Gym And Supplement Discussion

[TTT]

The guys from PTC Brisbane are planning on doing one deadlift session at a franchise gym on international Chest night (Monday).

There will be 6 guys who are planning on doing their final strength test a week or so before the comp. They have all pulled over 300kg during their last comp.

Will wait for vids.

Should be a good laugh.

[The Bogan]

That will be priceless.

[Mitcho_7]

Seems odd theyd go somewhere that may not have a deadlift bar, let alone a decent bar at all, to do a heavy deadlift session. I feel they will annoy many people by stealing all the weight plates and may even get kicked out...

[bozodos]

The guys from PTC Brisbane are planning on doing one deadlift session at a franchise gym on international Chest night (Monday).

There will be 6 guys who are planning on doing their final strength test a week or so before the comp. They have all pulled over 300kg during their last comp.

Will wait for vids.

Should be a good laugh.

April Fools?

I like OHP, I think it carries over more into daily life than almost any other lift apart from deadlift, or farmer's walk. It does require more skill than you might think, as I found out the hard way initially. Can either do a slight start with the knees, or not, I do so on heavier reps (as per Rippetoe's method). I also find it a lot more explosive than shoulder press.

Not a huge fan of Elliot Hulse anymore - he seemed to have some good insights, then seemed to spiral more and more into pseudo science, TL;DR rants about nothing, and filler videos.

[Birds]

The guys from PTC Brisbane are planning on doing one deadlift session at a franchise gym on international Chest night (Monday).

There will be 6 guys who are planning on doing their final strength test a week or so before the comp. They have all pulled over 300kg during their last comp.

Will wait for vids.

Should be a good laugh.

Would almost extend my stay in Brisbane to see this. Speaking of, might go visit PTC Brisbane while I'm up there over the next couple days.

[Birds]

I like angry at garbage man Elliott, not yell for 2 minutes channeling your man juice Elliott.

[Dajae]

haha I love Elliot!

I used to do decline bench, incline bench and shoulder press, so I'd like to add something back in to help develop my upper body strength the exercises my program currently has in it is bench, squats, deadlifts, lat pulldown and abs.

If you're after more rounded out upper body strength, considering exchanging the lat pull downs for some kind of rowing movement. Good recovery? Maybe just add them in.. Reduce the volume on both a tad and adjust from there. If it were me though, I'd take out the lat pull downs, and replace with one arm dumbbell rows (ala 'Kroc Row' style or similar supported style) and seated cable rows. A lot of people knock the cable rows, but if done correctly, can be really beneficial to scapular health, shoulder stability, and back strength. Why no bent over rows? Squats + deadlifts + bent over rows = lots of work for the lower back to handle.. best to keep it on the safe side.

Why not do both ohp and shoulder press?

Do barbell ohp in a 5/3/1 style or whatever you chose and then have shoulder pressing as an assistance exercise...

You can make 5/3/1 have more volume and still follow the same principles. Pretty sure the dude wrote about it in one of the 5/3/1 books

It comes down to personal preference and individual shoulder health and what your goals are. You can still get basically the same benefit from shoulder pressing as OHP's. Personally I'd rather do one then the other, cycling between the two exercises. But that's just me

My assistance exersises are my 4 main lifts but with a set and rep range of 5 x 10, lowered to a count of 3 held for 2 then explode up as fast as I can.

To many people in my opinion focus on every assistance exercise out there but not enough on the big compound moves, I am far from being the biggest unit in the gym but I am stronger than most of the big guys, strange but true, but then they do spend alot of time standing in front of the mirrors doing curls and checking their hair.

There is nothing I love more than sharing the rack with some big unit only to pull or push alot more weight than them, the looks on their faces is priceless, its like they are thinking " how is this little guy showing me up, doesn't he know I've got big biceps".

The looks from the women is also for the win, yes I am vain in that way, having some bird come up to you to show them how to squat can be a extremely fun task.

