Skyline R32 Ls3 Drift Car

[Roy]

I dont know. I hate the fact that my car is turbo. Heat, lag and the cost of the bolt ons. Even my lowly RB20 has over 10k of bolt ons.

I like the idea of an alloy 8 up front...be interesting to see hwo well they work in an R32

[noisia]

i've always wanted to put a LS2 or plus engine in my 32. nothing would beat a 32 sideways up a track roaring whilst smoke pours from the rears

[JAS-25T]

BTW, push rods belong in suspension not engines.

As much as I love this conversion - That had to be quoted for the truth.

[Morten Kiil Finsaas]

Do you guys really think I am going to make a statement that I can't back up?

My own RB25DET 322rwkw standard internals, which last time I checked on the engine dyno was ~530 bhp which is more than 500.

The LS3 in a current Corvette (we have one for local racing evaluation) on the same dyno makes 294 rwkw, which is less than 322 rwkw

The 600 hp is an American dream.

Shall we move on to torque;

The LS3 shows 480 nm on the dyno, which equates pretty closely to the 550 nm as per the Corvette at the engine

The RB25DET shows 514 nm on the same dyno, which is more than 480 nm.

The killer is from 4250 rpm to 6750 rpm the RB25DET has more torque at every point.

This is real world stuff here, we are not playing with some American brochure designed to sell Corvettes to cowboys.

Cheers

Gary

First of all, if you have read this thread thou, I have not the standard Cam and heads, but performance cam and heads, but still standard internals. I do not have the dyno papers jet (They will come when the car has been on Dyno in January), but by only changing the heads and manifold, I have seen a Dyno paper on a Engine that produced 535HP here in norway, I do not remember the torque. The NM produced by the original Engine according to SAE measuring, and showed on the web pages of GMPerfomance.com is 584.76nm.

I would never use a brand new engine in a race car, too many casting and machining stresses still in the block, crank and heads. Give me some stress relieved engine parts that have done 100,000 k's or so, been hot and cold so many times there are no stresses left. Makes a far superior package in the build. Ditto gearbox cases and shafts.

If we applied an hourly rate to the work required to fit something that doesn't belong and compared it with the cost of bolts ons for an RB25DET, I know who will come out in front value for money wise. Don't try the "but he does it using his own labour, so it's free" rubbish. Nobody's time is free. If he worked overtime or got a second job, did the same hours and spent the money he earnt on an RB25DET it would piss all over the LS3.

Cheers

Gary

BTW, push rods belong in suspension not engines.

If you have a Standard R32, it would not be too much work setting in a LS1/LS2/LS3 engine, because you get new oil pan that fits S13/S14 and should fit R32/33/34 and engine and transmission mounts. Then it is just wire up the engine and start it.

A lot of this work Im doing on this car, is fixing after the last person who had the car, and even if I fitted a R25 engine I still would have had all this work.

Everyone is allowed to have there own oppinoin...

[BezerkR32]

it took me 6 hours to fabricate engine mounts and gerabox mount for my car. Engine in and mounted in one aftrenoon. 6 x $70 =$420. i charge more to replace manifold studs on a RB.

as for using second hand parts in a race engine, each to themselves.

I would never use a brand new engine in a race car, too many casting and machining stresses still in the block, crank and heads. Give me some stress relieved engine parts that have done 100,000 k's or so, been hot and cold so many times there are no stresses left. Makes a far superior package in the build. Ditto gearbox cases and shafts.

If we applied an hourly rate to the work required to fit something that doesn't belong and compared it with the cost of bolts ons for an RB25DET, I know who will come out in front value for money wise. Don't try the "but he does it using his own labour, so it's free" rubbish. Nobody's time is free. If he worked overtime or got a second job, did the same hours and spent the money he earnt on an RB25DET it would piss all over the LS3.

Cheers

Gary

BTW, push rods belong in suspension not engines.

Edited July 30, 2008 by BezerkR32

[BezerkR32]

Jas, forgett the fact that it is a chev, if it had have been a OHC nissan v8, what would the problem be then? When i spin this thing to 7500rpm, we will see if the pushrods cause any issues. This pushrod issue is bullshit. the old tecnology works. not as pretty, but it works. Ford tryed the OHC thing and have gone away from it.

As much as I love this conversion - That had to be quoted for the truth.

