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Jun 2.7l Stroker Build Underway (hks T04z)

StageZilla

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Sydneykid Grand Master

Sydneykid

Posted
Posted

It is quite common for people to change the oil as well as the filter after 20 minutes or so of first running. This is not an opinion I agree with.

The filter change is quite logical, there is always the chance of some machinings being left from the build and they can block the oil filter which them is bypassed ie; no filtering. So it's a good idea with sound supporting logic.

However I can't see the logic in changing the oil. There are 3 reasons why you change oil;

1. It's gets dirty from cleaning the engine (the detergent part of the oil mixture). But a brand new engine isn't dirty to start with, it might have some left over machinings, but it isn't dirty. So the oil is not going to need changing for that reason.

2. The oil picks up contaminents from the combustion process. But 20 minutes of fast idling isn't going to contaminate the oil to any noticeable extent. So the oil is not going to need changing for that reason.

3. The lubricating capability of the oil is smashed out of it by high rpm, heavy combustion pressures, many heat cycles and a breakdown of its molecular structure due to the passage time. But 20 minutes of fast idling isn't going to damage the oil in that fashion. So the oil is not going to need changing for that reason.

I have heard guys say they change the oil because it might be contaminated by leaks (water or fuel) from a faulty assembly process. That's not a reason for blindly changing the oil, it may in fact cover up the problem. When I remove the oil filter I always cut it open and have a look at the contents. The oil floats on any coolant and fuel smells, so it is very easy to spot. If I detect a possible problem, I fix that problem, then change the oil. Simplistically changing the oil achieves nothing.

So I see no logical reason to change something that doesn't need changing.

:( cheers :)

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Beer Baron Grand Master

Beer Baron

Posted
Posted

all the nissan filters i've used said made in japan.

i always used to use genuine nissan filters, but now use nismo (veruspeed), Trust, Sard and Power Enterprise. Mainly because i get them fairly cheap when i'm in japan and they look wanky on my remote filter mount.

if i didnt have access to those japanese brands cheaply i would stick with the nissan filters.

Mik Experienced

Mik

Posted
Posted
It is quite common for people to change the oil as well as the filter after 20 minutes or so of first running. This is not an opinion I agree with.

The filter change is quite logical, there is always the chance of some machinings being left from the build and they can block the oil filter which them is bypassed ie; no filtering. So it's a good idea with sound supporting logic.

However I can't see the logic in changing the oil. There are 3 reasons why you change oil;

1. It's gets dirty from cleaning the engine (the detergent part of the oil mixture). But a brand new engine isn't dirty to start with, it might have some left over machinings, but it isn't dirty. So the oil is not going to need changing for that reason.

2. The oil picks up contaminents from the combustion process. But 20 minutes of fast idling isn't going to contaminate the oil to any noticeable extent. So the oil is not going to need changing for that reason.

3. The lubricating capability of the oil is smashed out of it by high rpm, heavy combustion pressures, many heat cycles and a breakdown of its molecular structure due to the passage time. But 20 minutes of fast idling isn't going to damage the oil in that fashion. So the oil is not going to need changing for that reason.

I have heard guys say they change the oil because it might be contaminated by leaks (water or fuel) from a faulty assembly process. That's not a reason for blindly changing the oil, it may in fact cover up the problem. When I remove the oil filter I always cut it open and have a look at the contents. The oil floats on any coolant and fuel smells, so it is very easy to spot. If I detect a possible problem, I fix that problem, then change the oil. Simplistically changing the oil achieves nothing.

So I see no logical reason to change something that doesn't need changing.

:happy: cheers :P

One reason for changing the oil after a few kays I guess is too remove any traces of friction modifiers in the oil from any assembly lubes used.

Beer Baron Grand Master

Beer Baron

Posted
Posted
More details please

:happy: cheers :P

i can answer this one without even knowing the exact case i reckon.

incorrectly sized, or poorly made aftermarket filter was used. it fell off. engine rapidly pumped it's oil out. motor failed. bearing damage. possibly more damage if bearing damage and lack of oil pressure alarms bells not heeded. heard it many times. it's a bitch.

Sydneykid Grand Master

Sydneykid

Posted
Posted
One reason for changing the oil after a few kays I guess is too remove any traces of friction modifiers in the oil from any assembly lubes used.

That's a point, we only use the runnng in oil (Castrol GTX) as the assembly lubricant in an RB engine. But that's not always the case with other engines, for example, on push rod V8's it is not uncommon for the camshaft manufacturer to supply some assembly lubricant.

:happy: cheers :P

Sydneykid Grand Master

Sydneykid

Posted
Posted
i can answer this one without even knowing the exact case i reckon.

incorrectly sized, or poorly made aftermarket filter was used. it fell off. engine rapidly pumped it's oil out. motor failed. bearing damage. possibly more damage if bearing damage and lack of oil pressure alarms bells not heeded. heard it many times. it's a bitch.

If it was bad enough to fall off, surely you would notice it during the fitting process. Or it would leak/weap before it fell off and you would notice that. The problem with coming from a race environment, we would never fit an oil filter without inspecting it comparing it to the one being replaced and then lock wiring it so it can't come loose. It's just one of those things that is always done.

