Gym And Supplement Discussion

[Tangles]

no knees literally, in every sense of the word (dbl patellectomy + tibial tuberosity transfers).

most I can 'physically' squat is like 1/10th the way down.

wedged patella tendons through the tibia just wont support body weight

squats are out of the question, and deadlifts really make my legs try to 'collapse' in at the kneejoint during the lift.

while I understand these basic exercises, plus a couple others (pullups, dips,) are the backbone to making gains, in my particular case it just doesnt seem worth it (risk, that is).

hence calf raise, ham curl, lightish leg etxn, leg press if the tendons arnt black and bruised ;p

[-FIGJAM-]

just getting back to Marcos's post.

Whilst I understand the point he is making and don't disagree with it.

But his info is a little off. A quick google turned out that Clancy Ross won all the things he spoke of in the 1940s. Anabolic Steroids were first synthesised in 1930. Now there is no evidence that says he was using steroids, but there is a strong possibility that he was on them.

Only reason I bring this up is because i am a little anal about the details. I didn't look at all the others though.

*Edit: In regards to Max and his 3 liters of milk a day. How many protein shakes was he having per day when he went off the milk and lost strength? I only say this because milk is full of fats and calories as well as some protein. 3 liters depending on the brand is around 1800 calories, the protein i take with water is around 130 calories. Only ask because (with my limited knowledge and please correct me if i am wrong) but in regards to lifting big numbers more calories from decent food sources help gain strength, have seen this with myself to some degree but with my cousin mostly. When he goes on a bulk diet his strength goes through the roof, the moment he cuts it drops.

Again, I agree with the point of the article. Eat well, train hard gains the results, there is no magic pill

Edited October 25, 2012 by -FIGJAM-

[TTT]

He has no knees.

He had them removed at the same time as having a vagina grafted...

Tangles - Can you ride a bike at all?

Edited October 25, 2012 by TTT

[Birds]

Tangles and jangles?

I'm guessing you can't do lunges...can you walk or run with a heavy weight? E.g. Weighted backpack, dumbells in hand or barbell across your back? These will activate quad without (I hope) stressing your knee joints too much.

Squats are essential for big weights and development, but you can still make decent gains without them.

[TM7GTR]

Your body isnt going to be digesting a steak you ate before, when you are working out... Your body will go into sympathetic nervous system arousal which will divert most of the blood flow from the GI tract and slow digestion. When the amino acids are already in free form they are going to be alot more easily absorbed because they dont need to be broken down anywhere near as much so they will get into your system quickly(despite the limited digestive activity).

They arent meant to replace good nutrition throughout the day by any means, they are just a supplement to use around your workout time. Leucine is a good muscle protein synthesis stimulator, so having it readily available around the time of your session is going to be adventageous in reducing skeletal muscle catabolism.

No, your body won't be digesting the steak you ate before, but the protein source you ate many hours before is already broken down into these "free form" aminos.

Although workouts are the most catabolic period of your day, catabolism as a whole is a bit of a laugh when people think it's serious enough that you'll start to waste away in a few hours.

If anything, I would be worried about carb intake post workout as this will aid in the increased insulin response by the body to carry post workout protein to the muscles.

But then again, all of this is just a bit of a laugh if you look deeper into the science of energy production in the body from food sources, and the lactic acid & ATP-PCr energy systems in particular (think regeneration.. )

[NickR33]

no knees literally, in every sense of the word (dbl patellectomy + tibial tuberosity transfers).

most I can 'physically' squat is like 1/10th the way down.

wedged patella tendons through the tibia just wont support body weight

I still can't get over the fact a surgeon took your knees... I have no idea how you train at all let alone still manage to train legs... all the bro curlers should die of shame watching you do leg press

[markos]

Fig Jam, the Russians started using a crude form of Test for lifters in 1954

Dr John Zeigler, after talking to the Russians, decided it was too harsh, so he came up with Dianobol, the first ever steroid, test is a hormone

It was first given to Bill March around 1960. Bill blew up in size, and because no one knew about it (D Bol) back then, Hoffman used Bill March to sell programs

Bill was a weightlifter, they all were, but he started to look like a bodybuilder. Zeigler would only give him one tab a day (50mg) I think, and he would make him drive to his office every day for another one. He didnt trust athletes.

On his death bed, Dr John Zeigler announced he regretted what he started and was disappointed at the abuse of steroids.

