Jump to content
SAU Community

Why Garrett?

SargeRX8

By SargeRX8,
in Engines & Forced Induction

 Share

Recommended Posts

R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

Posted
Posted

Have a look @ the results. They speak for themselves.

Whilst those turbos make the numbers at the top end, they are not as responsive onto boost, inbetween gears etc - and hence they are cheaper as their performance is not as good. So basically you end up with a mid-lower range that is not as good, slower car etc

Power delivery is generally not as linear either which results in wheelspin, slower car etc

Price wise also comes down to the parts they are made from. Bush/Journal bearing which is cheaper to manufacture than ball bearing turbos from people like Garrett/Billet/Precision etc.

If you want the best performance, and can afford the extra 600-800 for Garrett - do it. The turbo is the single most important part of any setup in terms of performance IMO as it's the thing that dictates how the car performs/responds and so on

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694466
Share on other sites
SargeRX8 Grand Master

SargeRX8

Posted
  • Author
Posted

I can understand that. Ive seen some interesting graphs from Holset and Kinugawa. They do use the Journal bearing but Ive read its just as reliable. Check that guys thread on the Kando turbo and it creates a nice line of power and comes on a little harder than an equiv Garrett. Precision Turbo are making some awesome turbos which are almost $800 cheaper than the Garrett equiv. I heard they also use Garrett internals, although I'm not sure on the source of that. I do know the Kando/Kinugawa turbo's use Garrett/Mitsu wheels coupled with Mitsu internals. I am still leaning to the Garrett as it does have the greatest piece of history behind it but if I can save money and get someone similar in performance, isn't that an option too?

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694481
Share on other sites
JKR-32 Proficient

JKR-32

Posted
Posted

From what I've read about the precision turbos, they need quite a bit of boost wound into them to start making decent numbers. Plus they have a fairly open pitch on the exhaust wheel which means they are a little all or nothing from what I understand. Please correct me if I'm wrong people. That's just what I made of what I was reading.

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694489
Share on other sites
Shazza24 Proficient

Shazza24

Posted
Posted (edited)

R31-Nismoid is right but Holset has been making turbos many years before kkk and kkr.

Failing all else Hyper Gear have some good options check them out also, just don't rush in like most people do because the wrong choice like before will make it regrettable. Talk to the people on here that have tried this stuff before via PM instead of leaving it open. I'm sure R31-Nismoid would be happy to recommend others to talk to if you asked him and from that glean an average in terms of your price range.

Providing that you know what you what in terms of general setup. (ie. Standard manifold, internal/external wastegate, and the list goes on.)

Edited by Shazza24
Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694510
Share on other sites
R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

Posted
Posted

I can understand that. Ive seen some interesting graphs from Holset and Kinugawa. They do use the Journal bearing but Ive read its just as reliable.

Links to this info & direct comparison?

I've seen nothing that tells me the other turbo's have better performance at all.

They come on top boost/power too sharply and later than the Garrett equiv (sometimes there is no equiv rated item, so granted its a bit hard).

The EFR series from BW also has good results too compared directly to Garrett and are the same pricing near enough. Only issue being a totally different flange pattern which makes choosing a BW turbo very expensive and committal as if you don't like it - its not just changing turbo, its the entire hot-side.

Yes the Kando etc items do make the power, I'm not arguing that at all and Simon did get some pretty good results when you consider the price - cant argue with the value. However if you want to argue about the performance, thats a different bucket of fish.

So it's as i said earlier. If you can afford - do so. If not, then don't. There is a difference, and i feel it's a important one for *most* setups people.

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694574
Share on other sites
islade Rising Star

islade

Posted
Posted

I recently upgraded from a 249.9kw KKR560 to a 249.6kw GT3076... Yea, i upgraded to a -0.3kw overall difference.

However, the car is SIGNIFICANTLY faster, i hit boost so much sooner, so much more wheelspin, so much easier and more enjoyable to drive, no off-boost time between gears etc. I went with the 3076 because i have seen lots of positive results, so i knew it would work, whereas there are many other turbo's out there, but i can't be "guaranteed" to get a good result. And the dyno graph only tells 1/2 the story, so don't use those to compare :)

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694815
Share on other sites
SargeRX8 Grand Master

SargeRX8

Posted
  • Author
Posted

These are a direct comparison of a Kando turbo from Simon's thread and a GT3076R

SimonR32.jpg

Scradly.jpg

There is a noticable difference in coming onto power and the top end. Its hard to say really. The kando gives you about 44 more horses while the Garrett comes on a little quicker and more linear.

