Na To Turbo Heart Break Or Hero?

[vorse]

hi guys looking for some opinions to help me make a decishion i have loved skylines for year and at the end of this year i will finally be able to get my first skyline but only an N/a due to restrictions on licencing do i start off with an na and build my way up doing suspenshion mods and minor perfomance or wait and get a factory turbo

TLDR p plate na modify and convert will i be disapoint with result?

[Grey]

NA skylines defs not worth it, i have one and kinda regret it, always wanting more power out of it wish i could have a turbo and run boost and keep increasing boost! i recommend if it's not urgent, get a R32 GTR or a R34 GTT and mod it up in your garage, strip it again and again understand it more, then once u hit your fulls just drive it everywhere knowing the car u know and understand inside and outside!

[foley]

hey mate years ago i bought a n/a from a deakership, but after purchusing i was informed that the n/a block wouldnt support a turbo even though they are same block....not sure if its a myth maybe u should think about doin what grey said or buy the n/a and buying gtst front cut to installl in it later

[Pezhead]

Have a chat to Aggroman (Dave). He took his NA 34 and when he got off his P's he did a turbo conversion with great results. Mind you, he's an absolute wiz with a wrench but worth have'n a chat to him.

[aussietroy]

due to the different compression between the turb and na engine to turbo it you would have to change the pistons to turbo ones. Ive read that you can use the n/a pistons but you can only boost it to the bare min.

I am in this situation too. i am throwing up doing a rb25det swap into my 32, a rb20det swap or just selling the car and buying a turbo after i get off my P's.

I am leaning towards selling it as its alot of work to get the N/a up to the same level as a stock standard turbo.

if i were you i would hold off and just buy a turbo, when they say N/a skylines are slow THEY MEAN IT !! haha

[Galois]

Half the na section is on this topic, and of the hundreds of people on here who have done the na+t conversion I have only read of very few who haven't regretted it after a few years. IF you're going to do all the work yourself it won't be too dramatically expensive, but it's still wasted money and effort compared to buying a factory turbo skyline. And it's no small job, the easiest option is to put an rb25det in the car and that involves changing the ecu (and wiring loom i believe?).

Also STRONGLY recommend a defensive drivers course if you're going to be driving a rwd with no traction control. There's really no downside to learning more techniques about safe driving, and you may have seen that there's plenty of accident damage on sau. It might seem like a waste of time to some people, but sometimes a split second is all you have in an emergency and if you don't react properly you could be wishing you'd taken that driving course while getting your car towed away... Or maybe just hoping you'll be able to walk again one day.

[Aggroman]

I didnt bother reading it all and CBF writing a massive essay so ill break it down

It can be done, its not hard at all

manifolds bolt up fine, dont need to change pistions thats crap.. Plenty of cars run 10:1 Comp

GTT aftermarket ECU's work, I run A PFC in mine. (secret quirrel trick to get rid of engine check light as GT's dont have traction control, dont know what that is? google it. Its what the stagea ppl do as they have hte same problem any good workshop cna do it). You can also run standard ECU with a piggyback to handle fuel etc like a Greddy Emanage Ultimate with the Ignition Harness thats sold seperately (required for r34 only)

The only parts that you cant get off the shelf are turbo water/oil lines they need to be custom (easy as) everything else matches up fine. except for a plazmaman plenum you will need GTT runners

So long as you have enough exhaust flow boost isnt an issue, Im pushing 250KW atm with standard motor, highflow turbo (at 14psi) and supporting mods and will be up to 300-350 with a turbo change.

Budget 4-5K if you are going to give it to a workshop to install and tune. Parts will set you back roughly 3.5K depending on computer choice.

The 25DE Neo motors are tough as nails so dont worry about throwing a rod unless you service your car poorly..

Wanna see how one goes? Come to the Texi in September and watch me..Or just look at my sig below

[blk94r33]

Do it.

Check out these two threads, might help you decide:

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/topic/33407-how-to-turbo-your-na/

http://www.skylinesaustralia.com/forums/topic/249186-nat-power-results-na-t-turbo-conversions-only/

I've done the same thing, and am very happy with the results.

Started out with a stock car, did all the suspension work, put in a good stereo which is a bit more of a hobby than anything, and heaps of other little bits and bobs along the way. Started prepping the car for the turbo conversion, decent wide tyres, adjustable bushes for good alignment, coils and plugs, changed all the filters etc. At that stage, it was a good fun car to drive, handled well and a good daily, just low power and a crap sound...

Did the conversion, ended up costing me around the $2k mark parts alone as i did all the work myself, apart from the $600 of that being custom intercooler piping to avoid cutting the engine bay at all.

Just got the exhaust done, fitted a boost controller (currently set to nothing until I can get the car on a dyno. Currently, the car's even/above par with a mates GTST on 10psi in terms of acceleration, having the turbo spool at 1500rpm, and now 5psi at 2200rpm is very street able.

You'll get alot of negative feed-back against this path, yet the only real downside is the 4 stud brakes/wheels, and the gearbox (depending on the car) that will hold you back. Realistically, not alot of GTST's have standard anything anymore, so why not do the basics while on your P's, and the power package later on?

