Invoice And Receipts

[vdub]

Excuse my ignorance but I recently had work done on my car.

They supplied me with a invoice of all the parts and cost.

However they gave me no receipts of the parts they brought.

should I go back and get the receipts? or just getting the invoice the norm?

[34GeeTeeTee]

Excuse my ignorance but I recently had work done on my car.

They supplied me with a invoice of all the parts and cost.

However they gave me no receipts of the parts they brought.

should I go back and get the receipts? or just getting the invoice the norm?

You get an invoice and that is it! The parts they buy at trade and then sell to you at a nominated price! It is normal workshop practice.

[GTR-N1]

Yes, there's no onus on the workshop to furnish you with the prices it paid for those parts.

If you've asked for an "Itemised Receipt", the workshop must list off the retail price for each part and the cost of labour (with ABN and GST).

You see, sometimes a workshop might negotiate a large-quantity buy on certain items; but it's up to the workshop to decide to pass on a saving to the consumer or not.

On the other hand, if you took your itemised receipt to some competitor to then find that one part was exorbitant, you'd have a case to go back to the original workshop and ask for a 'please explain'.

[mad082]

Yeah you don't get a receipt for parts they bought and paid for, just your invoice from the workshop. Just like how if you buy your groceries from coles you don't also get a copy of their invoice from where they buy the stuff from.

Most workshops will get stuff at trade price and then charge you a bit more for it, which they are entitled to do, just like any business that buys products from another company, wholesaler, importer out manufacturer will charge you more than what they paid. They are a business, they are there to make money, and they don't charge you for the time they spend ringing around for the parts or going to pick them up, so it's only reasonable to make a few dollars on products.

[StevenCJR31]

^^ and some workshops put a very large markup on the parts that they buy, even tho the parts get delivered free

one mechanic i used to use would not put a markup on the parts he ordered , the five mins he was on the phone was easily covered by the extra business his cheap rates generated

[Sinista32]

Some shops make a reasonable profit by adding a small margin. Other shops make an obscene profit.

Always best to ring around.

Shops that gouge are normally the ones who wont/don't like you supplying new parts. They will say there is no warranty.

Fortunately they are wrong. New parts carry manufactures warranty and the garage must warrant their workmanship.

The difference is if they supply the parts, and the parts are faulty, they chase the supplier/manufacture up.

Example:

$1350 clutch the manufacturer sells to a wholesaler. (Materials, wages and profit)

The wholesaler sells it for $1500 to the Garage. ($150 bucks for the supplier/middleman)

The Garage sells for $2300, and then adds $1000 labour.

$800 gouge on the clutch and $500 gouge on the effort.

So always best to ring around.

Always good to know the price of the parts.

Yes: as said above. Shops will only give invoices and not their buy prices.

This is as it should be otherwise the consumer would see the transperancy and make a judgement call on what is fair and reasonable profit.

Edited June 28, 2013 by Sinista32

[luke gtr]

all the above is correct.

keep in mind.....

I have worked on cars with owners who supply their own parts because they can get them 10-20 bucks cheaper.

they werent too happy paying double labour when the part fitted was incorrect.

have also charged others for hoist down time, whilst they reorganised the correct or missing part.

those people also not happy.

ended up costing more than the entire job would have.

some parts(if sold at RRP as they should), workshops make very little out of.

some, there is more 'meat' for them.

all comes down to the workshop and supplier.

[mad082]

Some shops make a reasonable profit by adding a small margin. Other shops make an obscene profit.

Always best to ring around.

Shops that gouge are normally the ones who wont/don't like you supplying new parts. They will say there is no warranty.

Fortunately they are wrong. New parts carry manufactures warranty and the garage must warrant their workmanship.

The difference is if they supply the parts, and the parts are faulty, they chase the supplier/manufacture up.

Example:

$1350 clutch the manufacturer sells to a wholesaler. (Materials, wages and profit)

The wholesaler sells it for $1500 to the Garage. ($150 bucks for the supplier/middleman)

The Garage sells for $2300, and then adds $1000 labour.

$800 gouge on the clutch and $500 gouge on the effort.

So always best to ring around.

Always good to know the price of the parts.

Yes: as said above. Shops will only give invoices and not their buy prices.

