M35 Stagea Vs Ve Sportwagon

[pixel8r]

http://www.testdrivenau.co.cc/?p=553

I'm guessing the M35 they tested was slightly modified - as is visible by the non-standard exhaust and rims.

However going by the comments made regarding turbo noise, I'd say the turbo itself was the factory item. This also means that boost is likely to be unmodified and therefore there is no reason to believe there are any other modifications to the engine/driveline.

Some impressive performance stats, but it still leaves me wondering - because I doubt very much my (stock) M35 would come close...

[Angus Smart]

13.5 quarter? anyone taken the m35 out before??

i might have to try this later on with a gps job

[Angus Smart]

And they got a non thirsty stagea???

[kidafa]

Nice find

Posts on wall of mates FB with a VE wagon

[FR33K]

This ones not to bad either

http://www.testdrivenau.co.cc/?cat=16

[iamhe77]

http://www.testdrivenau.co.cc/?p=553

I'm guessing the M35 they tested was slightly modified - as is visible by the non-standard exhaust and rims.

However going by the comments made regarding turbo noise, I'd say the turbo itself was the factory item. This also means that boost is likely to be unmodified and therefore there is no reason to believe there are any other modifications to the engine/driveline.

Some impressive performance stats, but it still leaves me wondering - because I doubt very much my (stock) M35 would come close...

Nice read, Steve. Thanks.

Dunno about how factual the 0-100 times are for the Stag... with a standard turbo.

Just so as you know, my high flow makes the same loud noise as the stock one did when I first bought it, so it could be running something not-entirely OE.

Stock M35 v VE SS not even close? I think that perhaps you need to play a bit more... Pretty damn close in stock trim.

Oh, and it is a Kakimoto exhaust in case you were wondering

[pixel8r]

Nice read, Steve. Thanks.

Dunno about how factual the 0-100 times are for the Stag... with a standard turbo.

Just so as you know, my high flow makes the same loud noise as the stock one did when I first bought it, so it could be running something not-entirely OE.

Ok - there you go. I wouldn't be surprised if it was modified - 5.6sec 0-100km seems a little low for me.

Stock M35 v VE SS not even close? I think that perhaps you need to play a bit more... Pretty damn close in stock trim.

Oh, and it is a Kakimoto exhaust in case you were wondering

Maybe I'm just not familiar with the VE SS? The thing is the new sportwagon with the V6 SIDI (wondering if holden know of anything other than "spark ignition" but we'll let them think they have something special) has similar specs on paper to the M35...but it's heavier. A guy at work here who has one proudly asked me the specs of my M35 and became a little less enthusiastic thereafter...still, in the mind of the average holden enthusiast - 4 extra kw means the holden is faster right?

I'd agree with all the comments made regarding ride & handling, the M35 really does drive so much nicer than any other wagon I've ever been in. I'm willing to bet that if the M35 was sold here locally it would be more often compared with the likes of VW, Subaru, Audi, BMW than Ford/Holden.

[iamhe77]

<snip>

I'm willing to bet that if the M35 was sold here locally it would be more often compared with the likes of VW, Subaru, Audi, BMW than Ford/Holden.

and rightfully so

[Jetwreck]

BS....I've driven one....the VE would eat a standard M35.......may not in the wet....but around somewhere like Eastern Creek the VE would be GONE!!!!!!......the only stag the would give it a run is a standard RS260

but for 55K on the VE!!!!....you'd have a lot of spare cash for mods on an M35!!!!

Problem #1 - 180km limiter!

Problem #2 - brakes are alot better on the VE

Problem #3 - 6 years difference in tech

Problem #4 - Our auto gearbox is shit....FULLSTOP!

Problem #5 - well the list would go on

[nickcorr]

Our 8 year old cars still have more tech than a new GM...

Cruse control with distance sensors anyone... Factory reversing Cameras... Proper Factory Sat Nav... Part time AWD...

And our 5-speed gearbox wipes the floor with the 6-speed in the Commodores.. Unlike the Ford 6-speed, which is also used by Jag and BMW, the unit used by GM feels like it is from a decade ago..

Don't know about yours, but part throttle changes are so smooth on my ARX... Even full throttle changes are nicely controlled, with engine and transmission speaking to each other fluently.

Problem #3 - 6 years difference in tech

Problem #4 - Our auto gearbox is shit....FULLSTOP!

[66yostagea]

Stagea, S1, S2 or M35 must surely be the best bang for your buck

[pixel8r]

Problem #1 - 180km limiter!

Not a big deal on a road car - that review never mentioned racing on a circuit

Problem #3 - 6 years difference in tech

Haha, yeah, but the other way...

Find me something any Holden has that Nissan or some other Jap manufacturer didn't invent in the 90's.

Problem #4 - Our auto gearbox is shit....FULLSTOP!

agreed...but is the VE one better?

Problem #5 - well the list would go on

Yep, such as:

* no awd (= traction issues in the wet that gets worse the more torque you have)

* no climate control

* lack of boot space (the review says it has more but I disagree - the M35 has loads of room under the boot as well as the full use of all boot space to the roof due to the rear boot shape).

* fuel usage

* no turbo

* excessive price

I've been through this exercise many times, especially when deciding on the M35 vs another car. No other car can offer ALL of the features of the M35 (or C34 for that matter) at anywhere near the price.

