The Great Dyno E-Doodle debate

[The Mafia]

well, if you want to be retarded then fine. Be wankers, it does not bother me. I love these cars, I simply don't just hand my car to some dude and do "make it go fast". I take the time and effort to research mods and find the best bang for buck.

I run 95 ron fuel, but if you bothered to read, and not be a spastic, you'd see that I was using Toluene to bring my octane up.

And if you bothered to read more of my posts, the standard turbo experiences I had are from a long time ago. I've since gone a bigger turbo and used water methanol injection.

Currently running 108mph, haven't had a chance to see what mph I will run with the water methanol.

Terminal speeds are and excellent judge on power, and thats what I have been looking at. With 210rwkw, I had 104mph. Seemed Fairly spot on.

Insult me all you like, I've done theresearch, played around, tried different things. You guy are the ones that seem to be all hung up on your dynos. I simply came here stating that a standard ecu WILL NOT make 190rwkw.

From my experience, 125rwkw seemed standard, with exhaust FMIC and boost, I made 140s, in which 20rwkw seemed fairly normal for that kind of upgrade. Then the powerfc, which allows you to get rid of those horrible AFRs.

If you ECU is chipped, its another story.

I never said that the 2 dynos that I use a right, I simply stated that they are a little more accurate than a dyno reading 190rwkw with a stock ECU.

but anyway, if you want to go all retarded and be smartasses, go for it.

another thing - where the hell are you pulling these power figures from?

"My exhaust made about 30rwkw"

???

How do you know that?

Edited July 17, 2006 by The Mafia

[justin911]

the reason everyone got so defensive is because you said you wont make more than 150kw without an aftermarket ecu...

[paulr33]

jono is in cairns with penis fuel on tap

you lot are in nsw and vic with good fuel on tap and normal ambient temps

[mad082]

well i'll see what sort of teminal speed i can get with my stock ecu, and then with my remapped ecu and compare them to yours.

[The Mafia]

jono is in cairns with penis fuel on tap

you lot are in nsw and vic with good fuel on tap and normal ambient temps

lol Mackay dude, the only place in QLD that doesn't have 98...

Jeez the water methanol makes a difference

[The Mafia]

well i'll see what sort of teminal speed i can get with my stock ecu, and then with my remapped ecu and compare them to yours.

interested to see. Do it.

[justin911]

if that was to me, i wasnt quoting you... just stating wat every other person on sau seems to get...

the fact of the matter is... your running differant petrol and your saying your dyno result is correct... everyone else who runs slightly better petrols is wrong.. because theres seems to make abit more...

unless the hole octane / power thing is a big conspiracy...

"My exhaust made about 30rwkw"

???

How do you know that?

[justin911]

there you just said then... as you said in your water/meth injection thread.. the higher octane seems to make a differance...

so how are you comparing your dyno runs with your fuel to everyone elses ??

Jeez the water methanol makes a difference

[The Mafia]

because when I was runing the standard turbo, I was using Toluene to bring my fuel up to the same level as 98ron...

Does anyone read, or just skim, and bag everyone out?

[justin911]

i havnt bagged anyone out or been rude/insulted or anything to that affect.

I've been quite civil actualy.. i was trying to do the hole discussion thing

your first post however started out by saying.... anyone who thinks blah blah "is full of shit"

[mad082]

I simply don't just hand my car to some dude and do "make it go fast"

i don't hand it to some dude. i have done EVERY mod to my car myself. i fitted my exhaust, i fitted my cooler, i pulled my gearbox out when the pivot bolt snapped, and i machined up a replacement. the only time i have handed the keys over was to do a power run.

Edited July 17, 2006 by mad082

[eMsta]

this is what i heard - the stock RWKW is between 130 & 140. The after market exhaust can add anywhere from something like 8rwkw to upto 30rwkws (depending on the type/brand). But i think what hasnt been taken into account the different environments - there was something that i read about that (i think).

Mad082 - your right, handing over your car to some dude, always ends up bad (as i found out with a certain business) grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[smurf80]

I have read posts and topics by the mafia before and have found his info to be very useful. If you dont know what im talking about have a look at the in depth thread on his turbo swap.