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694902
Share on other sites
GTScotT Grand Master

GTScotT

Posted
Posted

I know I am going to get flamed, but can you please take a Hypergear into serious consideration.

The most recent update for the SS profile is on par with what you would want from a mid framed Garrett.

You have gone from trouble trying to piece together your setup to not being able to get a good turbo, whats next?

Stao will sell you a turbo that will bolt up to the factory location and factory flange that needs very little work to get running and can produce the results.

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694921
Share on other sites
HEKT1K Grand Master

HEKT1K

Posted
Posted

There is a noticable difference in coming onto power and the top end. Its hard to say really. The kando gives you about 44 more horses while the Garrett comes on a little quicker and more linear.

Isn't Simon running ethanol and an ass load of boost? Not sure what the deal is with that 3076 in terms of boost and fuel, but i dare say there are some points of difference between the two setups

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694943
Share on other sites
t_revz Grand Master

t_revz

Posted
Posted

simon got a 6 boost to cut down on mucking around as the compressor was so big. so it wasnt that cheap for him. he said it could be done on stock manifold but might have to trial different spacers etc. was 3076 on 6 boost or stock? and like Hektik said he is running E42.5

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5694983
Share on other sites
Lithium Grand Master

Lithium

Posted
Posted

Hard to say when you don't have a full mod list and boost level/fuel type taken into consideration. I suspect the Kando is running more boost as at 130kph (well before the GT3076R would be choking) the Kando turbo is making more power. At 110kph the GT3076R has 60whp more...

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5695085
Share on other sites
R31Nismoid Grand Master

R31Nismoid

Posted
Posted

Isn't Simon running ethanol and an ass load of boost? Not sure what the deal is with that 3076 in terms of boost and fuel, but i dare say there are some points of difference between the two setups

I believe E85 was used.

No doubt he will see this and confirm as I'm certain but not 100% confident.

But what you do NOT see on a dyno sheet, is how a turbo transitions up onto boost and so on.

I once had a 500-550hp T04E/T3 hybrid thing. I put on a GT30 - both at that point running 12psi and making around 220rwkw. The power delivery didn't look "overtly" different on a dyno sheet however on the street it was very noticeable in between gears and so on.

"Devil" being the operative word.

Ah indeed, it is such a tough decision at times as there is much for and much against.

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5695193
Share on other sites
SargeRX8 Grand Master

SargeRX8

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Yeah he was actually running 26psi to create the same amount of power. Its not as efficient as the Garrett. I can see now what people mean.

I was also looking at hypergear and you can't deny their new stuff is pretty impressive.

I found a few gt3071 and 76's online but they don't use Garrett housings. They use ATP housings, but the Garrett CHRA. I guess Ill wait to see one pop up in for sale as $1800 is abit too much for me. I was gonna buy ruffles gt3071 setup but at the time I didn't have the funds. Money came a week too late :(

Link to comment
https://www.sau.com.au/forums/topic/355767-why-garrett/#findComment-5695214
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing


  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • MBS206
      Mistakes were made, my R34 Story

