Tuff "dog box" Wanted -where?

[Bobjones]

I have used both the ppg and the PAR gearsets, the PPG full set in a skyline and the PAR 1-4 gear set in a WRX both with dog engagement.

I think people are looking at two very different aspect here, whether the engagement is harsh or the gears are standing up to the power.

Harsh changes will result in breakages, there is always an upper limit of anything, dog engagement allows flat enaggement with less risk of give and additional strain on the gear sets. The gear set themselves then also comes into question, including the metallergical treatment that they have under gone and the design of the teeth.

Everything is a compromise, and you need to get a box for the application, a dog box will be driveable on the street, but not really in traffic...

Also the Series 3 GTR boxes are still prone to breakage in third, I have seen one do it after hearing that the series 1 it replaced was weak. The fact is the gear changes were the killer and as it was still using synchomesh this was placing additional strain on the box and gear sets.

I would also like to hear the reason behind saying PPG are crap...

[IMACUL8]

What is this comment based on? Anything to explain why you said this as i am sure everyone is curious why you are claiming them to be rubbish, i sure am.

 

I don't know anything about these gearboxes so i am just interested to find out like most other people here.

 

Also, about the ikeya shifters, i read in hpi i think that they are slower shifting and more awkard then the stock shifter, great idea but just seems they didn't get it 100% right.

 

Oh and not that it really means anything but I WIN is running a Pfitzner gearbox in his 33 GTR now, might be worth asking him how its handling the power. If you want to pm him his username on here is MR33.

Yes mate - experience

Mate ordered the PPG full dog for his rex - after waiting a eterinity for it - the dog gears did not seem to be of the best quality - with seemingly having imperfections. He returned the box back to PPG (didnt even fit it) and awaited them to fix it. When they returned it - same thing again. Ended up refunding him.

[giant]

Hi guys

for what its worth, i am currently using a ppg gearbox, straight cut dog engagement and love it. has been very good so far with no problems. on the dragstrip and for circuits also picked up around a third of a second down the 1/4

to get the car inot the ten second bracket.

it is noisy being straight cut, but the gearset was a work of art and the selector forks very strong. i have also been crewing for a team in the australian rally series

over the last couple of years and the ppg box in the group n car performed without fault.

i am very hard on the transmissions if that is anything to go by, 6500 to 7000

grand launches on the last two rallies comprising of 20 odd stages or more each rally.

cheers russell

[Bobjones]

IMACULA8 how long ago was this set sent to you...

I have only seen PAR sets in a WRX and not PPG, so I will ask around some more, but the ones we have used in skylines and the sets in silvias have been faultless. the WRX box also allows easy install of dog enagagement compared to other boxes due to the design...even though the output and input shafts are weaker than a druggos arm...

[exXU1]

All very interesting.

The comment about a ppg being crap based on some ones oppinion that the gear sets were imperfect is a little hard , particularly as they were never installed and put through their paces!

PPG what doe's this stand for, Pfitzner - performance gears, satirical question if it's correct.

The general concensus on the PPG appears to be that they are not bad at all and affordable to the average ( keen ) man on the street ( not draging , it's an expression only ).

Ok the Hollinger seems to be the "Ducks nuts " but ut should be for the $$$.

The TRUST box.

Six speed - H pattern, likes revs and not torque ? Any of the above box's behind 700 horses of torque , rb 30 bottom end or simmilar 3.0ltr or bigger torque characteristics?

Wonder how the Trust would handle that against the PPG ?

[markr34gtr]

ppg straight cut dog box with big input shaft and molly selector forks is the go...

handles 700 hp at all 4 wheels and 8400rpm launches with sticky m/t drag radials..

my gearbox has done about 40 passes high 9s and low 10s...

inspected gearbox internals last month and was all good....

cheers. mark

[pnblight]

ppg straight cut dog box with big input shaft and molly selector forks is the go...

handles 700 hp at all 4 wheels and 8400rpm launches with sticky m/t drag radials..

my gearbox has done about 40 passes  high 9s and low 10s...

inspected gearbox internals last month and was all good....

cheers. mark

Hi Mark,

How did you find your 6 speed getrag box as i'm not really in this hp level only running mid 500's rwhp and looking at other opinion from the std r33 box.

Got Aaron coming to bunbury to some tuning at Adrenline performance will be interesting to see him in action as it seems his worked on some very impressive equipment including your gtr i believe yeah. He had told me you guys had a good run out of the getrag 6 speed while running the R34.