So if your anal about details, surely you knew that Dianobol, the first steroid, was created until 1958 by Dr John Zeigler

The first documented use of hormones (testotserone) by lifters is the Russian weightlifting team in 1954 and the 1956 Olympics, of which they didnt deny.

Zeigler sold the rights to D Bol to Ciba for $50. Ciba havent made D Bol for decades.

[markos]

I use wendlers 531 program to train with. you know enough here haha

I started off training for 5 months, using the 531

Learnt deads, squats and military's from scratch.

After that I ended up with

Bench 1.69

Deads 2.46

Squats 1.97

Military 1.05

cycling carbs and fats, fasting for 16 feeding for 8

Saying they can't eat now, that's probably an issue because my pwo is up around 2000kcal. Took me a week or two to get used to this, round an hour to eat it. Now I inhale food. Ate 3x more food to lose 10kg fat.

The science behind it also is that, a carb is a carb. So if you need a supp, cereal, desserts.

on my non gym days I eat more fats and don't intentionally eat carbs.

Typical gym day for me is 200 P, 370C, 90F

Off days are I just cut carbs and eat fattier meats.

I only train for around 4 hours a week.

it's commonly used to get lean muscle, I'm 10kg lighter and still gaining strength.

I've gained 3kg since I originally lost the fat. And am leaner still.

I eat 'dirty' foods with no guilt

Thanks for the response big guy, it lets me analyze if the way we do it is good/better. Unfortunately you use bodyweight %, which are useless, and why formulas are used in lifting, as lighter guy do better on that because bigger guys have more bone, which doesnt lift weight. Anyway, I'll work with I've got.

I'll just use members of my family, as I know exactly what and how often they eat

Jesse, 18, 70kg, 6 meals a day, protein, carb, fat in each meal

Max, 20, 86kg, 7-8 meals a day, protein every meal, carb and fat in most

Nina, 47, 57kg, 5 meals a day, protein, mimimal carbs, fat in each meal

Jesse squat 165kg@70kg - 2.35%

Max squat 250kg@86kg - 2.90%

Nina squat 125kg@57kg - 2.19%

You...................................1.97%

Jesse deadlift 195kg@70kg - 2.78%

Max deadlift 250kg@86kg - 2.90%

Nina deadlift 142.5kg@56kg - 2.50%

You.......................................2.46%

Jesse bench 110kg@70kg - 1.57%

Max bench 155kg@86kg - 1.80%

Nina bench 77.5kg@57kg - 1.35%

You......................................1.69%

Military press, Max and Jesse do over bodyweight, Nina can only do 50kg

So while your way appears to be doing okay for you, I cant see anything that would make me switch from what we've been doing. Jesse has only just started to lift seriously, he's a basketballer who plays his last ever game on Sunday, he'll be competing in PL next year so I imagine his progress will soar. He powercleaned 90kg@64kg and 17yo, he was training differently then.

And next time, if you ever want to compare on here or with mates in the gym, use this

http://www.ptcfrankston.com/glossbrennercalculator.html

Its designed simply for weight training

Cheers

[jangles]

Thanks for the response big guy, it lets me analyze if the way we do it is good/better. Unfortunately you use bodyweight %, which are useless, and why formulas are used in lifting, as lighter guy do better on that because bigger guys have more bone, which doesnt lift weight. Anyway, I'll work with I've got.

I'll just use members of my family, as I know exactly what and how often they eat

Jesse, 18, 70kg, 6 meals a day, protein, carb, fat in each meal

Max, 20, 86kg, 7-8 meals a day, protein every meal, carb and fat in most

Nina, 47, 57kg, 5 meals a day, protein, mimimal carbs, fat in each meal

Jesse squat 165kg@70kg - 2.35%

Max squat 250kg@86kg - 2.90%

Nina squat 125kg@57kg - 2.19%

You...................................1.97%

Jesse deadlift 195kg@70kg - 2.78%

Max deadlift 250kg@86kg - 2.90%

Nina deadlift 142.5kg@56kg - 2.50%

You.......................................2.46%

Jesse bench 110kg@70kg - 1.57%

Max bench 155kg@86kg - 1.80%

Nina bench 77.5kg@57kg - 1.35%

You......................................1.69%

Military press, Max and Jesse do over bodyweight, Nina can only do 50kg

So while your way appears to be doing okay for you, I cant see anything that would make me switch from what we've been doing. Jesse has only just started to lift seriously, he's a basketballer who plays his last ever game on Sunday, he'll be competing in PL next year so I imagine his progress will soar. He powercleaned 90kg@64kg and 17yo, he was training differently then.

