[Closed] Borg Warner Efr Series Turbos

[Sub Boy32]

Haha! I know, one day maybe the 1.05a/r twin ext gates......

[Lithium]

Yeah it would be interesting to see how much more it can give if you did that! Not that it sounds like it is that disappointing a drive

[reaper]

Yeah I went the 1.05 rear with ewg because I was worried about boost control. Lets just hope its not too laggy on a 2.6!

[Full-Race Geoff]

Grrrr! Backpressure!

One day I will get around to putting some exh sensors on to find why I can't squeeze any more than 20psi out of my 8374......E85 and 40psi, now that would be fun! Haha

Chris - i just began testing the turbosmart IWG on a built subaru with EFR 7670 0.92 that couldnt hold more than 26-27psi previously -- the turbosmart worked perfectly with their high boost 26psi spring.

Look at the bottom of each chart, to see wg duty maps:

22psi:

25 psi

i know what i will be trying next on my RB26 0.92

Yeah I went the 1.05 rear with ewg because I was worried about boost control. Lets just hope its not too laggy on a 2.6!

8374 1.05 is far from laggy! 1bar boost by 3500rpm and still north of 700hp, its my favorite turbo ive had on my RB26 so far

whilst the IWG on these is game changing its a tall order to ask 600whp from.

the iwg is not what limits top end power, its the turbine housing A/R ratio

With a 50mm EWG I believe 380 is reasonable.

Keep us updated.

the EWG will not change drive pressure ratios, since there is no change to a/r

[discopotato03]

I'm going to start another thread specifically about the due to be released EFR 7163 . Many have waited a long time for this turbocharger because it promises so much and fingers crossed it will deliver .

A .

[Skepticism]

I'm going to start another thread specifically about the due to be released EFR 7163 . Many have waited a long time for this turbocharger because it promises so much and fingers crossed it will deliver .

A .

Waiting for SR20 results btw

Edited November 28, 2013 by Skepticism

[Sub Boy32]

Hi Geoff,

Have you got any details on the TurboSmart IWG? Is it a dual port?

[Nee-san]

So what are we thinking then, BW 8374 0.92 IWG on BP98? (using full race manifold)

Realistic figures for a built but standard displacement RB26, I can't get freakin' Matchbot to work on my handset ATM! (On a dynojet)

The turbo looks the gear certainly, but I am just a little bit concerned of possible lagginess coming from twins, I know the engine can handle 2 Bar/ ~29Psi no worries.

I only want a legit 400KW ATW and therefore want the best possible drive-ability for this power level.

Geoff or Lith, anyone got any ideas?

Edited November 28, 2013 by Nee-san

[Sub Boy32]

So what are we thinking then, BW 8374 0.92 IWG on BP98? (using full race manifold)

Realistic figures for a built but standard displacement RB26, I can't get freakin' Matchbot to work on my handset ATM! (On a dynojet)

The turbo looks the gear certainly, but I am just a little bit concerned of possible lagginess coming from twins, I know the engine can handle 2 Bar/ ~29Psi no worries.

I only want a legit 400KW ATW and therefore want the best possible drive-ability for this power level.

Geoff or Lith, anyone got any ideas?

Well I run a 8374 0.92 IWG on BP98 but on a built RB30 and it turns out 460KW ATW on a Hub dyno at 20psi. I think on a RB26 you should see 400KW without too much drama.

I know I have 400cc more than you have, but I have much less lag than I had with -5's on a built RB26, it now has full boost by 3400rpm.....but even that figure doesn't do it justice, these things seem to spool from idle, the response is awesome!

[gmx]

Perhaps I missed it, but will the 7163 make it the B2 frame, TST4 production?

[GTScotT]

No suggestion it will at this stage.

Giving reasonable thought to the topic would lead me to think twin scroll may be difficult on the mixed flow turbine, not without unequal/biased division. In my mind it is a open housing specific turbine.

Am happy for BW to school me, though. It would only be even better I'm sure.

[bradsm87]

The 7163 comes in TS T4 0.80

[gmx]

I've found that option on some websites in order to purchase but no official spec sheets outlining things like dimensions, part numbers, model designations to cover but distinguish the 7163 lineup.

Seems like a tight-lipped affair.

Wonder if Geoff would enlighten us.

Edited December 2, 2013 by gmx

[Nee-san]

Chris - i just began testing the turbosmart IWG on a built subaru with EFR 7670 0.92 that couldnt hold more than 26-27psi previously -- the turbosmart worked perfectly with their high boost 26psi spring.

Look at the bottom of each chart, to see wg duty maps:

22psi:

25 psi

i know what i will be trying next on my RB26 0.92

8374 1.05 is far from laggy! 1bar boost by 3500rpm and still north of 700hp, its my favorite turbo ive had on my RB26 so far

the iwg is not what limits top end power, its the turbine housing A/R ratio

the EWG will not change drive pressure ratios, since there is no change to a/r

That sounds good, what would you expect the 0.92 divided to generate? using one of your manifolds.