I think alot of you are quick to bite on statements etc that are said without sitting down and thinking out your replys.

My thoughts are everyone knows that the standard ecu on the 33 is probably the most retarded ecu ever and to get decent power figures out of your car it is an important modification that is as common as an intercooler upgrade these days.

As many have stated dynos are a tuning tool to test the increases/decreases in power from the mods you have purchased and to see if the money was spent wisely. I think everyone can agree that the power figures given shouldnt be taken as gospel.

Cheers

Chris

[wolverine]

i understand that there is about 60kw loss thru car drivetrain and dyno. (at least that has been the quoted figure from SK and other smarter people here over the years)

if 189kw is the factory quoted power figure then 130rwkw would be a fair number on the dyno allowing for age of the car, the fuel and any other variables like dirty afm's, airfilters etc might knock the number down some.

so 125rwkw seems a reasonable number if losses are 60kw.

if the losses are a little less then 130-140rwkw sounds fair too.

[illusiVe]

my R34 has 180rwkw stock exhaust, 9 psi and pod.

just adding feedback

[mad082]

so 125rwkw seems a reasonable number if losses are 60kw.

if the losses are a little less then 130-140rwkw sounds fair too

exactly right. where the argument started was with themafia saying that they are 125kw, no higher because thats what he dyno'd at. he didn't take into account the fact that there mat be cars out there in better condition, that his dyno might be a bit lazy. he just said that is the figure in a 'i'm right, you're wrong' way.

[Birnie]

I'd be happy to volunteer my car to do a Power FC/Stand ECU comparison if there's someone nearby who'll gimme 2 free runs on a 'real' dyno

I won't change a thing appart from the ECU so we could have a direct comparison on power gains and also see how off my 190 was with the Nissan ECU.

(I beleive i won't loose my FC tune if power is disconnected??)

[paulr33]

yu wont loose your tune if you unplug but the powerfc, but there is little point. ive posted it up a few times

having xyz brand ecu vs stock ecu proves nothing. they will both make power. having xyz brand ecu is only as good as the tune thats on it. so what if the stock ecu makes 180rwkw in one peak spot. so what if the xyz brand makes 185rwkw in the same peak spot. its simply max power in any one spot and that is not realy helpful. it wont guage how fast a car is on the street. too many are caught up with max power.

most people when they get their car back talk about how much it made, no one mentions average power. no one talks about the power curve or response. most (even i used to) just say it made xyz rwkw and thats all thats important

various comparisons across various dynos is somewhat useful but if its not locked in shootout mode then there can be any number of variances in the result. agian the operator just does what he feels is right (a lot do) and dont follow the guidlines again the power level is altered. simply having the bonnet open or closed can greatly affect the power output. take the values as a useful back to back comparison for the same car each time or like on a dyno day but comparing across dynos in states etc probably isnt that useful. like compare drag 1/4 miles. weather, temperature, track temp, wind speed and so on all affect the results. heck look my my recent heathcote results 105mph @ 13.75. looking at wsid average run of the mills runs 105 is 13 flat so the results do get skewed and affected by environment.

the only time i would see dyno compares useful (as in 100% useful) if i could guarantee the shootout mode procedures were followed at workshop xyz for car abc and my mate goes to workshop 123 with his car which is qwe and his tuner follows the procedure spot on as well. only then i would say its an even playing field and the results are as dyno dynamics intended them to be, useful for comparison.

[paulr33]

sorry i think im confused, what are we actually debating? its not clear

[mad082]

ok well if you are finished making everyone dumber for reading that post, if birnie goes and does a power run on both pfc and stock ecu and then plots the graph against each other then we could see how much it makes all over the graph. not just peak power. and what you said about top speed at the drags is crap. e.t is usually determined by how well the driver can launch, but top speed is less dependent on it. i have a mate that got a 12.56 at 104mph, and another who got a low 13 at 91mph. time shows driver ability, and a bit of car performance. speed shows a bit of driver ability and a lot of a cars power.

and if you don't know what we are debating, then don't post.