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Any1 Instald Gas Injection, Wat R Pros & Cons Please

RS444

By RS444,
in Four Door Family & Wagoneers

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MANWHORE Grand Master

MANWHORE

Posted
Posted

I've got gas injection on my stagea.

The cons are:

1. I have a big tank in the boot between the strut towers (non spare tyre tank).

2. It doesn't drive as nice on gas as petrol when it's still warming up (when warm, it's hard to tell the difference).

The pro is LPG is cheaper than petrol. But, when you factor in that the car uses more lpg than petrol, the price difference is not what you see at the pump.

So all in all, it does save money, but you won't be cutting your fuel bill in half or anything.

kidafa Veteran

kidafa

Posted
Posted
sausage fuel (LPG) should be left for the bbq

Nice opinion dude.

Couple of stags with it in Aus. I cant remember users name but they dont have dual fuel and the gas tank and filler is in identical spots to petrol set up, puts out more power than it does on fuel too.

samuri Rising Star

samuri

Posted
Posted
I've got gas injection on my stagea.

The cons are:

1. I have a big tank in the boot between the strut towers (non spare tyre tank).

2. It doesn't drive as nice on gas as petrol when it's still warming up (when warm, it's hard to tell the difference).

The pro is LPG is cheaper than petrol. But, when you factor in that the car uses more lpg than petrol, the price difference is not what you see at the pump.

So all in all, it does save money, but you won't be cutting your fuel bill in half or anything.

Hey Manwhore,

I am ito looking at LPG in a stagea very seriously.Do you have sequential vapour Injection or liquid injection with your LPG set up?

Were you able to get a donut tank to fit the rear wheel area?They hold a few hundred km but for my application thats ok.

SVI uses about 15% or a little more from my research but how I read your post suggests its alot more for the stagea, or am I inferring too much.

Liquid Injection is the way to go but it seems to me many installers are comfortable with SVI and perhaps dont have the skills to install Liquid injection.What figures per 100Km or $ per km do you have when you run petrol and when you run LPG.

Relating how much you get per tank isnt so informative so a specfic figure would be great.

look at the flippant remarks by others about LPG as they will no doubt have done a lot of research into it :)

Big Jim Enthusiast

Big Jim

Posted
Posted
Nice opinion dude.

Couple of stags with it in Aus. I cant remember users name but they dont have dual fuel and the gas tank and filler is in identical spots to petrol set up, puts out more power than it does on fuel too.

In my time as a mechanic i have see to many vehicles do the head gaskets after about a year or two

must have something to do with the extra heat in the combustion chamber i think

  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...
pixel8r Mentor

pixel8r

Posted
Posted

I was recently looking at switching back to a s2 C34 and getting a lpg conversion. My other option was a ford falcon wagon (I was looking at cutting costs and really it is just a daily runaround). What I figured out was that when you work out ALL of the ownership costs, there wasn't a whole lot of difference between owning a ford falcon BF wagon on PETROL than a C34 on lpg.

Obviously not everyone wants to drive a ford though...

Other things I found out are:

* at about 20,000 kms a year the lpg system would take more than 2 years to pay itself off, and that's assuming nothing goes wrong. Remember that due to the faster burning nature of LPG (and inefficiencies of current LPG systems, not including liquid injection) you only really get a maximum of 30% savings, at best.

* LPG can be prone to cold start issues (as in taking a few more seconds to start) and also problems fueling up if the tank is hot (ie. in summer).

* You lose a lot of boot space (unless you go with a dedicated lpg system - in which case you better hope the install was done well), making the point of owning a wagon somewhat moot.

* I wasn't sure of a LPG installer who would know how to tune it properly or who would know what they were doing on a stagea.

* With dual fuel you still need to run some petrol through every now and then. You dont want the petrol in your tank to go stale either...so if you're doing a tank of petrol every month that further offsets any savings.

At the end of the day, if you think you'll be keeping your car for more than 50,000kms, then you'll probably at least break even, if nothing goes wrong with the system. If you keep it longer than that you'll start to genuinely save money...but in my case I'd be saving a maximum of about $20 a week. I could just as easily save $20 a week some other way and have a lot less headache and a car that runs perfect on the fuel it was designed to use.

Sorry for my bias showing through...I've looked into it a few times, and it always seems like the best way is to buy a car that is already converted and has evidence of running well. Other than that, the car runs great on petrol. It does cost about $30 more a week to own than a ford falcon but its also a much nicer/better car than a falcon.

iamhe77 Grand Master

iamhe77

Posted
Posted (edited)
i was garenteed no powewr loss, nuthing about fancy pigy backs, nuthin abnout starting ruff,,?

that'll be a liquid injection system then.

At the moment (still) they are only a "duel fuel" setup... sorta as they can't get it working on startup (the lpg evaporates in the lines I am told).

LiLPG systems will run just fine off your OEM ECU without a piggyback and will return very similar economy number to PULP (around 5% difference).