[lilcrash]

ok now for the person who thinks that a ve wagopn is anywhere near the speed of the stag. fair wnough i have never driven a m35 but i have a series 2 rs4s. i went and test drove a ve ss 6 speed, it had previously belonged to the owner of the car yard, he had fitted a chip, exhasust, suspension (and wheels but not power/handling improvement). it basically comes down to it feels like a stag before boost comes on, i just sat there waiting for the power to come and it never did. also i think its sad when you have to drop from 6th to 3rd at 100 just to over take. (my wife has a 6 speed zzt231r celica and it effortless overtakes in a quick drop to 5th for the average knob and 4th if you are beside a teenager/hoon who wantys to give a quick squirt as you overtake)

at the end of the day the ve is the same shit enigne they built 50 years ago just bigger.

edit:- and yes the stag boot is bigger then the ve boot (he tried to use the fact that its got a roll out cover as a selling point)

[Jetwreck]

ok now for the person who thinks that a ve wagopn is anywhere near the speed of the stag. fair wnough i have never driven a m35 but i have a series 2 rs4s. i went and test drove a ve ss 6 speed, it had previously belonged to the owner of the car yard, he had fitted a chip, exhasust, suspension (and wheels but not power/handling improvement). it basically comes down to it feels like a stag before boost comes on, i just sat there waiting for the power to come and it never did. also i think its sad when you have to drop from 6th to 3rd at 100 just to over take. (my wife has a 6 speed zzt231r celica and it effortless overtakes in a quick drop to 5th for the average knob and 4th if you are beside a teenager/hoon who wantys to give a quick squirt as you overtake)

at the end of the day the ve is the same shit enigne they built 50 years ago just bigger.

edit:- and yes the stag boot is bigger then the ve boot (he tried to use the fact that its got a roll out cover as a selling point)

Really

So your rs4 is standard too?

If you think I am a fan of the VE your are seriously mistaken....fact is fact....it is a quicker car than ANY standard Stag....C34 or M35....like I said the only car that would give it a is the rs260. If your to compare a 2002 model Holden with a 2002 Stagea you are right though.

[Iron Chef]

lol sorry I know you guys are died-in-the-wool Stagea nuts, but anyone who seriously thinks a stock M35 would keep up with a current model SS in a straight line has their hand on it. I love M35s but please, take your blinkers off.

[pixel8r]

Really

So your rs4 is standard too?

If you think I am a fan of the VE your are seriously mistaken....fact is fact....it is a quicker car than ANY standard Stag....C34 or M35....like I said the only car that would give it a is the rs260. If your to compare a 2002 model Holden with a 2002 Stagea you are right though.

Surely the 14sec 1/4 is slow for the V8 though...because the M35 realistically can do just below 7sec 0-100 and just under 15 sec down the 1/4 mile - which is pretty good if you consider the M35 is running about half the displacement of the V8 (even if you factor in boost).

I think a fairer comparison would be the new 3.6L SIDI VE wagon. Still way more expensive, although if you wait 6-8 years it may be around the same price as our stags on the 2nd hand market.

M35 2.5T = 206(+)kw @ 6400rpm & 407N-m @ 3200rpm - 1680kg = 122.6 kw/tonne

VE 3.6L = 210kw @ 6400rpm & 350N-m @ 2900rpm - 1767kg = 118.8 kw/tonne

Another interesting one (even though we cant get it here) is the VQ30DD (direct injection) model.

M35 3L DI = 190kw @ 6400rpm & 324N-m @ 3600rpm

VE 3.0L DI = 190kw @ 6700rpm & 290N-m @ 2900rpm

Who said 6 years newer tech? the M35 3L direct injection came out in 2001 with the same power (at lower revs) and more torque than the VE in 2009. Fuel economy in this model M35 is also very good. One owner on here was getting less than 10L/100km in city driving alone - whereas the 3L VE is listed as 12L/100km. I cant compare the "ADR combined" fuel economy figure because the M35 doesn't have one.

[iamhe77]

Haha, yeah, but the other way...

Find me something any Holden has that Nissan or some other Jap manufacturer didn't invent in the 90's.

DSC?

lol sorry I know you guys are died-in-the-wool Stagea nuts, but anyone who seriously thinks a stock M35 would keep up with a current model SS in a straight line has their hand on it. I love M35s but please, take your blinkers off.

Having driven both, I would agree.... depending on your definition of keeping up.

Being that I got into it with a VE SS when my M35 was stock, I can say that whilst the SS DID slowly creep away above a certain speed, it certainly did not walk away.

Yes it was dry and yes it was a straight line.... and yes, it was with a test vehicle down near Koo Wee Rup (suburb near Lang Lang).

Still seem to think that perhaps Kamikazee had an influencing hand in that writeup... perhaps to sell more M35's?

No way can they do 0-100 in 5.6secs with just a cat-back. No. Way.

[scotty nm35]

It could if you put smaller tyres on it. Looks to me like the wheels are a lot smaller than stock which would give the impression on the speedo you were going a lot faster, and also help lower the gear ratio a bit.

[pixel8r]

It could if you put smaller tyres on it. Looks to me like the wheels are a lot smaller than stock which would give the impression on the speedo you were going a lot faster, and also help lower the gear ratio a bit.

You raise a valid point. My speedo is out by around 7% so that when it says 100 I'm actually only doing about 93. I wonder if they factored that kind of thing into their timing. Smaller wheels would exaggerate this even further...

[Tangles]

I'll take you all on