Turbo Identification Help.

[trustr32]

Hey guys I just recently purchased some Garrett -5's for my GTR build and they have both come with different I'd tags. I'm not going to name who I got them from but I bought them under the pretence of them being brand new items that were ordered direct through Garrett by the distributer. Just wondering if anyone could help Id them to make sure they are indeed both new factory items. I have already rang GCG yesterday and they couldn't tell me much other than the model numbers are right but one tag didn't sound right. Both housings are the same and the wheels look the same but I just want to be 100% sure as I don't want to have any doubts after spending the better part of $15000 on a build. I'll put up some photo's when I get home tonight but the 2 tags are as follows

#1

NJ 0119J

GT2560R

707160-5

#2

707160-505S

109935-D

Any help is much appreciated

Cheers Brodie.

[GTScotT]

Are they both brand new or used?

And were they previously used together from new (if used) and do you have proof of this.

Do not mismatch units.. Do not even run one used one and one new one even if identical, no no no. Not on an expensive build.

If they are both new, and we can confirm the numbers relate to the same part THEN your fine. What I do know is that you will often get a turbo with a catalogue number instead of a part number, I have had a few.

[sucram]

#2

707160-505S

109935-D

Are you sure these numbers are correct?

[trustr32]

Are you sure these numbers are correct?

That's what I'm asking everyone on here. I know that they are the numbers that are on the id tag but I need to know if they are legit or whether it's a fake or reco or something. I was told when i questioned the dealer that they are probably 2 different batches but The first tag has "made in Japan" where the second one doesn't. I'll get photos up as soon as I get home.

[sucram]

2 different batches are possible, but not likely.

My bet is that they had 1 on the shelf.

They used a disco potatoe (for example) for the other, possbily needed to machine housings to suit. Since

the original tag would have said GT-RS/gt2871 etc they removed it, fitted a new one, stamped 707160-5 as

the part number. 05S might be a machining code or something and 109935-D is a serial/job number.

the gtr bolt on turbos are made in japan and are on the tags/box where the vast marjority of GT's come from mexico

What does the distributor say? If it came with a reciept and they are a genuine reseller I doubt you will have any problem with authenticity

[trustr32]

2 different batches are possible, but not likely.

My bet is that they had 1 on the shelf.

They used a disco potatoe (for example) for the other, possbily needed to machine housings to suit. Since

the original tag would have said GT-RS/gt2871 etc they removed it, fitted a new one, stamped 707160-5 as

the part number. 05S might be a machining code or something and 109935-D is a serial/job number.

the gtr bolt on turbos are made in japan and are on the tags/box where the vast marjority of GT's come from mexico

What does the distributor say? If it came with a reciept and they are a genuine reseller I doubt you will have any problem with authenticity

I asked the seller about it and he replied:

"The two different model numbers are simple one is the older stamping and ones the newer stamping..

These were sent straight out from Garrett as they had 2 left of these sitting on the shelf... They are also sold individually these turbos hence possibly why these two went in the same batch, i.e stampings...

However they are both 707160-5 turbos so there is no difference what so ever in the turbos..."

I dont think the seller is trying to do anything untowards otherwise he wouldn't have sent me anything at all but as mentioned once I've spent nearly 20 grand on everything I dont want Questions like this lurking in the back of my mind unanswered.

[R31Nismoid]

You missed one of the numbers in the first post... Hence people are confused.

Now we have the full number set... which is

707160-5005S

http://www.sonicperformance.com.au/Turbochargers/Garrett-GT-Ball-Bearing/GT28s/pl.php

Could well be old numbering, Garrett did alter it a while back. But when i say old - it must be 3-4 years at least.

My set of -5s were 18 months old when purchased them in Oct of last year. They had the new ID tag

[trustr32]

You missed one of the numbers in the first post... Hence people are confused.

Now we have the full number set... which is

707160-5005S

http://www.sonicperformance.com.au/Turbochargers/Garrett-GT-Ball-Bearing/GT28s/pl.php

Could well be old numbering, Garrett did alter it a while back. But when i say old - it must be 3-4 years at least.

My set of -5s were 18 months old when purchased them in Oct of last year. They had the new ID tag

Shit sorry about that. I didn't even think to read back through the numbers. So if it was old stock and new stock whats the difference? Only location that they were made or have they changed design slightly?

[Moodles2]

-5's used to be part of the GT2860 family, but recently Garrett decided to move them into the GT2560 family. the 500x thing is a new thing as well. My -9's (barely 8 months old) came labelled as 707160-5009.

[R31Nismoid]

Oh so its the other way around?

IE... New labelling that has the extra 4 digits?

Not many resellers have the 4 digit number ATM hence i might well be wrong with the above. Most resellers are still using the old "XXXXXXX-5" part number.