Agreed, compound movements should be the corner stone of every program. But to use the same movements as assistance work, IMHO.. is a bit of a waste. If you're putting all your effort in to those main lifts, then your assistance work should be just that... assisting, not repeating. Say your bench.. Great off the chest, but your lock out sucks. Does it make sense to keep doing the same movement for your assistance work? Or say do some board presses or close grip benching, to focus on your lock out? Which is assisting, and which is repeating? I'm not trying to sound rude, just trying to get my perspective across

Hahaha yeah that's always good... I might not be the most "vascular" guy in the gym, but squatting ATG 100kg for 20 reps always gets a few sideways glances. Not the strongest thing out there, but I'm happy with it :D bit of bird watching eh?

April Fools?

I like OHP, I think it carries over more into daily life than almost any other lift apart from deadlift, or farmer's walk. It does require more skill than you might think, as I found out the hard way initially. Can either do a slight start with the knees, or not, I do so on heavier reps (as per Rippetoe's method). I also find it a lot more explosive than shoulder press.

Not a huge fan of Elliot Hulse anymore - he seemed to have some good insights, then seemed to spiral more and more into pseudo science, TL;DR rants about nothing, and filler videos.

More so than the squat?! Although to be fair, I'd put deadlifts and squats tied for number 1, with farmers walk 2, some kind of OHP, and bicep curls (lol ) I'd argue that anything can be made explosive.. It's the force of the action that determines it's explosiveness, not the movement.. But, in saying that, I know what you mean... each to their own

I quite like his pseudo science stuff.. Done my own research into some of the topics he has discussed, and was quite impressed with what I found. I tend to take what the health ministries of the world say with a grain of salt. Just remember.. They all told us fats were bad. They all told us eggs were bad. They were the ones behind putting carbs as the main source of food on the so-called "food pyramid" .. Ha! What a load of crap. Back on point..

I like angry at garbage man Elliott, not yell for 2 minutes channeling your man juice Elliott.

Breathe in to your balls!!

[L33SH]

If you're after more rounded out upper body strength, considering exchanging the lat pull downs for some kind of rowing movement. Good recovery? Maybe just add them in.. Reduce the volume on both a tad and adjust from there. If it were me though, I'd take out the lat pull downs, and replace with one arm dumbbell rows (ala 'Kroc Row' style or similar supported style) and seated cable rows. A lot of people knock the cable rows, but if done correctly, can be really beneficial to scapular health, shoulder stability, and back strength. Why no bent over rows? Squats + deadlifts + bent over rows = lots of work for the lower back to handle.. best to keep it on the safe side.

Thanks for your advice, I'll see what my trainer says. I do the rowing machine for 10 mins before my weights as recommended by physio, but are you thinking of something different? I was doing seated cable row, before my injury... might add that back in.

[bozodos]

I suggest you read the current Government Health Guidelines - I was surprised when someone awared me to the fact that they do tend to keep up with the science.

dajae: I mean that it carries over in terms of picking up something heavy, and putting it overhead, maybe the clean and press is a better example.

[Birds]

Really, how often do you have to lift something over your head outside of the gym?

What are you donkey kong?

Deadlift and squats much more important than any press movement IMO. I doubt powerlifting would even include bench if they didn't need a test of upper body strength in the mix.

[bozodos]

you're telling me you never pick anything up and place it above your head?

I do it quite often in our storeroom - most of the empty shelving is above head height.

[Dajae]

Thanks for your advice, I'll see what my trainer says. I do the rowing machine for 10 mins before my weights as recommended by physio, but are you thinking of something different? I was doing seated cable row, before my injury... might add that back in.

Or the other option is pull ups. But rows are always awesome. No worries, hopefully it gave you a bit of a different perspective ^_^

Yeah something different.. You know that machine where a ton of guys will sit in it, put the weight pin allllllll the way down the bottom, then do these weird "monkey-humping-a-clothes-line" movements? Then drop the weight stack like they're king shit? That machine using a V-handle gives you great scapular retraction ability. Let me know how you go would be keen to see and hear how you benefit/don't benefit from rows after your injury.

I suggest you read the current Government Health Guidelines - I was surprised when someone awared me to the fact that they do tend to keep up with the science.

dajae: I mean that it carries over in terms of picking up something heavy, and putting it overhead, maybe the clean and press is a better example.