[JAS-25T]

It's cheap and nasty. I don't dislike the V8 idea, infact I love the all alloy V8's and the cheap power they provide, but OHC's have been around since what? the 1920's?

btw - Ford australia agree's with your....

Ford tryed the OHC thing and have gone away from it

comment.

it's actually DOHC

[Roy]

So many people get carried away with the pushrod argument. Personally i view it the same way as i view Porsches. Sure, plenty have proven mid engine is better, but Porsche has made the rear engined concept work. Chev have tried quad cam 32 valve 350 Chevs etc and they worked well, but were more expensive, wider and harder to package and the LT1 was easily able to be tuned to keep with the lod LT5.

So pushrods may not be the latest and greatest, but Chev have put the work into the head design to ensure they pack quite a punch.

I would love to think i could put a VH45 into a R32 as i would love a V8 in my R32. But no way i would want to be payign for 4 cams come upgrade time, custom pistons come time i want a tad more compression, porting an 32valve head that most people have never seen let alone touched.

Alloy Chev in a R32 is only beaten by a Judd powered R32 Time will tell, lets see how much coin i earn whilst working in 3rd world countries

[Drift Motorsport]

Great Build - Keep us all informed.

Who cares what everyone else thinks? Your money your build - fu.ck everyone else and their royal opinion!

BTW, we all want youtube videos of your car in action! How long before you finish the setup?

[2rismo]

You wouldn't use a brand new engine in a race car - he is.

He's not paying someone to work on the car - he is.

It truly and honestly doesn't matter one iota what you think about this project and to be honest, I'm a little surprised that you'd just come into a thread like this and shit all over it.

Not cool.

[2rismo]

As much as I love this conversion - That had to be quoted for the truth.

Top Fuel, Top Alcohol, Pro Stock, Top Doorslammer, V8 Supercar, NASCAR.

The end.

[Morten Kiil Finsaas]

Great Build - Keep us all informed.

Who cares what everyone else thinks? Your money your build - fu.ck everyone else and their royal opinion!

BTW, we all want youtube videos of your car in action! How long before you finish the setup?

Thanks!

I am hoping to have the car finished and in dyno in January/February.

When I have video of the car in action, I will upload it to YouTube and post it here.

[Sydneykid]

You wouldn't use a brand new engine in a race car - he is.

I simply gave my reasons for that logic, thinking perhaps that he and others hadn't considered the engineering facts. Maybe something was learnt, maybe he or someone else will consider things differently next time.

He's not paying someone to work on the car - he is.

Yes, but once again I simply pointed out that time is never free. Lot's of people don't consider the realities of the alternatives such as overtime or a second job. Time = money, it's a fact.

It truly and honestly doesn't matter one iota what you think about this project

I respect everyone's right to their own opinion and their right to voice it.

and to be honest, I'm a little surprised that you'd just come into a thread like this and shit all over it.

I don't think I shat all over anything, I simply pointed out the facts. Everybody else was dribbling on about how fantastic it was to put a 500 hp engine into an R32, I simply pointed out that it isn't such a big deal.

Not cool.

I did warn about perceived harshness in my first post. What would you prefer, only people with gushing positives post in every thread? Makes for a very boring SAU if there isn't alternative views put forward.

For Morten's benefit, I think you are doing a great job, I respect the amount of time and personal effort you able to devote to this project. I can only wish that I had the benefit of such an amount of spare time myself. My comments on the choices of hardware have absolutely nothing to do with your dedication, knowledge or workmanship. Good on you for attempting it, I applaud loudly anyone and everyone who has a go.

Some tips;

Have a good look at the sump, LS3's have oil surge problems in Corvettes used on the circuit and I am not sure if the sump you are using will suffice for drifting.

It will need an oil cooler, oil to air or oil to water. The LS series generates a lot of oil temperature with constant high rpm.

Keep the RHS exhaust away from the steering column, boiling power steering fluid is a problem.

If you are using rubber engine mounts, make sure you put a heat shield over them, we set fire to the LHS engine mount in the Corvette during testing.

In the Tremec gearbox, have you had the synchros upgraded? If not, be carefull with rapid upshifts, they lock in gear often due to over sellection.

On the subject of the gearbox, they suffer from overheating oil in a circuit environment, maybe shorter drift events won't be a problem. But it wall pay off to monitor the gearbox oil temperature closely.

kunnioittaa

Gary

[JAS-25T]

Top Fuel, Top Alcohol, Pro Stock, Top Doorslammer, V8 Supercar, NASCAR.