      By MBS206 · Posted

      All I hear is ROADTRIP!
    • sunsetR33
      Unpeeling the Orange

      By sunsetR33 · Posted

      Update 3: Hi all It's been a while. Quite a lot of things happened in the meantime, among other things the car is (almost) back together and ready to be started again. Things that I fixed or changed: Full turbo removal, fitting back the OEM turbo oil hardlines. Had to do quite a bit of research and parts shopping to get every last piece that I need and make it work with the GT2860 turbos, but it does work and is not hard to do. Proves that the previous owner(s) just did not want to. While I was there I set the preload for the wastegates to 0,9bar to hopefully make it easier for the tuner to hit the 370hp I need for the legal inspections that will follow later on. Boost can always go up if necessary. Fitted a AN10 line from the catch can to the intake hose to make the catchcan and hopefully the cam covers a slight vacuum to have less restrictive oil returns from the head and not have mud build up as harshly in the lines and catch can. Removed the entire front interior just shy of the dashboard itself to clean up some of the absolutely horrendous wiring, (hopefully) fix the bumpy tacho and put in LED bulbs while I was there. Also put in bulbs where there was none before, like the airbag one. I also used that chance to remove the LED rpm gauge on the steering column, which was also wired in absolute horror show fashion. Moved the 4in1 Prosport gauge from sitting in front of the OEM oil pressure gauge to the center console vents, I used a 3D printed vent piece to hold that gauge there. The HKB steering wheel boss was likely on incorrectly as I sometimes noticed the indicator reset being uneven for left vs. right. In the meantime also installed an airbag delete resistor, as one should. Installed Cube Speed premium short shifter. Feels pretty nice, hope it'll work great too when I actually get to drive. Also put on a fancy Dragon Ball shift knob, cause why not. My buddy was kind enough to weld the rust hole in the back, it was basically rusted through in the lowermost corner of the passenger side trunk area where the wheel arch, trunk panel and rear quarter all meet. Obviously there is still a lot of crustiness in various areas but as long as it's not rusted out I'll just treat and isolate the corrosion and pretend it's not there. Also had to put down a new ground wire for the rear subframe as the original one was BARELY there. Probably a bit controversial depending on who you ask about this... but I ended up just covering the crack in the side of the engine block, the one above the oil feed, with JB Weld. I used a generous amount and roughed up the whole area with a Dremel before, so I hope this will hold the coolant where it should be for the foreseeable future. Did a cam cover gasket job as the half moons were a bit leaky, and there too one could see the people who worked on this car before me were absolute tools. The same half moons were probably used like 3 times without even cleaning the old RTV off. Dremeled out the inside of the flange where the turbine housing mates onto the exhaust manifolds so the diameter matches, as the OEM exhaust manifolds are even narrower than the turbine housings as we all know. Even if this doesn't do much, I had them out anyways, so can't harm. Ideally one would port-match both the turbo and the manifold to the gasket size but I really didn't feel up to disassembling the turbine housings. Wrapped turbo outlet dumps in heat wrap band. Will do the frontpipe again as well as now the oil leak which promted me to tear apart half the engine in the first place is hopefully fixed. Fitted an ATI super damper to get rid of the worn old harmonic balancer. Surely one of the easiest and most worth to do mods. But torquing that ARP bolt to spec was a bitch without being able to lock the flywheel. Did some minor adjustments in the ECU tables to change some things I didn't like, like the launch control that was ALWAYS active. Treated rusty spots and surface corrosion on places I could get to and on many spots under the car, not pretty or ideal but good enough for now. Removed the N1 rear spats and the carbon surrounding for the tailpipe to put them back on with new adhesive as the old one was lifting in many spots, not pretty. Took out the passenger rear lamp housing... what do you know. Amateur work screwed me again here as they were glued in hard and removing it took a lot of force, so I broke one of the housing bolts off. And when removing the adhesive from the chassis the paint came right off too. Thankfully all the damaged area won't be visible later, but whoever did the very limited bodywork on this car needs to have their limbs chopped off piece by piece.   Quite a list if I do say so myself, but a lot of time was spent just discovering new shit that is wrong with the car and finding a solution or parts to fix it. My last problem that I now have the headache of dealing with is that the exhaust studs on the turbo outlets are M10x1.25 threaded, but the previous owner already put on regular M10 nuts so the threads are... weird. I only found this out the hard way. So now I will just try if I can in any way fit the front pipe regardless, if not I'll have to redo the studs with the turbos installed. Lesson learned for the future: Redo ALL studs you put your hands on, especially if they are old and the previous owners were inept maniacs. Thanks for reading if you did, will update when the engine runs again. Hope nothing breaks or leaks and I can do a test drive.
    • Kapr
      What brakes on R34 GTT(Europe)

      By Kapr · Posted

      No those pads are DBA too  but they have colors too. I look at the and imo the green "street" are the best.
    • wizlb
      Who has a Infiniti Q60, Q50 (V37)?

      By wizlb · Posted

      I’m not sure what happened I told them about sonic tunes free OTS tune and the next the I know .. I was booted..   To funny 
    • Kinkstaah
      Starting again

      By Kinkstaah · Posted

      Yea - I mean I've seen my fuel pump which is decades old and uh, while I'm not saying this with real knowledge... but I sure get the ick at using anything in the fuel system that produced the state of that pump. Many years ago I went through multiple pumps (and strainers) before I dropped the tank to clean it out with extreme violence. I'm talking the car would do maybe 50km before coming to a halt, which resulted in me cleaning out the filter with some brake cleaner and going on my way. None of my stuff ever looked like what came out of your fuel tank. I don't think I'd be happy with it unless every single component was replaced (or at least checked/cleaned/confirmed to be clean here).
×
×
  • Create New...