Yes, now they keep up with it. Too bad it wasn't like that 30 years ago! Lol. Even then, if you read in to it, a lot of the nutritional science community is easily swayed by certain things. A bit like how the excess of corn growers after WW2 in America caused a corn by-product explosion over there. Think your HFCS and corn oils. Both are horrible for the human body, in any form.

Haha yeah I know, I was just being cheeky

I'd have to say the clean and press would be a better example.. as it combines effectively the same motion. The only real issue I have with OHP's is that: strong bench = reasonably strong OHP.... strong OHP = strong OHP. The carry over backwards to the bench is basically not there. But that's just from my own personal experience and observation.

Don't get me wrong.. I love OHP's. I maxed out at 77.5kg just prior to my non-gym related back injury. Not heaps, but definitely enough to keep me happy.

Really, how often do you have to lift something over your head outside of the gym?

What are you donkey kong?

Deadlift and squats much more important than any press movement IMO. I doubt powerlifting would even include bench if they didn't need a test of upper body strength in the mix.

Aww man, I miss playing Donkey Kong with my little cousins. That shit was AWESOME.

I tend to agree. Deads and squats will give you enough all round size and strength that you wouldn't really need anything else. Who was it that said squats and cleans were enough? Poliquin or someone?

you're telling me you never pick anything up and place it above your head?

I do it quite often in our storeroom - most of the empty shelving is above head height.

WorkCover would have a field day in your storeroom! Damn fun police they are.

But in all seriousness... If you can lift something heavy off the ground, and put it above your head, you're doing something right.

Lifting heavy shit in general is doing something right

[L33SH]

Or the other option is pull ups. But rows are always awesome. No worries, hopefully it gave you a bit of a different perspective ^_^

Yeah something different.. You know that machine where a ton of guys will sit in it, put the weight pin allllllll the way down the bottom, then do these weird "monkey-humping-a-clothes-line" movements? Then drop the weight stack like they're king shit? That machine using a V-handle gives you great scapular retraction ability. Let me know how you go would be keen to see and hear how you benefit/don't benefit from rows after your injury.

err I dont watch other people at the gym, what machine are you talking about?

[Dajae]

err I dont watch other people at the gym, what machine are you talking about?

Yeah, me neither

So they generally look something like this:

http://www.fitnessscape.com/page/F/PROD/selectorized_machines/cable_row

But the weight stack can be a little different look.. but the idea is the same.. sitting down, feet up and supported, pulley in a low position in front of you.

[L33SH]

Yeah, me neither

So they generally look something like this:

http://www.fitnessscape.com/page/F/PROD/selectorized_machines/cable_row

But the weight stack can be a little different look.. but the idea is the same.. sitting down, feet up and supported, pulley in a low position in front of you.

oh you just mean seated cable row, yeah I used to do them.

[TTT]

I feel they will annoy many people by stealing all the weight plates and may even get kicked out...

Leesh - Have you tried inverted rows?

Have a google.. there are articles and videos.

I found that doing it with hands at same width as when benching and bring your chest up to bar at same spot as when you bench works really well for upper back strength.

[L33SH]

Leesh - Have you tried inverted rows?

Have a google.. there are articles and videos.

I found that doing it with hands at same width as when benching and bring your chest up to bar at same spot as when you bench works really well for upper back strength.

No I haven't, do you use overhand grip for this or underhand?

[Dajae]

No I haven't, do you use overhand grip for this or underhand?

It doesn't matter too much which you use, however it would probably be more 'additive' if you were to constantly use both grips, to achieve a similar yet different stimulus. By changing the grip, you illicit tension in a wider range of muscles to a greater degree, giving you more rounded off strength and development.

Some people find it hard to do inverted rows, depending on their current strength levels. But there are a couple of ways to create 'progressions' in the exercise so you can progress and grow more steadily.. Usually by having your feet lower than your head (in the starting "hang" position") tends to be the best way.. Start with quite a margin, and constantly work your way through the progressions by lessening the distance that your feet are lower than your head.. until you're finally at the stage where your feet are inline with the bar/rings that you're holding.

Let me find a video for you

[TTT]

Same grip as bench.

basically, instead of bringing the bar to your chest and pressing up in a bench press, you are pulling your chest to the bar and lowering yourself back down with control.

try to follow the exact path your elbows would take as if you were benching etc.

[L33SH]

cheers!