No, it's not legal to convert it/drive it without an engineers certificate, yet neither is a GTST with a boost controller, FMIC, loud exhaust etc. etc.

WYTSKY DID hit the 295aw/kw mark, then de-tuned for safety, as Aggroman said, 250kw on 14psi, it's not like the engine is limited to any less that a low compression motor, PROVIDED you don't try to make 400hp out of $50, which applies for any performance car...

I think i'll shut up now...

[Pezhead]

Biggest thing about turbo motors and high compression is to keep the boost at a reasonable level. Low compression on turbo motors is to ensure there is no detonation.

As others have said high compression turbo motors will be more responsive up to a reasonable boost level and then detonation risk will prevent you from making more power.

So good fuel and good tune will keep you sorted.

[blk94r33]

Biggest thing about turbo motors and high compression is to keep the boost at a reasonable level. Low compression on turbo motors is to ensure there is no detonation.

As others have said high compression turbo motors will be more responsive up to a reasonable boost level and then detonation risk will prevent you from making more power.

So good fuel and good tune will keep you sorted.

+1

Realistically, it's not that much more expensive to get good DET power out of a DE+T, yet with more response and the power moved a bit to the left.

There are options to oppose detonation at higher boost levels. E85, decent inter-cooler, water-meth injection, but reliability, long-term effectiveness and cost are the factors.

[dori34]

mine lasted 1 year lol

crack the ringlands on piston #6, ran 1bar of boost.

but liek others have said, aggroman & wytsky have been running decent power on theirs with no issues.

[blk94r33]

mine lasted 1 year lol

crack the ringlands on piston #6, ran 1bar of boost.

but liek others have said, aggroman & wytsky have been running decent power on theirs with no issues.

1 bar is a fair bit through 10:1 compression, and a year isn't bad on an un-opened motor, but I bet you didn't regret a moment when it did go?

WYTSKY is running ~19psi from memory?

[SECURITY]

which make/model do you think of when i say UTE?

SS ute? xr ute? hilux?

so why not use the same principal when choosing a n/a car?

for me its honda integra/civic type r/s2000. not a skyline.

your re-sale will be much much better. when you're ready for a turbo car then go for a skyline. its not worth the $ converting if you cant do it yourself (brakes/rotors, ecu/tune, injectors/pump etc etc). its definitely not a case of just fitting a turbo and off you go.

[vorse]

thanks for all the replies guys it has given me alot of fuel for thought im hoping for an r34 thats the dream i can do the work myself borrow people garages as i dont have my own. really want a skyline love them to bits but i really dont want to be disapoint with the na and i do understand the amount of work ide be getting my self into goal, is about 220 as a daily, conservative i know but i dont wana break my babby .can i have recomendations for an na car ? thinkin about getin a mr2 ?? as theres one going cheapish in my area " lookin to get into the drift scene " as for commin to the texi i would love to sexy skylines every where sounds like a day in heaven

btw agroman that would be sick i love 34s yours looks mint man absouletly mint can i please have a ride shot gun ??? please???

[ydr030]

dude if u wanna drift DONT buy a mr2. Na s13 would be the go + u can always turbo the s13 later. my self i wouldnt bother with a na platform, unless u willing to spend sum cash, ie, they all get smaller brakes, smaller gearboxs, shit diffs etc.

[Aggroman]

So long as I'm not busy then no problem ur welcome for a ride or two

[vorse]

s13 as a practice car till i get the skyline and sweet best day ever run in a 34 best day ever

[scathing]

NA MR2s are slower than a wet week, and any mid-engined car is a pain in the backside to maintain. They look cool, though.

Nothing wrong with a DE+T as long as you're not chasing big power/boost. NA internals won't ultimately be able to handle the same cylinder pressures as FI ones (even taking the compression ratio out of the equation) but, as above, you'll still be making a fair amount of power before that becomes an issue. At the same time the lower weight internals and higher compression is going to improve efficiency and response.

Personally I'm all for a DE+T on a street car. On the street big power isn't usable that often, but being more fuel efficient and more responsive is something you can appreciate every day. If you're going to sink big bucks into it down the line to chase big power, even a stock DET is going to need to be cracked and brakes are going to require upgrades, so starting from a NA position becomes irrelevant.

As people have said, it is a good path to work through. Start NA and work on supporting mods (handling, driveline) so you can get used to the car and how to drive it, as well as prepping it for a big power increase, and do that last.

I had a MR2 that was built the other way (stock open diff, rubbish D2 coilovers, stock brakes, but big power) and the thing was exhilarating when you punched the throttle, but scary (in a bad way) when you tried to stop or turn. It's not something I care to repeat.

[bra0063]

what about an actual engine transplant my na r34 already has the gt-t brakes so all i would need is the drivetrain of a GT-T (when my one snaps lol ) i can get an NEO rb25det (including ecu, loom) for around $2000-2500 bucks im just wondering what else needs to be done?

i know buying a GT-T is a better option but i would like to work on an engine and learn how it works before i put it in my car (itll be out for around 2.5 years so hopefully i can mod it whislt its out of the car) then when im on my fulls bang it in.

Cheers,

[JDM34]

Why not just buy an R32 GTR or R33 GTR with a blown motor and rebuild it over two years?