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Why Garrett?

SargeRX8

By SargeRX8,
in Engines & Forced Induction

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R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

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Have a look @ the results. They speak for themselves.

Whilst those turbos make the numbers at the top end, they are not as responsive onto boost, inbetween gears etc - and hence they are cheaper as their performance is not as good. So basically you end up with a mid-lower range that is not as good, slower car etc

Power delivery is generally not as linear either which results in wheelspin, slower car etc

Price wise also comes down to the parts they are made from. Bush/Journal bearing which is cheaper to manufacture than ball bearing turbos from people like Garrett/Billet/Precision etc.

If you want the best performance, and can afford the extra 600-800 for Garrett - do it. The turbo is the single most important part of any setup in terms of performance IMO as it's the thing that dictates how the car performs/responds and so on

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SargeRX8 Grand Master

SargeRX8

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I can understand that. Ive seen some interesting graphs from Holset and Kinugawa. They do use the Journal bearing but Ive read its just as reliable. Check that guys thread on the Kando turbo and it creates a nice line of power and comes on a little harder than an equiv Garrett. Precision Turbo are making some awesome turbos which are almost $800 cheaper than the Garrett equiv. I heard they also use Garrett internals, although I'm not sure on the source of that. I do know the Kando/Kinugawa turbo's use Garrett/Mitsu wheels coupled with Mitsu internals. I am still leaning to the Garrett as it does have the greatest piece of history behind it but if I can save money and get someone similar in performance, isn't that an option too?

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JKR-32 Proficient

JKR-32

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From what I've read about the precision turbos, they need quite a bit of boost wound into them to start making decent numbers. Plus they have a fairly open pitch on the exhaust wheel which means they are a little all or nothing from what I understand. Please correct me if I'm wrong people. That's just what I made of what I was reading.

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Shazza24 Proficient

Shazza24

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R31-Nismoid is right but Holset has been making turbos many years before kkk and kkr.

Failing all else Hyper Gear have some good options check them out also, just don't rush in like most people do because the wrong choice like before will make it regrettable. Talk to the people on here that have tried this stuff before via PM instead of leaving it open. I'm sure R31-Nismoid would be happy to recommend others to talk to if you asked him and from that glean an average in terms of your price range.

Providing that you know what you what in terms of general setup. (ie. Standard manifold, internal/external wastegate, and the list goes on.)

Edited by Shazza24
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R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

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I can understand that. Ive seen some interesting graphs from Holset and Kinugawa. They do use the Journal bearing but Ive read its just as reliable.

Links to this info & direct comparison?

I've seen nothing that tells me the other turbo's have better performance at all.

They come on top boost/power too sharply and later than the Garrett equiv (sometimes there is no equiv rated item, so granted its a bit hard).

The EFR series from BW also has good results too compared directly to Garrett and are the same pricing near enough. Only issue being a totally different flange pattern which makes choosing a BW turbo very expensive and committal as if you don't like it - its not just changing turbo, its the entire hot-side.

Yes the Kando etc items do make the power, I'm not arguing that at all and Simon did get some pretty good results when you consider the price - cant argue with the value. However if you want to argue about the performance, thats a different bucket of fish.

So it's as i said earlier. If you can afford - do so. If not, then don't. There is a difference, and i feel it's a important one for *most* setups people.

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islade Rising Star

islade

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I recently upgraded from a 249.9kw KKR560 to a 249.6kw GT3076... Yea, i upgraded to a -0.3kw overall difference.

However, the car is SIGNIFICANTLY faster, i hit boost so much sooner, so much more wheelspin, so much easier and more enjoyable to drive, no off-boost time between gears etc. I went with the 3076 because i have seen lots of positive results, so i knew it would work, whereas there are many other turbo's out there, but i can't be "guaranteed" to get a good result. And the dyno graph only tells 1/2 the story, so don't use those to compare :)

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SargeRX8 Grand Master

SargeRX8

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These are a direct comparison of a Kando turbo from Simon's thread and a GT3076R

SimonR32.jpg

Scradly.jpg

There is a noticable difference in coming onto power and the top end. Its hard to say really. The kando gives you about 44 more horses while the Garrett comes on a little quicker and more linear.

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GTScotT Grand Master

GTScotT

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I know I am going to get flamed, but can you please take a Hypergear into serious consideration.

The most recent update for the SS profile is on par with what you would want from a mid framed Garrett.

You have gone from trouble trying to piece together your setup to not being able to get a good turbo, whats next?

Stao will sell you a turbo that will bolt up to the factory location and factory flange that needs very little work to get running and can produce the results.

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HEKT1K Grand Master

HEKT1K

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There is a noticable difference in coming onto power and the top end. Its hard to say really. The kando gives you about 44 more horses while the Garrett comes on a little quicker and more linear.

Isn't Simon running ethanol and an ass load of boost? Not sure what the deal is with that 3076 in terms of boost and fuel, but i dare say there are some points of difference between the two setups

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t_revz Grand Master

t_revz

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simon got a 6 boost to cut down on mucking around as the compressor was so big. so it wasnt that cheap for him. he said it could be done on stock manifold but might have to trial different spacers etc. was 3076 on 6 boost or stock? and like Hektik said he is running E42.5

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Lithium Grand Master

Lithium

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Hard to say when you don't have a full mod list and boost level/fuel type taken into consideration. I suspect the Kando is running more boost as at 130kph (well before the GT3076R would be choking) the Kando turbo is making more power. At 110kph the GT3076R has 60whp more...

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R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

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Isn't Simon running ethanol and an ass load of boost? Not sure what the deal is with that 3076 in terms of boost and fuel, but i dare say there are some points of difference between the two setups

I believe E85 was used.

No doubt he will see this and confirm as I'm certain but not 100% confident.

But what you do NOT see on a dyno sheet, is how a turbo transitions up onto boost and so on.

I once had a 500-550hp T04E/T3 hybrid thing. I put on a GT30 - both at that point running 12psi and making around 220rwkw. The power delivery didn't look "overtly" different on a dyno sheet however on the street it was very noticeable in between gears and so on.

"Devil" being the operative word.

Ah indeed, it is such a tough decision at times as there is much for and much against.

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SargeRX8 Grand Master

SargeRX8

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Yeah he was actually running 26psi to create the same amount of power. Its not as efficient as the Garrett. I can see now what people mean.

I was also looking at hypergear and you can't deny their new stuff is pretty impressive.

I found a few gt3071 and 76's online but they don't use Garrett housings. They use ATP housings, but the Garrett CHRA. I guess Ill wait to see one pop up in for sale as $1800 is abit too much for me. I was gonna buy ruffles gt3071 setup but at the time I didn't have the funds. Money came a week too late :(

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