This is as it should be otherwise the consumer would see the transperancy and make a judgement call on what is fair and reasonable profit.

sure there is a warranty on all new parts, but if the part fails because it is faulty and you supplied the part to the mechanic to fit, then you have no warranty through the workshop. you have to take up the warranty claim with where you bought the item and then the workshop is fully within its rights to charge you again for fitting (which they are technically able to do if they supply the part as well, but most won't excercise this right).

and yeah, many workshops increase the labour charge if you supply the parts. i know we do at work. and i've also had many instances where the customer has bought the parts from online and they were the wrong parts. one customer asked us what he needed so he could buy it online (and get the parts about 10% cheaper than what we would sell them for). we told him. he still bought the wrong part. we told him it was wrong, he sent it back and got the right part. except he hadn't listened to what we said and just ordered the same part again. we ended up getting in the parts to make it work, which ended up costing him more than what he was initially saving, and taking about 2 weeks longer than if we had got them for him.

and how much profit a workshop decides to put on parts is purely up to them. if they want to put on bigger margins then that is purely their decision. in the same way that some workshops will charge hourly rates that are much higher than others. there are plenty of variables that they may be using to justify this, such as rent or even just having a wider range of tools or diagnostic equipment that they can use on your vehicle.

[Sinista32]

Just reading both posts above to see if what I said was in disagreement. I don't think so - although you've expanded on a shops point of view further. Which provides a balance.

I'm not saying I agree with customers supplying parts. It's always best for ALL involved if the shop supplies the parts.

True

- "how much profit a workshop decides to put on parts is purely up to them".

- "some workshops will charge hourly rates that are much higher than others"

Bottom line:

Get a quote and if your happy book your car in. If your not take it somewhere else.

Quality and trustworthy shops get repeat business, also get new business from word of mouth.

I know where I take my cars are a bit more expensive, and I'm ok with the that. The outcome is worth it.

However, I don't like getting screwed over. Nobody does.

[GTRKat]

I don't think there's any one answer when it comes to supplying your own parts. I guess it depends on a lot of things including the relationship you have with your workshop.

Sometimes the guys will tell me the part number to see if I can source it myself as it saves their time and I can often get it cheaper. Othertimes they do it. Sometimes when there's not much difference I prefer to throw it their way so they make something of it.

Back to OP what all these guys are saying is spot on. Best thing to do is make sure you get really clear quotes before you get started to avoid nasty surprises.

[GTR-N1]

^^^ Last paragraph is tops

[luke gtr]

Bottom line:

Get a quote and if your happy book your car in. If your not take it somewhere else.

Quality and trustworthy shops get repeat business, also get new business from word of mouth.

sums it up very nicely.

on a side note, some shops may want you to supply specific parts they may not be able to source easily.

[MBS206]

Yes, there's no onus on the workshop to furnish you with the prices it paid for those parts.

If you've asked for an "Itemised Receipt", the workshop must list off the retail price for each part and the cost of labour (with ABN and GST).

You see, sometimes a workshop might negotiate a large-quantity buy on certain items; but it's up to the workshop to decide to pass on a saving to the consumer or not.

On the other hand, if you took your itemised receipt to some competitor to then find that one part was exorbitant, you'd have a case to go back to the original workshop and ask for a 'please explain'.

And if I was that workshop and you asked the question after the fact, my explanation would be "Because that's the price you were quoted and agreed to"

Ask the workshop to explain the price BEFORE you get the work done, not after the fact.

I laugh at most of my clients who come in claiming they can get it else where cheaper... My normal response is "Well go on, do it". I then get to sit there and laugh when they stuff it all up as everyone else had mentioned earlier.

[Redline_GTR]

sums it up very nicely.

on a side note, some shops may want you to supply specific parts they may not be able to source easily.

This!

And also the fact they will be at least honest with you rather than just letting you pay any price is a bonus as well.

Would rather work with someone honest and genuinely interested rather than chasing a quick buck.

[C4a0s]

hey guys...just wondering

so most workshops charge by the hour and will give u a quote before starting the job, like say changing a clutch? what if they quoted 3 hours and it took 4? would they charge u more after its done?

[Charles89]

Quote should be the exact amount they charge you, an estimate is a rough ballpark figure that can change after the job.

That's why you should always get a written quote. And if they were to charge more than that, they will need to notify you before continuing with the job..

[GTR-N1]

^^^ and knowing this beforehand makes it more imperative to "not change your mind" in the middle of the job; or the quote will go wobbly.