Of course, being that LPG has a higher RON than PULP, if you can have it tuned you will see more power.

Once they figure out a way to have a standalone LiLPG setup, I will be waiting in line to have my current fuel system replaced :P .... but that seems an age away :)

Edited by iamhe77
samuri Rising Star

samuri

Posted
Posted
that'll be a liquid injection system then.

At the moment (still) they are only a "duel fuel" setup... sorta as they can't get it working on startup (the lpg evaporates in the lines I am told).

LiLPG systems will run just fine off your OEM ECU without a piggyback and will return very similar economy number to PULP (around 5% difference).

Of course, being that LPG has a higher RON than PULP, if you can have it tuned you will see more power.

Once they figure out a way to have a standalone LiLPG setup, I will be waiting in line to have my current fuel system replaced :ermm: .... but that seems an age away :D

Australianwarehouse the distributor of JTG direct injection inform me it takes about 40 hours

to get the car set up properly, their employee someone who is very good and that is there

deducted job day in and day out .

They then are confident to sell the system to the installer.

This was very disappointing to hear if I am the only 2002 stagea series 1 owner

wanting to go direct injection.

JTG or the installer wont spend those hours on me unless there is a more

substantial return from other stagea owners.

Emery Injectors for a system supplied by Australianwarehouse using SVI looks

like the way I will reluctantly go but am waiting on more information to be supplied.

The sales rep was very excited about this particular system but then again that's his job.

Also look at aluminum tank construction if space is a concern.

iamhe77 Grand Master

iamhe77

Posted
Posted (edited)

Really?

Odd, I was quote "roughly" $5k by Australian LPG Warehouse in Frankston (same place you contacted) for a custom system in my 2001 M35 Stagea.

Won't be going ahead... if I am spending $5k (after govt rebate) on an LiLPG system, it better be a dedicated system which replaces my existing fuels system and includes a custom tank to replace the standard tank (I would like to keep the spare wheel).

Edited by iamhe77
  • 2 weeks later...
RS444 Enthusiast

RS444

Posted
  • Author
Posted

I WAS QUOTED $4-4.5K - GOV REBATES FOR A DUEL FUEL MULTI INJECT POINT SYSTEM, WITH TANK BETWEEN REAR TOWERS, AND A PIGY BAK COMP BUT I WAS TOLD MY STAG COMP IS THE MOST USELESS AND PAINFUL TO CUSTOMISE OR PIGY BAK .......................

LPG IS A HIER RON SO I WILL HAV MORE HP BUT USES MORE THAN PETROLIUM LETRE FOR LETRE BUT OF COURSE HALF THE PRICE !!! SO WHAT DO WE DO ???

iamhe77 Grand Master

iamhe77

Posted
Posted (edited)
I WAS QUOTED $4-4.5K - GOV REBATES FOR A DUEL FUEL MULTI INJECT POINT SYSTEM, WITH TANK BETWEEN REAR TOWERS, AND A PIGY BAK COMP BUT I WAS TOLD MY STAG COMP IS THE MOST USELESS AND PAINFUL TO CUSTOMISE OR PIGY BAK .......................

LPG IS A HIER RON SO I WILL HAV MORE HP BUT USES MORE THAN PETROLIUM LETRE FOR LETRE BUT OF COURSE HALF THE PRICE !!! SO WHAT DO WE DO ???

No need to yell :P

Can't you organise for a Nistune instead?

LPG economy is only significantly worse than PULP if you are talking about the vapour injections systems.

If you go with a Liquid Injection LPG system, you won't need a piggyback and you won't have crap fuel economy.... but you can't have a standalone LPG system either - it requires PULP on startup then changes over automatically.

Edited by iamhe77
  • 8 months later...
Galois Veteran

Galois

Posted
Posted

that'll be a liquid injection system then.

At the moment (still) they are only a "duel fuel" setup... sorta as they can't get it working on startup (the lpg evaporates in the lines I am told).

LiLPG systems will run just fine off your OEM ECU without a piggyback and will return very similar economy number to PULP (around 5% difference).

Of course, being that LPG has a higher RON than PULP, if you can have it tuned you will see more power.

Once they figure out a way to have a standalone LiLPG setup, I will be waiting in line to have my current fuel system replaced :P .... but that seems an age away :)

These guys have a stand alone system now

http://www.lpgli.com/features.html

Sage222 Rising Star

Sage222

Posted
Posted

got mine LiLPG setup on my 03.. love it. $4700 - $1500 from the rebate. took a week to install.. went from approx 14L per 100 to 17L per 100.. power gains of about 10%.. (would be much better with a tune) i run factory ECU.. and dump pipe thats it.. and runs even better on pure propane. :)

got it installed at Seaview Gas Conversions in frankston VIC.

only negatives is only 300k's out of the tank.. and i have to wait about 30 seconds before nailing it after starting the car up :) dont want to put your foot down to far on petrol as gas is colder temp and higher octane petrol will ping pretty badly.

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