[Don Dada]

Both of those turbos are -5 units, and yes the newer units seem to come with the 4 digits after the dash with the last of the 4 being the actual part number the leading 3 being either 000 or 500

So the same unit could be a 707160 - 5 .... 707160 - 5005 .... or 707160 - 0005

The problem now comes in with the "S"

According to garrett the "S" versions flow a little different to their counterparts >>>quote

"S" = used for units which require some differentiation from units in the same family

Compare a GT2860R to a GT2860RS. While both are ball bearing and externally similar, the GT2860RS is better suited for higher-flow applications than the GT2860R. In this case, the S reflects the higher-flowing nature of the GT2860RS

Now this (gt2860rs disco potato) is the only unit listed on garrett site with the "S" in the part number, the -5,-7 both GT2860R dont have the "S" attached on the site, but the question really is if indeed it is just a new labelling system where they add the "S" or is there actually a difference in the actual flow of the unit ???

I asked this same question a while back about the -9 / -1 as my supplier had one in stock which he got from garrett a couple of mths ago (GT2859R - 780371 - 5001) and had to order another but garrett said they only had the GT2859R - 780371 - 5001S available...The supplier used the same info on the invoice from the unit he already had to order the new unit so i'm still waiting to see what arrives

or....and the unit he has now does not have the "S" on the id tag but there is one on the part number on the original garrett box, same, and vice versa for a few other tubs including a gt30r and gt42r he has in stock as well....but thats just a mass produced box so still no confirmation......

[trustr32]

Ok so where does this leave me now? How can I confirm that (if we assume the "s" is just part of the new labelling system) that they are indeed the same turbo's with the same housings/wheels/cartridges and flow exactly the same?

[R31Nismoid]

Measure the wheels is the only way.

Honestly I cannot see them being any different what so ever as the cartridge will still be the same.

It's just a re-branding. I'm not sure about all this "S" business as the S was never on the actual ID tag/part number. It was just a part of the frame/family name (id 2860RS).

[Don Dada]

Yea.... the "S" in the case of the Gt2860RS is in the model number itself and not the turbo part number, but as you said once the cartridge number is the same the wheel size,trim etc. will be exact.

But....the cartridge number in the case of the -5 (446179-51) is not on the id plates to confirm such....if it was, there would be no worries.

Are we to assume that once it has that 707160 - 5 on the id plate whether with or without the "S" the cartridge number will automatically be exactly the same???

[R31Nismoid]

Are we to assume that once it has that 707160 - 5 on the id plate whether with or without the "S" the cartridge number will automatically be exactly the same???

This is the million dollar question

Need to get a Garrett Distro to confirm 110% i think.

[trustr32]

This is the million dollar question

Need to get a Garrett Distro to confirm 110% i think.

Ok well can anyone recommend someone to call that knows what their talking about? The bloke from GCG was a bit like "well you didn't buy them from us so.... That's what you get" sort of attitude which doesnt help much. How do I measure the wheels if it involves pulling the housings apart while I might be competent I'm not really confident.

[Don Dada]

Can you guys confirm that with gcg or some garrett dist up there???....Pretty pls???.....

Where i'm from it useless...my guy thinks the -9 units I ordered are -7

[Don Dada]

^^^^In before me....

I'm not sure if measuring up the wheels would tell the whole story.....Yes you would get the overall inducer and exducer diameter but what about the other wheel design factors that can make it flow differently?

I think you can calculate the trim by measuring also? ....

[discopotato03]

Two ways to measure .

1) This needs some care . Take a set of inside calipers and adjust the feet out to the diameter of the compressor housings snout - the parallel section between where the blades are . Don't damage the blades .

Then measure this distance , across the calipers feet with a vernier caliper .

Actually don't even need the vernier because the measured diameter will be the same if the turbos are the same .

2) Remove the compressor housings and measure/compare .

If you know a bit of the background about Garrett GT BB turbos and specifically RB26 spec ones you can just about go through a process of elimination .

First look at and count the turbine blades which should be either 9 or 11 . Measure the exducer diameter with inside calipers as mentioned above .

The 11 bladed turbine is unique meaning no trim variations . AFAIK only RB26 HKS2510s used this turbine though some have suggested R34 BB turbos have them , did they have ceramic turbines like OE bush GTR turbos ?

If the turbines are 9 bladed they come in two trims ie 62 and 76 , the big trim ones were used in 2530s and the Garrett marketed version plus GTR spec GTRS/AKA GT2871Rs .

The smaller trim one comes in the RB26 spec GTSS/GT2859R/707160-9 and the Garrett marketed version .

I don't think you'd miss differences comparing two turbines or their compressor wheels . If everything looks the same ie blade style/count/profile measure the dimensions of the housings where they live and if everything comes up the same its looks waddles quacks duck situation mostly .

If you had the housings off you could CAREFULLY trial fit them to the opposite numbers cartridge and if they are right all the clearances will be the same .

A .

[Don Dada]

Did you measure them up Trustr32?