover was max low and the upper control arm would collapse into itself and potentially bottom out in the strut tower. I made a brace and cut off the kingpin and then moved the upright down 1.25" and welded. i still have to finish but this gives an idea. Now I can have a normal 3.25" of shock travel and things aren't binding. I'm also dropping the lower arm and tie rod 1.25".
    • Motor and body mockup. Wheel fitment and ride height not set. Last pic shows front ride height after modifying the front uprights to make a 1.25" drop spindle.
×
×
  • Create New...