And his even put us on to the CP piston range that you guys run (looks like nice gear) hoping will be picking up a set on the wkd for RB26 for a rebuild i'm doing.

pete

[Snowman]

I know this box isn't in the same league but has anyone seen a 6 speed getrag break as was talk to the tuner of markr34gtr cars and his opinion was they were a pretty good box there not running it now in the 9sec drag car but they used and abused it for sometime with no problems. It just i'm considering going this way as my requirement arn't at suggest a high hp level and it seems the getrag is strong than the std 5 speed.

pete

ps anyone wants to unload a getrag let me know cheers

Pete,

I'll just add my 2c on the getrag 6 speed. As Troy mentioned I busted mine (twice!) and they are damn expensive things to repair. Luckily I have a handy man in the area to help me out and keep costs down a touch.

But I can also tell you that the gears themselves are strong as. And for dragging purposes I don't see them as a real weakness compared to track purposes. Both times I've wrecked mine have been on a big down-shift. Not an up-shift. Because its not the main gear teeth that gets broken - its the TINY shift drum locater teeth on the side of the gears. Basically when going from low rpm to high rpm on a down shift on the track the synchro's struggle a bit if you try and engage gears too early and can easily knock the ends of those teeth off. (When I say engage I simply mean clutch in and just positioning the gear leaver into whatever gear - not even engaging the clutch) If that happens forget getting the car into that gear above 3,500rpm.

Having said all that I've now consequently modified my down-shifting habbit's and the box has stood up well to a lot of abuse so far this year (touch wood!!)

Sorry for the hijack.

[markr34gtr]

Hi Mark,

           How did you find your 6 speed getrag box as i'm not really in this hp level only running mid 500's rwhp and looking at other opinion from the std r33 box.

         

          Got Aaron coming to bunbury to some tuning at Adrenline performance will be interesting to see him in action as it seems his worked on some very impressive equipment including your gtr i believe yeah. He had told me you guys had a good run out of the getrag 6 speed while running the R34.  

         And his even put us on to the CP piston range that you guys run (looks like nice gear) hoping will be picking up a set on the wkd for RB26 for a rebuild i'm doing.

pete

never had probs with the r34 6 speed used redline mt90 gear oil...loves the stuff.

even with the cee s short shifter never crunched gears even flat shifting...

car was making 572 rwhp and ran several 10 sec passes...

but the ppg dog box is the go.....for racing...

i use cp pistons and had good results with them in the r32 race car.....

cheers. mark

[pnblight]

Cheers guys thanks for the info

It sounds like the main gear set is strong and up to the task BUT the synco's might be the weak link. I might talk to a few gearbox specialists as was once told that synco in the 5 speed std box could be altered to give better shifting and reliability MAYBE they might be able to do something to help the 6 speed aswell. And i have also found no better gearbox oil than redline i run the redline light weight shock proof.

pete

[exXU1]

Cheers guys thanks for the info

     It sounds like the main gear set is strong and up to the task BUT the synco's might be the weak link. I might talk to a few gearbox specialists as was once told that synco in the 5 speed std box could be altered to give better shifting and reliability MAYBE they might be able to do something to help the 6 speed aswell. And i have also found no better gearbox oil than redline i run the redline light weight shock proof.

pete

I think i have made a decision gentlemen , PPG is the box for me .

Thankyou all for your input and sharing your experiences with us.

"Kiss the ground"

[lwells]

And you chose PPG because...?

Lucien.

[exXU1]

And you chose PPG because...?

Lucien.

I new some one ask that!

My answer -- purely on high hp owners experience, it's certainly not cost orientated.

Now ! Today a spanner has been thrown in the works, PAR has been talking to me in regard to there box.

Nearly half the price and offers similar gear aspects, claim that they have many box's with 1,2 3 dog and helical cut in 4 and 5 in for quiter cruising, in 1000hp cars in Australia and mainly Japan.

Can any one comment or ratify this. Are they a good box, i noticed that the main shaft is not larger like the PPG. Samm from PAR claims that he has never had a main shaft break ???

[mark99]

Im confused by what you say... Do you mean 1,2,3 straight cut, with 4 and 5 heilcal, and all are dog engagement. Or do you mean 1,2,3 are dog engagement with 4 and 5 syncro I think there is some confusion here with straight/ helical cut gears, and syncro/ dog engagement. PPG also do a 1-4 gearset replacment, that gives you dog engagment on 1-4 but with helical gears, and you just retain your 5th and reverse.

[R32-GTS]

I found my series 1 33 box broke third stoopidly easily just a quick change into third and it was gone. The older R32gtr box seems to be holding up so far but is getting very noisy so i expect it to let go soon.

[B0BB0]

have many box's with 1,2 3 dog and helical cut in 4 and 5 in for quiter cruising

in a PPG 4th gear is quiet coz its 1 to 1.

[abflug]

Put in the OS box this week and will be testing over the weekend