And next time, if you ever want to compare on here or with mates in the gym, use this

http://www.ptcfrankston.com/glossbrennercalculator.html

Its designed simply for weight training

Cheers

Cheers, I never was comparing to anyone on here or lifters, just saying IF for me works and from everything I've read, my gains are high for 5 months of training.

Thanks for pointing out my squats lack too haha! I already knew that.

I'm also not training for anything in particular, I just do an eating protocol and progression program at the gym, nothing serious about it.

Many ways to skin a cat. and I know you know more than I ever will, youre one of the best in the business, which is why I was confused at you asking about it, now I see why.

Edited October 26, 2012 by jangles

[byebye]

Some people just don't have time for 6-8 meals around work, for example I got called out yesterday before afternoon meal, was still lying in the mud til past dinner time, you can't just get up and say sorry mate just going to stop, wash myself and eat while the driver is sitting there waiting to go! I still got all my Macros in for that day though.

[Mitcho_7]

Markos, what rep range do your lifters train in on the big 3 and supporting lifts to get such high 1rm's?

Edited October 26, 2012 by Mitcho_7

[markos]

Bye bye, youre correct, and I have slogans on my wall for every situation. I could pick a few for your situation, but I'll keep it nice

Mitch, when they do PPP, its 5's down to triples, doubles, singles

If doing linear progression, we start at 10's and work down to our openers the week before the comp

We use Bill Starr's 5 x 5 off season or GVT (10x10 - 1m rest)

Not one lifter here, or any of the 16 that went to Worlds, have had any success with 5-3-1, some use Sheiko, Westside, Shmolov

20 rep squats

bodyweight benching for reps

It really depends on what part of our training cycle were on, but we've tried most things, we keep what works and discard the rest.

Max recently wrote out a linear progression program for Alen. Alen totaled 570kg at Nats in June, he should go over 620kg in November at ProRawFour

It was a 10 week program. Recent lifts this week were 230kg squat and 150kg bench. He's attempting 240kg deadlift tonight.

So even though his program started with highish reps, it was always strength focused, he started at sets of 10

[markos]

BoJangles, you should post up your bodyweight and lifts because the Glossbrenner calculator may favour you more

[Tangles]

No Birds, cant run, cant lunge.

Add to that I try not to carry too much 'weight' as the legs arnt all that stable.

Long lever joints (2 metres tall) and no knees isnt good, lol

Not much else I can do bar what I mentioned previously I guess. Oh, and T-man, riding f**ks me up, hahaha!

all's good.

[markos]

Brendan, just do whatever you can mate, normal rules dont apply to you

[TTT]

BoJangles, you should post up your bodyweight and lifts because the Glossbrenner calculator may favour you more

He did on the last page..

71kg 179cm

BP 120KG 1RM

DL 175KG 1RM

SQ 140KG 1RM

OP 75KG 1RM

Brendan - I'd say that you have the only valid reason this side of a paraplegic to not do leg work.

Chins, dips, bench, rows and you'll be right..

[markos]

BoJangles, those lifts are pretty good mate, but waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too skinny lol

Max is 86kg@173cm and he is trying to lift in the 100's next year

I know youre not interested in PL, but I can only imagine how skinny you are

Oh, and if you can MP 75kg@71kg, properly, thats a very impressive lift. If you could film it for me I would love that, motivate some of my lazy f**kers lol

[Mitcho_7]

What nasty ass surgeon decided it would be a brilliant solution to take your knees?

What happened to you?

[Birds]

Surgeon / loan shark, same thing.

[jangles]

BoJangles, those lifts are pretty good mate, but waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too skinny lol

Max is 86kg@173cm and he is trying to lift in the 100's next year

I know youre not interested in PL, but I can only imagine how skinny you are

Oh, and if you can MP 75kg@71kg, properly, thats a very impressive lift. If you could film it for me I would love that, motivate some of my lazy f**kers lol

I'm pretty lean, but that's what I set out to do and that's why I use the IF approach, lean muscle gains. I know I could increase body weight quite a bit, but at present it doesn't interest me looking big and not lifting big. Was only lifting for 5 months when achieving those

I haven't done 1rm on that weight for a while, stopped doing OP due to injury. In all honesty it wouldn't be impressive to view on video, I used a belt and I'm sure your lifters don't need motivation.

Edited October 26, 2012 by jangles