The end.

Some of the most boring kinds of motorsport, all followed by bogans.

No seriously, Like I said, I love the idea of an all alloy motor in this thing, and have full respect for a pushrod 6.3L truck motor going into this build.

[FineLine]

Some of the most boring kinds of motorsport, all followed by bogans.

No seriously, Like I said, I love the idea of an all alloy motor in this thing, and have full respect for a pushrod 6.3L truck motor going into this build.

Nothing on this planet could be more boring than the programme offered by cochrane at qr a couple of weekends ago.

40 grit sandpaper on a bare arse has more appeal than that shit.

[Morten Kiil Finsaas]

I simply gave my reasons for that logic, thinking perhaps that he and others hadn't considered the engineering facts. Maybe something was learnt, maybe he or someone else will consider things differently next time.

Yes, but once again I simply pointed out that time is never free. Lot's of people don't consider the realities of the alternatives such as overtime or a second job. Time = money, it's a fact.

I respect everyone's right to their own opinion and their right to voice it.

I don't think I shat all over anything, I simply pointed out the facts. Everybody else was dribbling on about how fantastic it was to put a 500 hp engine into an R32, I simply pointed out that it isn't such a big deal.

I did warn about perceived harshness in my first post. What would you prefer, only people with gushing positives post in every thread? Makes for a very boring SAU if there isn't alternative views put forward.

For Morten's benefit, I think you are doing a great job, I respect the amount of time and personal effort you able to devote to this project. I can only wish that I had the benefit of such an amount of spare time myself. My comments on the choices of hardware have absolutely nothing to do with your dedication, knowledge or workmanship. Good on you for attempting it, I applaud loudly anyone and everyone who has a go.

Some tips;

Have a good look at the sump, LS3's have oil surge problems in Corvettes used on the circuit and I am not sure if the sump you are using will suffice for drifting.

It will need an oil cooler, oil to air or oil to water. The LS series generates a lot of oil temperature with constant high rpm.

Keep the RHS exhaust away from the steering column, boiling power steering fluid is a problem.

If you are using rubber engine mounts, make sure you put a heat shield over them, we set fire to the LHS engine mount in the Corvette during testing.

In the Tremec gearbox, have you had the synchros upgraded? If not, be carefull with rapid upshifts, they lock in gear often due to over sellection.

On the subject of the gearbox, they suffer from overheating oil in a circuit environment, maybe shorter drift events won't be a problem. But it wall pay off to monitor the gearbox oil temperature closely.

kunnioittaa

Gary

As I stated earlier, everyone has their right for their own oppinion, and I appreciate all feedbaks I get even if not all are too positive. This helps me a lot in coice of parts and what to do with them.

As with the oil pan, I am placing a order for a racing oil pan, with front sump and oil baffle. As for oil cooler, I have looked into a Oilcooler, that is 15"x10.5" and fan on it.

I have not upgraded the syncros, but the transmission is brand new, and hoping that it will last one season, an then do a overhaul and upgrade on the transmission.

As for overheating, I am looking into how to mount a oil cooler on the transmission, I have found a 12V external oil pump and cooler, it just how to get the oil out of the transmission and back in.

But thanks for the input.

[Morten Kiil Finsaas]

Today, I managed to try the engine in the car. I found out that I need a new oil pan, or the engine is ending up way far back, as you can see on the picture below:

But the engine is not ending up that far in front either, as you can se on the pictures below. The engine is going down when I install the new oil pan on the engine.

(Picture is borrowed from Sikky Racing)

The oil pan above is the oil pan I am ordering.

I am also ordering a lot of parts from Summit Racing.

Radiator, Griffin, 27.5" length, 19" hight, 3.75" width

Flex-A-Lite Oil Cooler, 10.5"x15",4.25" including Fan

Earls Performance Oil Cooler (Transmission), 5.875"x13"x2"

Tilton Engineering 12V Oil Pump, 1-2GPM, 60psi

and some Steel Braided lines, and AN connectors. This is the shopping list for now, but can change, or things be added, but I think I remembered the most important things.

And here are some more pictures:

[JAS-25T]

Wow - you are ripping into it - well done.

[BezerkR32]

you think, hes going to finish before me. lol

Wow - you are ripping into it - well done.

[SmashBoxx]

Are you thinking of going forced induction with it eventually morten?