[GTScotT]

The 7163 comes in TS T4 0.80

Where did you see that?

I must be going blind

[M@&k]

...

The new 7163 T4 twinscroll turbo is very impressive, although it is larger than your stated airflow requirements. it is available as 0.85 a/r singlescroll (iwg T25, iwg vband or ewg vband) and the 0.80 twinscroll T4 IWG. 7163 production is going on right now. We are not going to list them on our site until the reservation lists are filled (too many phone calls about them as it is), people on our reservation lists will be getting the turbos first, if you want to put your name down it doesnt cost anything we will contact you once they become available with an option to buy. thanks everyone for your patience still a few weeks away but its happening

....

if youre interested in the 7163 we will have details at the end of this week, pricing and availability. with regards to your gtx3071 it was on a .63 where our test was .82 a/r (for the sake of comparison to the EFR's .83 a/r)

I would expect the 7163 to have full boost long before 4000rpm. also most of the t4 twinscroll EFR turbos like 7064 or 7670 should also acheive that. The singlescroll might do it but it would be close

No T3 option apparently.

[GTScotT]

Shit, I misread that.

Wow. Such embarrassment.

[Lithium]

Fair enough, I hope to get mine done in 2 weeks. Im looking around the 380 mark. Thats with a 50mm ex gate but

Be sure to post results, by the way - what are the engine specs, and fuel ... again?

[Full-Race Geoff]

Hi Geoff,

Have you got any details on the TurboSmart IWG? Is it a dual port?

the turbosmart IWG uses very large coil-springs (looks like an EWG inside) and is currently available as single port only. dual port is being shown at PRI next week. im impressed thus far

So what are we thinking then, BW 8374 0.92 IWG on BP98? (using full race manifold)..The turbo looks the gear certainly, but I am just a little bit concerned of possible lagginess coming from twins, I know the engine can handle 2 Bar/ ~29Psi no worries. I only want a legit 400KW ATW and therefore want the best possible drive-ability for this power level. Geoff or Lith, anyone got any ideas?

if you are used to upgraded twins, the twinscroll EFR8374 gives up nothing. For your 400kw target it is easily achieved with conservative tuning and moderate boost. The 0.92 a/r nor the internal WG will present any restriction at this power level. EFR turbos are far from lazy or laggy *as long as its a proper twinscroll divided manifold* and the turbo should be 'on' by 3500rpm, full boost by 3600. this is still my all time favorite single-turbo that ive run on my personal rb26.

Well I run a 8374 0.92 IWG on BP98 but on a built RB30 and it turns out 460KW ATW on a Hub dyno at 20psi. I think on a RB26 you should see 400KW without too much drama.

I know I have 400cc more than you have, but I have much less lag than I had with -5's on a built RB26, it now has full boost by 3400rpm.....but even that figure doesn't do it justice, these things seem to spool from idle, the response is awesome!

Perhaps I missed it, but will the 7163 make it the B2 frame, TST4 production?

the new EFR7163 is a B1 frame only. Borg Warner is also releasing a new 0.80 TS T4 housing, specifically to fit the B1 size hub socket (behind the turbine wheel). this hub socket is much smaller than B2 size, so they are not cross-compatible

Giving reasonable thought to the topic would lead me to think twin scroll may be difficult on the mixed flow turbine, not without unequal/biased division. In my mind it is a open housing specific turbine. Am happy for BW to school me, though. It would only be even better I'm sure.

I initially made the same assumption, until they showed me in the lab that twinscroll absolutely does work with mixed flow! on our 3.5L ecoboost v6 ford engine, the twinscroll 7163 gets 20psi right around 2000rpm! thats just nutty... and hence why im dying to try the 7163 twinscroll on my 2.0L evo in a couple months

Edited December 4, 2013 by Full-Race Geoff

[Full-Race Geoff]

no official spec sheets outlining things like dimensions, part numbers, model designations to cover but distinguish the 7163 lineup. Seems like a tight-lipped affair. Wonder if Geoff would enlighten us.

the 7163 is borg warner's latest EFR release for 2014. It is based on the B1 frame, so it shares identical outer dimensions (silhouette) with the 6258 and 6758 turbos. Some unique features that set this apart from the other EFR's are that it uses a lightweight alloy bearing housing (watercooling mandatory), mixed flow turbine wheel (MFT) and aggressive compressor wheel blade aero which supports up to 60lb/min max compressor flow rate, with a broad surge margin - biased towards midrange/lowend torque and spool/response.

The 7163's are not yet listed on our site, because demand has been very high and supply is low (BW is shipping slowly, but they are shipping) Details will be listed on F-R.com sometime later this month... after PRI and once BW is on track with production. The (4) turbine housing options and variations of 7163 are:

-T25 inlet/vband outlet IWG 0.85 A/R singlescroll

-Vband inlet/outlet IWG 0.85 A/R singlescroll

-Vband inlet/outlet EWG 0.85 A/R singlescroll (im dying to run 2x on an R35)

-T4 twinscroll IWG 0.80 A/R