On an RB, the oil pressure sensor is at the oil filter, any leak and the dash light is on instantly. I have seen a Mitsubishi genuine oil filter packed in the wrong box, fit that to the engine and you would be in deep doodoo. Fortunately it was noticed at the time of fitting. So going OEM doesn't always guarantee a perfect result every time either.

:P cheers :P

Guest Mashrock

Guest Mashrock

Posted
Posted
More details please

:P cheers :P

smaller sized filter

had about 500-1000 on clock since changed

the one morning it decided to spin off. and in a matter of seconds, without notice

oil drained from motor and didnt take long for him to cease up..

and then begun my gti-r saga.

Col-GTSX Grand Master

Col-GTSX

Posted
Posted

Not to hassle you guys but can we get back to topic for a second...

Whats going on with the tune???

Has it finally hit the dyno???

Im like sitting on the edge of my seat every night waiting....

I assume that there is either a hold up with the ecu wiring or you are too busy driving it round everywhere...

CruiseLiner Mentor

CruiseLiner

Posted
Posted
Not to hassle you guys but can we get back to topic for a second...

Whats going on with the tune???

Has it finally hit the dyno???

Im like sitting on the edge of my seat every night waiting....

I assume that there is either a hold up with the ecu wiring or you are too busy driving it round everywhere...

hey mate well lets just say a few little problems with the wiring, and it will be running very very soon, early next week i hope :(

pure_methamphetamachine Collaborator

pure_methamphetamachine

Posted
Posted

Hey mate, just a quick few things in my opinion:

I have a 260RS with a T04z turbo as well. One of the biggest things is place additional heat shielding down the passenger side suspension tower. I have the one that came in the kit (goes from the suspension tower to the firewall. I had to place more along the tower.) If you have any wire there, it will melt. Also run it by your ABS pump. Even if there is no wire by the susp tower, run the shielding anyway. The heat from the turbo will burn the paint over time.

One 1/4 mile run and you won't be able to touch the tower it will be that hot. Also after a medium highway drive you get the same heat in/on the tower.

Change your wastgate lines to braided, and put heat tubing over it, as well as the oil feed line as it will be damn close to the extractor manifold.

When I ran my engine in, I used mineral oil for 5000km, changing every 1000km, then use Castrol 10W60, changing every 2500km with Ryco filter.

Nice job though. Seriously impressed.

Chris Wilson Proficient

Chris Wilson

Posted
Posted
Hey mate, just a quick few things in my opinion:

I have a 260RS with a T04z turbo as well. One of the biggest things is place additional heat shielding down the passenger side suspension tower. I have the one that came in the kit (goes from the suspension tower to the firewall. I had to place more along the tower.) If you have any wire there, it will melt. Also run it by your ABS pump. Even if there is no wire by the susp tower, run the shielding anyway. The heat from the turbo will burn the paint over time.

One 1/4 mile run and you won't be able to touch the tower it will be that hot. Also after a medium highway drive you get the same heat in/on the tower.

Change your wastgate lines to braided, and put heat tubing over it, as well as the oil feed line as it will be damn close to the extractor manifold.

When I ran my engine in, I used mineral oil for 5000km, changing every 1000km, then use Castrol 10W60, changing every 2500km with Ryco filter.

Nice job though. Seriously impressed.

Agreed, it NEEDS a proper thermal blanket on the turbine houing AND aditional heat shiledling for the manifold, wastegate and downpipe. On track days that set up WILL melt all sorts of stuff, guaranteed, and probably in hard toad usage, too. Be glad it's not a rotary turbo, they are a nightmare to heat shiled...:P

CruiseLiner Mentor

CruiseLiner

Posted
Posted

hey guys well finally i dont have to dribble shit and say its nearly running, cause today it got tuned and revlimit of 4k rpm for the run in, and she runs absolutely sweet as, sounds real lumpy, and i cant wait to put some more boost into it.

just got to pull the gearbox out soon as its whinning its head off and gotta check whats the problem. besides that no trouble at all.

made a whopping 130rwhp at just under 4k rpm, and around 5psi of boost at the same rpm, so its gonna haul awesome without much lag :) starts making boost at just over 2k rpm

good times ahead for a change :P

thanks alot to everyone who has helped and especially sydneykid answering my pm's every second day almost with detailed informative replies.

cheers again :happy:

Brad

pnblight Mentor

pnblight

Posted
Posted
hey guys well finally i dont have to dribble shit and say its nearly running, cause today it got tuned and revlimit of 4k rpm for the run in, and she runs absolutely sweet as, sounds real lumpy, and i cant wait to put some more boost into it.

just got to pull the gearbox out soon as its whinning its head off and gotta check whats the problem. besides that no trouble at all.

made a whopping 130rwhp at just under 4k rpm, and around 5psi of boost at the same rpm, so its gonna haul awesome without much lag :( starts making boost at just over 2k rpm

good times ahead for a change :O

thanks alot to everyone who has helped and especially sydneykid answering my pm's every second day almost with detailed informative replies.

cheers again :D

Brad

Great to hear Brad,

Have fun running it in and dont baby it, it needs good varying load to bed in properly but i'm sure you guys got that cover if the rest of the car is anything to good by great job. When do you plan to up the limiter and tune and are you still using the dyno we talked about?

pete

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