For instance, any builder must stick to a quote from the ground up (after excavations costs are settled). But if you change this or that, a quote can going wayward unless quote B is fixed and simply an add-on to quote A - and as Charles says, "in writing"

[badben]

As a tradesman, I'm shocked to hear some machanics increase their labour rates based on the fact the customer brings there own parts. I know my mechanic doesn't, though being a perforance shop the hourly rate is soild to start with but so is the quality of the workmanship. As an electrician, if we increased our rate based on the fact the client supplied there own light fittings or switch boards they'd just laugh. The hourly rate set should cover the cost of running the business.

Op as many have said you'll never receive an itemised bill as all trade based businesses buy wholesale and sell retail. Get a quality mechanic, one that has transparency in it rates.

Edited July 3, 2013 by badben

[mad082]

We only increase our rates if someone brings in a whole heap of parts they bought online, not just the odd part, or if the job is to purely fit the parts they brought in. But we predominantly a retail business, so the workshop side of things isn't the core of the business, but it still has to pay for itself or I don't have a job. We have a job in at the moment where the customer bought all off the parts online. Absolutely everything. A few thousand dollars worth in total. He even rang up a wholesaler directly to get parts, then just had them sent directly to us. One of the parts he got was wrong, so I then had to spend a while chasing up something that would make it work (the wrong part was from China, bought off ebay). He also wanted progress photos to put on his blog. And should there be any warranty issues I'm sure he'll be expecting us to cover it.

[Birds]

OP, you have a single invoice because when your mechanic supplies parts, and you have a problem that is fault of the parts or his labour, you take your car to him and he will sort everything out for you including chasing up suppliers of said parts. A lot of people like to save money by supplying their own parts...as experiences in this thread detail, this doesn't always work out so well. It also gives the workshop a blurred line to work with if they want to get out of blame for faulty workmanship because this can be very difficult to prove. So consider the gamble.

^^ and some workshops put a very large markup on the parts that they buy, even tho the parts get delivered free

one mechanic i used to use would not put a markup on the parts he ordered , the five mins he was on the phone was easily covered by the extra business his cheap rates generated

And rightly so. They can put 200% margin on parts for all I care. Simple equation here:

If you are happy paying the quoted price, go with them.

If you aren't happy paying the quoted price, don't go with them, unless you have no choice because they have a niche market and you're open to an ass ramming.

The dissonance in these situations is usually caused by lazy customers who want to spend as little money as possible and do as little work as possible. The two don't mix. If you can't be fked putting in the research to find out if you're getting a good deal or ripped off, then you are more susceptible to the latter and probably shouldn't whinge about it when it happens. If you're such a tight ass that you can't stand your mechanic earning $10 on a part, that's the gamble you take that you may have to deal with the manufacturer and any likelihood that you bought the wrong part.

And if I was that workshop and you asked the question after the fact, my explanation would be "Because that's the price you were quoted and agreed to"

Ask the workshop to explain the price BEFORE you get the work done, not after the fact.

I laugh at most of my clients who come in claiming they can get it else where cheaper... My normal response is "Well go on, do it". I then get to sit there and laugh when they stuff it all up as everyone else had mentioned earlier.

Bingo. Ahhh f**k the number of times I had people call up after giving us the go ahead or the job was already 75% complete: "My friend reckons you're charging too much labour for this." or "This other workshop I spoke to (who would have no hidden agenda AT ALL) said they could have done the job for cheaper, you should match their price." Oh shit, don't get me started on dumb customers...there are infinitely more stupid customers than there are rip off mechanics. It's a numbers game.

As a tradesman, I'm shocked to hear some machanics increase their labour rates based on the fact the customer brings there own parts. I know my mechanic doesn't, though being a perforance shop the hourly rate is soild to start with but so is the quality of the workmanship. As an electrician, if we increased our rate based on the fact the client supplied there own light fittings or switch boards they'd just laugh. The hourly rate set should cover the cost of running the business.

Op as many have said you'll never receive an itemised bill as all trade based businesses buy wholesale and sell retail. Get a quality mechanic, one that has transparency in it rates.

Automotive trade isn't like the electrical trade. When you have companies offering bare bones servicing for $80 because they hire apprentices to do everything and use cheap shit, you can't afford to throw high labour costs in a customer's face unless you have a niche or a big reputation for quality work and a lot of loyal customers. You have to make the money somewhere...this usually comes from parts, because the part suppliers support their biggest customers (workshops) with trade prices. Better it come from the parts anyway...if the profit is in the labour, where's the incentive to get the job done in a timely manner?